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What Would Make AA #1 Again?  
User currently offlineAirlinebiznut From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 82 posts, RR: 1
Posted (10 years 11 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 5125 times:

I have posted a couple of items relating to employee discontent at AA. I will tell you it started with the disappointment we saw the passengers experience with our overall service. We are very proud when a passenger likes the service at AA and we want those feelings to return. Management always tells us what the passenger values...but this information usually conflicts with what we hear from the passenger. Example: We love to give a passenger a full can of soda if they would like it, but AA tells us this is not to be done. (By the way, we still come back to offer additional services where flight times warrant, so this is not a tactic to avoid working)

Do you want:
*IFE?
*Clean Planes?
*Better Frequent Flier Rules?
*More Self Service Options (Issue your own upgrade at concourse stationed Self Service Kiosks)?
*Mini, pay per visit Admirals Clubs in more terminals?

I would like to know what would make AA #1 again in your eyes. I would really appreciate your comments as I think AA needs to know AND the dedicated employees value your DIRECT, UNPROCESSED information!

Happy travels.

[Edited 2003-12-31 18:27:35]

[Edited 2003-12-31 18:30:14]

44 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinePlanemaker From Tuvalu, joined Aug 2003, 6362 posts, RR: 34
Reply 1, posted (10 years 11 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 5057 times:

I don't think that AA can be #1 again due to the value proposition of the legacy carriers. Passengers want and expect the impossible from the 'legacy' carriers, the same service of old - free meals, free drinks, and convenient flight frequencies, but at an airfare that matches the LCC's. It is a double standard but it is not going to go away.



Nationalism is an infantile disease. It is the measles of mankind. - A. Einstein
User currently offlineYanksn4 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1404 posts, RR: 12
Reply 2, posted (10 years 11 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 5058 times:


Here are some things I think AA could do to be back at the top.

1. use bigger planes on routes like ORD to LGA, SFO to ORD and other long routes.

2. maybe install a directv system like Jet Blue or Frontier. This has made these two airlines become stronger with more frequent flyers.

3. make connecting easier like not making passengers go from Den to Dfw then to Ord just to get to LGA.

These are just my opinions and maybe others have better ones.



2013 Airports: EWR, JFK, LGA, LIS, AGP, DEN, GIG, RGN, BKK, LHR, FRA, LAX, SYD, PER, MEL, MCO, MIA, PEK, IAH
User currently offlineAA7573E From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 475 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (10 years 11 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 5000 times:

@Yanksn4

You don't have to make two connections to get from DEN to LGA. If you want the cheapest ticket out there, expect to make a few connections. If you want direct service, or service with the fewest connections, expect to pay a bit more.

Aircraft selection is a function of PAX counts. It is better to have multiple M80's from ORD to LGA on an hourly basis, than to have a smaller number of flights serviced by larger aircraft. It is more important to offer frequency to high yielding markets, than to pack them all into one flight. Why should AA operate larger aircraft to LGA and SFO? Is this just because you like 767s and 757s, or do you actually have a legitimate business case for doing so?

Don't look for any IFE to be retrofitted into M80s, which are currently the only mainline aircraft without IFE (discounting the F100s - which are being phased out). It simply does not translate into the ability to charge higher fares. After all, the are pricing against LCCs with onboard IFE, so they don't have a lot of room to increase their ticket costs in that respect. The solid selling point for AA against a B6 or F9 is to downplay the IFE hype, and hammer home the availibility of connections, service offerings and international availability - all of which the LCCs can not offer.



See you up front!
User currently offlineAirlinebiznut From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 82 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (10 years 11 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 4967 times:

Don't look for any IFE to be retrofitted into M80s, which are currently the only mainline aircraft without IFE (discounting the F100s - which are being phased out). It simply does not translate into the ability to charge higher fares. After all, the are pricing against LCCs with onboard IFE, so they don't have a lot of room to increase their ticket costs in that respect. The solid selling point for AA against a B6 or F9 is to downplay the IFE hype, and hammer home the availibility of connections, service offerings and international availability - all of which the LCCs can not offer.

For the time being! I find it hard to believe there is not a vendor out there willing to work up an attractive deal to equip AA aircraft with seatback IFE. With advances in wifi and the like, it would be possible to have decent programming without even having live satellite service. Aircraft could download programming upon arrival at hub cities.

There has to be some innovation and creativity here. If there was not, JetBlue would have been just another startup with nothing to offer but low fares.


User currently offlineCol From Malaysia, joined Nov 2003, 2129 posts, RR: 22
Reply 5, posted (10 years 11 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 4954 times:

Airlinebiznut

From what I have read in these postings, I feel sorry for the AA employees. I myself do not fly AA or DL due to past experiences, and there are better standards available. This is not directed at crew, but the whole offering.

