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Question On Foreign Regs?  
User currently offlineCBPhoto From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1570 posts, RR: 6
Posted (10 years 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 1904 times:

Hey People,
Question regarding foreign registration numbers. Why is it that Sun Country airlines (for example) can use a leased aircraft in the US whiles still wearing a Dutch registration number, yet manufactures have to include a registration number of that particular country whiles doing test flights. For eg. if Boeing were doing test flights with a KLM 777 they would have a US reg number temporally until the aircraft was delivered? See where I am coming from????
If need clarification , please let me know
Cyrus


ETOPS: Engines Turning or Passengers Swimming
10 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineRiverVisualNYC From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 930 posts, RR: 3
Reply 1, posted (10 years 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 1896 times:

Cyrus I asked a similar question a while back, didn't get a really satisfactory response, so I hope this thread does better. I was specifically asking about the Irish registered US Air Commuter Dash 8s, but the Sun Country deal sounds like the same thing. Trying to figure out who the governing authority is and what the crewing requirements are...

User currently offlineCBPhoto From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1570 posts, RR: 6
Reply 2, posted (10 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 1836 times:

RiverVisualNYC seems you are right, does anyone have an answer to this????


ETOPS: Engines Turning or Passengers Swimming
User currently offlineLastBaron From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 290 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (10 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 1822 times:

Could wet leasing/leasing provider's nationality have anything to do with this?

User currently offlineRiverVisualNYC From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 930 posts, RR: 3
Reply 4, posted (10 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 1815 times:

I am sure it has to do with leasing, but I just wonder the way things are in America right now, wouldn't people be worried about flying a foreign registered, foreign owned aircraft on a domestic flight nominally operated by a US carrier, especially as the legalities in the event of an incident don't seem to be clear-cut as it would be if it was a US owned, registered and operated aircraft.....

User currently offlineOlympus69 From Canada, joined Jun 2002, 1737 posts, RR: 7
Reply 5, posted (10 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1799 times:

I'm only guessing at this, but the use of a manufacturer's registration on new planes may have something to do with certificates of airworthiness. Possibly a plane being exported, to Spain for example, may not get a Spanish C of A until it has been formally accepted by the purchaser - even though it may have already been assigned an EC-xxx registration. In Canada, this reg. will be painted on the plane, with one of the reg's assigned to say, Bombardier, taped over the top of it. I expect a similar system is used by Boeing.

User currently offline411A From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 1826 posts, RR: 8
Reply 6, posted (10 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 1764 times:

IF the aircraft in question is foreign registered, and operated by a US airline, an interchange arrangement is entered into whereby the US operator has operating control, provides maintenance, and the crew that fly the aircraft do so with a license validation issued by the civil aviation regulatory authority of the country of registration.

In addition, if a US registered aircraft is operated by a foreign aircarrier (for example, a US registered B747, leased to Singapore Airlines), the foreign pilots are issued an FAA Airline Transport license, with the following limitation noted...'valid only while operating Nxxxx, leased to Singapore Airlines Ltd.'

Hope this answers your question.


User currently offlineCBPhoto From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1570 posts, RR: 6
Reply 7, posted (10 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 1744 times:

Hey thanks a lot for the replies, definatly clears it up for me!!


ETOPS: Engines Turning or Passengers Swimming
User currently offlineRiverVisualNYC From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 930 posts, RR: 3
Reply 8, posted (10 years 11 months 2 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 1718 times:

411A
That does explain alot. If it's all pretty much interchangeable, then what stops a US-based airline from registering all its planes in some other country where the various related fees might be cheaper? Essentially the cruise ship industry does this today, registering ships that are marketed in the US and that sail from US ports in places like Panama, Liberia, and the Bahamas to save money. Why can't airlines do the same?


User currently offline411A From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 1826 posts, RR: 8
Reply 9, posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 1658 times:

Because the FAA says they cannot.
Using foreign registered aircraft for operation with US certificated aircarriers are approved on a one by one basis, and for limited time periods.


User currently offlineTrident From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2000, 484 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 1624 times:

A civil aircraft must have a Certificate of Airworthiness to enable it to fly. Foreign aircraft can fly in another country's airspace only if they have a valid Certificate. Leased aircraft often retain the registration of their original owner, whether it be a leasing company or an overseas airline.

Here in the UK we've had the situation of cargo companies operating Russian aircraft (Antonov 124s and Ilyusin Il-76s mainly) and these aircraft having to retain their Russian registrations, even if they were painted up in the full colours of the British operator. This is entirely down to the fact that these aircraft have not been tested by the UK certification authority (the CAA) and are therfore not eligible to carry a UK registration.

Manufacturers retain ownership of their aircraft until formal hand over contracts have been signed. That is why they carry the national ID of the manufacturing companies until formal hand over.


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