DLKAPA From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 2436 times:
I have been confused... I just looked at the DEN website, and found a little surprise I have not seen before in the list. It seems that JetBlue will be starting or has already started service into Denver.
Here is my question: Have they already started service, or will it be soon? I couldn't find any dates on either the B6 or the DEN website for when it would start, nor could I find any pics in the A.net db.
LH423 From Canada, joined Jul 1999, 6501 posts, RR: 55 Reply 1, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 2404 times:
Well, if they haven't already, they will have B6 service in January as they're starting service from BOS. I don't know however, if they have any other cities, although it would seem strange if they didn't considering JFK is they're main operating base and that most cities in their network at served from JFK.
LH423
« On ne voit bien qu'avec le cœur. L'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux » Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
USAFHummer From United States of America, joined May 2000, 10685 posts, RR: 54 Reply 4, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 2359 times:
The reason you dont find pics in the a.net database is cause the flight times at DEN are not conducive to photography...it gets in and leaves at night...
Greg
Chief A.net college football stadium self-pic guru
BA From United States of America, joined May 2000, 11135 posts, RR: 61 Reply 8, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 2209 times:
DLKAPA,
Yes, Frontier does the check-in for Jetblue and even the maintenance and catering.
Regards
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
F9Widebody From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 1604 posts, RR: 11 Reply 9, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 2188 times:
I really wish they would start a flight between DEN and LGB. That would be so nice for connections along the west coast.
STT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16261 posts, RR: 52 Reply 10, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 2158 times:
They have one daily flight between JFK and Denver, red eye.
BA From United States of America, joined May 2000, 11135 posts, RR: 61 Reply 11, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 2126 times:
And one daily flight between BOS and Denver....
Regards
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
Flyguy1 From United States of America, joined Jun 1999, 1691 posts, RR: 4 Reply 12, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 2099 times:
I am curious as to when/if B6 will ever add more flights from DEN-JFK?
MSYtristar From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 6242 posts, RR: 51 Reply 13, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 2091 times:
DEN, SEA, and MSY all have just one flight to JFK. This has to change sooner or later.
Flyguy1 From United States of America, joined Jun 1999, 1691 posts, RR: 4 Reply 14, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 2062 times:
MSY I would think could support at least 2 JFK flights per-day. At one time there was at least.
JBLUA320 From United States of America, joined May 2002, 3160 posts, RR: 21 Reply 15, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 1968 times:
MSY used to have 2, and I think that its quite likely once some more A320's arrive that we could see 2 flights again...
Airwarrior From United States of America, joined May 2001, 123 posts, RR: 0 Reply 16, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 1946 times:
I just flew DEN-JFK this week. It was JetBlue employees checking us in, not Frontier.
Gigneil From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 16215 posts, RR: 88 Reply 17, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 1916 times:
I just flew DEN-JFK this week. It was JetBlue employees checking us in, not Frontier.
Perhaps wolves in sheep's clothing?
Frequently outsourced staff still dresses in the colors of the contractee.
Goingboeing From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4875 posts, RR: 19 Reply 18, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 1900 times:
DEN, SEA, and MSY all have just one flight to JFK. This has to change sooner or later.
Ah...this is where it gets interesting. As has been mentioned on another thread - Jetblue stock is priced for perfection - and part of that perfection is 85+% load factors. It's pretty easy to get a high load factor when you only operate one flight per day. The more flights you add, the lower your load factor can become. Even just a second flight (during the day) may pull a lot of the passengers off the redeye. And you're average load factor can go down. I dunno....JetBlue may be a fine airline - they don't serve my city, so I couldn't tell you. But looking at if from an investment point of view - I think there's a lot of smoke and mirrors there. When they introduce the secondary fleet of 190's (200 of them!) and start serving cities, it'll be interesting to watch - because the stock price has factored in 85+% load factors. What will the investment community think when they see that number begin to fall?
DCA-ROCguy From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 4402 posts, RR: 37 Reply 20, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 1830 times:
When they introduce the secondary fleet of 190's (200 of them!) and start serving cities, it'll be interesting to watch - because the stock price has factored in 85+% load factors. What will the investment community think when they see that number begin to fall?
Did JetBlue "factor in" 85 percent load factors to the stock price they started trading at, or did Wall Street "factor them in," whatever that means? It's not like a corporation autonomously decides exactly at what levels the market will trade its stock on an ongoing basis. That term is very fuzzy and needs explanation.
Neeleman & Co. are extremely smart managers, and it's hard to imagine them expecting 85 percent load factors forever. (Does WestJet get that? Did it the whole time Neeleman was there?) Nor is B6 likely planning to run toehold levels of service at places like DEN forever. One redeye gets an airline established in a longish domestic coach route like JFK-DEN. It's not a permanent plan for an airline that, as Neeleman has said from day one, plans to be at over 400 a/c in less than ten years.
JetBlue may need to add frequencies to DEN sooner than they expected though, since Cartel giant United can snap its fingers and have forty Ted A320's to throw around wherever they want. JetBlue may soon find themselves facing two or three Ted A320's on JFK-DEN that are *not* redeyes, and have to defend the route.
JetBlue is no smoke, no mirrors, just a solidly planned corporation with proven winners at the helm.
Ops48 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 64 posts, RR: 0 Reply 21, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 1825 times:
Beginning December 20th, Jetblue will be moving from A31 to A33 and A35 at DEN. They will have two late night flights on the ground in Denver at the same time. They will also begin ticketing at the Integrated desk on that same day as well. There will be temporary Jetblue podiums at the gates until the CUTE system comes online.