When flying I want to be able to check in easily, AA and DL always have the longest check in lines, and check in staff not so helpful.

On board service is very similar to all the other carriers, and I belive that most majors have their management employee issues. Leave the can, the PAX have been lining up in this lane and that lane, so a full can is not too much to ask.

The Airbus fleets in USA seem to offer more than the Boeing/older MD products. On US Airways you get power outlets. Jetblue/Frontier have PTV. PAX get the oppotunity to do something, rather than bitch and moan about this or that.

Get management to get out more, take a flight on AA (economy), then compare with other carriers. Ask the flight attendants/crew what the PAX want, they pay you for this feedback also. Not listening to employees whom come into contact with your salary payers, every minute of their working lives is not the way to turn it around. It will be teamwork, a joint effort by everyone, and the final question should be what is the fair/correct thing to do for all parties. Nobody is right all the time, and it might be that what seems logical cannot be paid for at this time, but maybe will work later.

AA seems to have some very compasionate employees, that is a good foundation, good luck to you and your airline.


User currently offlineChautauquasaab From United States of America, joined Oct 1999, 102 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (10 years 11 months 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 4937 times:

I have been historically very loyal to American Airlines. My travels have ranged from a lot of US domestic travel, to a number of flights to Europe and a lot of travel to Japan.
I would be happy if the vastly simplified fare system proposed several years ago was reviewed and implemented. The perception of a solid value is important to me. This is not, I emphasize, the cheapest seat, but the best quality for the money.
The IFE stuff is not that big a deal to me. I know a lot of kids here feel they would suffer mental anguish without loads of video choices. I tend to be happy with a good book and enough room. More Room Throughout Coach was a move in the right direction. Backing off MRTC in "leisure" markets is a mistake.
I think it is a good move for AA to avoid the LCC thing. It seems silly to me to dilute the value of the brand with a trendy new offering in a few markets.
The rubber really hits the road with the cabin staff, and by and large, AA seems to have a superior group of people. There have been a few I've run across that were head cases, but that is rare. Perhaps my opinion is skewed by a lot of premium international travel where the more seasoned staff is working.
As to aircraft, I very much like the 777 for intercontinental travel. On the domestic side, renewing the fleet should be a high priority. Some of the MD's are a bit long in the tooth.
Keep up the good work.


User currently offlineYanksn4 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1404 posts, RR: 12
Reply 7, posted (10 years 11 months 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 4913 times:


AA7573E, when you are stuck on a flight that is over three hours long, with a crowded plane with only one isle, that is when you want a bigger plane than maybe a MD-80!



2013 Airports: EWR, JFK, LGA, LIS, AGP, DEN, GIG, RGN, BKK, LHR, FRA, LAX, SYD, PER, MEL, MCO, MIA, PEK, IAH
User currently offlineYyz717 From Canada, joined Sep 2001, 16335 posts, RR: 56
Reply 8, posted (10 years 11 months 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 4894 times:

AA will not prosper until it reduces its labour costs & improves its labour productivity to the level of the LCC's. Until then, it will continue to flounder.

The airline business is a commodity...the spoils go to the low cost provider.




Panam, TWA, Ansett, Eastern.......AC next? Might be good for Canada.
User currently offlineThunder9 From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 219 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (10 years 11 months 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 4879 times:

Hey Chautauquasaab --

Regarding your MD's are a bit long in the tooth comment. You're right, they aren't brand new. However, these planes don't have to look old (I'm assuming that's what you meant). I met an arrival the other day, one of our MD-80's (I refuse to say Super 80!). That airplane was really shining on the outside. The cabin looked nice, as well. Turns out that this aircraft had recently been at TUL (I believe) for a heavy maintenance check, and the plane had virtually been refurbished. It looked brand new again.

Now, if we didn't employ so many seemingly unnecessary folks in upper management for all the committees & focus groups, et al., we could put more money into keeping the older aircraft looking good all the time. I'm sure there are other good ways to spend AA's money, but right now, it's not being spent wisely.

-John



"Keep thy airspeed up, less the earth come from below and smite thee." - William Kershner
User currently offlineAirlinebiznut From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 82 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (10 years 11 months 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 4876 times:


Go somewhere else man! Take a look at Southwest's "labour" costs. Their employees make just as much as we do!

Now, I hope Air Canada's employees know who they are serving when you happen to be on their flights. I flew Air Canada from Tel Aviv to YYZ last month and it was one of the best flights I have ever been on.

Your negative comments are not contributing to making the world a better place. Just thought I would let you know.


User currently offlineYyz717 From Canada, joined Sep 2001, 16335 posts, RR: 56
Reply 11, posted (10 years 11 months 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 4842 times:

Your negative comments are not contributing to making the world a better place. Just thought I would let you know.

Neither is your whining and excessive work demands. I'm simply pointing out the "other" side of the picture, namely that airlines can no longer afford expensive unions.