Goingboeing From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4875 posts, RR: 19 Reply 22, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 1713 times:
Did JetBlue "factor in" 85 percent load factors to the stock price they started trading at, or did Wall Street "factor them in," whatever that means? It's not like a corporation autonomously decides exactly at what levels the market will trade its stock on an ongoing basis. That term is very fuzzy and needs explanation.
IMHO, JetBlues stock price has been determined by all the good news, among those, one of the highest average load factors in the industry. These load factors were achieved by flying 1.) between the two largest cities in the USA with a rather limited number of flights and 2). From one of the largest cities in the USA to one if that states most popular vacations spots. The market has determined the stock price based on a very rosy past picture, and when wall street determines something based on past performance, you'd better believe that if load factor numbers drop, the "investors" on the street will punish the stock. Just look at the impact that the announcement that yields would not meet expectation, and they would be significantly lower than the previous quarter's numbers. THAT is what I mean by "priced for perfection" - It is extremely sensative to any news, good or bad. FWIW - after the announcement of the 190's, Wall Streets initial reaction was not good. It's gone up since them, but the next bit of bad news caused a very large downturn.
Neeleman & Co. are extremely smart managers, and it's hard to imagine them expecting 85 percent load factors forever. (Does WestJet get that? Did it the whole time Neeleman was there?) Nor is B6 likely planning to run toehold levels of service at places like DEN forever. One redeye gets an airline established in a longish domestic coach route like JFK-DEN. It's not a permanent plan for an airline that, as Neeleman has said from day one, plans to be at over 400 a/c in less than ten years.
Neeleman may not expect that, but he'd best be telling Wall Street TODAY that 85% load factors should not be expected as the airline grows, because Wall Street sure expects them. Neeleman also has a track record of leaving airlines once he's grown them or sold them. As young as JetBlue is, and as fast as their stock has risen, should he leave, the stock will get punished pretty hard - everybody was concerned when Kelleher stepped back at SWA, but he was in place for 30 years. Neeleman hasn't demonstrated that he's willing or able to stay with one airline for that long.
JetBlue may need to add frequencies to DEN sooner than they expected though, since Cartel giant United can snap its fingers and have forty Ted A320's to throw around wherever they want. JetBlue may soon find themselves facing two or three Ted A320's on JFK-DEN that are *not* redeyes, and have to defend the route.
And JetBlue's yields were down because of "low fares after the California fires" - I'm still trying to figure that one out. What will happen should TED invade DEN-JFK with daylight flights - introducing low fare competition on a route that hasn't had much? IMHO, TED's a joke, but should they start competing on JFK-DEN, and JetBlue responds, it's going to have a just as negative effect on their bottom line as TED's will on UAL's bottom line. Low yields are not what Wall Street wants to see.
JetBlue is no smoke, no mirrors, just a solidly planned corporation with proven winners at the helm.
Usually I agree with what you say, but I still have a "gut feeling" that JetBlue really is a lot of smoke and mirrors. Right now, they get exceptional press because they are located in Wall STreets back yard - the home town lowfare carrier. Everybody points to LUV's market cap to argue why that stock is overpriced - but I don't think LUV's market cap was anywhere near JetBlue's when LUV had but 40 planes. Irrational exuberance, I believe that they call it. No doubt that they had a lot of money to get started, no doubt that Neeleman know how to start an airline (as I said, he also knows how to sell them). And talk of 400 planes in less than 10 years - sorry, but that sounds a bit "People's Expressish" to me - even the grandaddy of the LCC's in the US doesn't have 400 planes after 30 years.
Mariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 22719 posts, RR: 88 Reply 23, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 1667 times:
Um - call me dumb (many have) but if JetBlue wanted to expand at Denver - what would they use for gates?
It's taken a major ruckus for Frontier to get a few more gates at DEN. And you can be fairly certain that the incumbents aren't going to welcome an expansion by JetBlue with open arms:
"Here, use some of our gates?" I don't think so.
Nor is Denver in a mood to build any more, given the expenditures they are presently facing with the new F9 gates and the expansion for UAL at Terminal B.
DLKAPA From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 24, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 1645 times:
If Frontier and JetBlue Codeshare, (don't call me stupid I'm just not sure if they do or not), then frontier could "lend" a couple of gates and all of a sudden United has to compete with Two big LCC's instead of just one.
DLKAPA
25 Dinker225: What is the CUTE system? Havn't heard of it. Dinker
26 DCA-ROCguy: Irrational exuberance, I believe that they call it. No doubt that they had a lot of money to get started, no doubt that Neeleman know how to start an
27 Ops48: CUTE stands for Common Use Terminal Equipment. It is a system that allows software from multiple airlines to run through a single network. This allows
28 Mariner: Um - I thought George Soros sold the majority of his JetBlue stake a few weeks ago - I know he sold a very big bunch of shares. Luckily for him, he go
29 Rjpieces: One of the reasons the stock price lurched downwards was because he sold his stock!
30 Mariner: RJpieces: That post is (a) funny and (b) possibly truthful. I guess the question is: what did Soros know - and when did he know it? cheers mariner
31 DLKAPA: He is like the Martha Stewart of the Aviation Industry. DLKAPA
32 Sllevin: New York City is completely unique on the East Coast, as Burr understood; far and away the biggest O & D market, something upon which LCC's are much m
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