Panam, TWA, Ansett, Eastern.......AC next? Might be good for Canada.
User currently offlinePlanemaker From Tuvalu, joined Aug 2003, 6362 posts, RR: 34
Reply 12, posted (10 years 11 months 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 4832 times:

Yanksn4:

I disagree. On any express train in Europe you have only one aisle and can travel for several hours with no problems. There is just a double standard when it comes to air travel.



Nationalism is an infantile disease. It is the measles of mankind. - A. Einstein
User currently offlineYanksn4 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1404 posts, RR: 12
Reply 13, posted (10 years 11 months 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 4802 times:

planemaker, there is a difference I believe between a plane and a train, I beleive you are allowed to get up and walk around on a train, but on a plane you mainly have to stay in your seat next to the guy that won't sutup and someone with a cold.


2013 Airports: EWR, JFK, LGA, LIS, AGP, DEN, GIG, RGN, BKK, LHR, FRA, LAX, SYD, PER, MEL, MCO, MIA, PEK, IAH
User currently offlineUAL747DEN From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 2392 posts, RR: 11
Reply 14, posted (10 years 11 months 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 4785 times:

I personally do not think that AA is that bad, however I do live in Denver and do not get a lot of opportunities to fly AA. I think that the more room throughout coach was an awesome idea. I would rather be comfortable than have a TV in front of my face. I also think that AA needs to update its fleet. With the large variety of choices today people are not going to fly on a MD80 when they could take a 767 or even a 777 in some cases. Like I said I might not be the best person to comment on AA because I don't fly them frequently but I don't think that its too bad compared to the competition.
Now I will say one thing that might really piss you off Airlinebiznut. I do think that management at AA is doing a pretty good job. The airline is not bankrupt and is doing better financially than its competitors. It is a fine line between making the employees and customers happy and keeping the airline in business. If management started doing what all the customers and employees suggested there would be no airline to complain about.

HAVE A GREAT DAY



/// UNITED AIRLINES
User currently offlinePlanemaker From Tuvalu, joined Aug 2003, 6362 posts, RR: 34
Reply 15, posted (10 years 11 months 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 4751 times:

Yanksn4:

Except for transcon flights which are around 5 hours (most domestic flights are about 2 hours), there is not much difference between the two. I have always gotten up and stretched my legs, gone to the lav, visited the galley for some water, etc. I do believe that double standards do exist vs. air travel. An example: people have made a big deal, complaining about flying with 500 people in a 747 Domestic yet it no problem to be in a movie theatre with a larger number.

[Edited 2003-12-31 19:41:06]


Nationalism is an infantile disease. It is the measles of mankind. - A. Einstein
User currently offlineUAL747DEN From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 2392 posts, RR: 11
Reply 16, posted (10 years 11 months 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 4703 times:

Planemaker
I have never paid $1000.00 to go to a movie. You expect a certain amount of comfort when you are paying certain amount of money.



/// UNITED AIRLINES
User currently offlineTan flyr From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 1919 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (10 years 11 months 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 4672 times:

Good afternoon to All...Best wishes for a Healthy and Posperous 2004.

Now,that being said....I tend to agree with about 90% of Chatauquasaab said.
As a Plat. AAdvantage member for several years and Gold or Plat for 12 or 15 years now I have taken my share of Great, average and bad flights on AA and others including LCC's.

My travel consists of domestic/South America and Spain/UK on AA, so I believe also I have had pretty good samples of the offerings in coach and business/first. All in all, not bad...However I hope they do not take MRTC out of the MD-80 fleet, as it is one change that made 3 hr flights acceptable in that aircraft. Someone mentioned the MD-80's being long in the tooth...well..maybe a few, But if my memeory is correct the first ones came into the fleet in 1983 or so..compared to the refurbished DC-9's at NW, almost newborns!( those 9's at NW prove age is not the only issue with an airliner).While we are on the subject of aircraft..I am one customer that does have a preference..While the Airbus fleets at UA,NW and US are maybe newer (somewhat), I just do not feel that the plane is as solid as one that was built in Long Beach or Renton/Everett. The busses just seem a bit to have a bit too much plastic for my liking. I'll choose AA first, and or CO/Dl with a Boeing/MD aircraft over a bus when I have a choice. So, do not deviate from the plan of a nearly all Boeing/MD (ex A300-600's) fleet.

I do not need IFE on a 3 hr MD-80 flight, I find the time enjoyable to read..something some of the younger set seem to have forgotten how to do.I am glad tho that the days of MD-80 from ORD to LAX are gone!

But to the question..what would make AA better...things that do not cost much...a few more smiles..some recognition that I am your bread and butter passenger by getting my bags to me in a reasonable time..go back to marking them accordingly...premium pax.

Accurate information about delays, etc.would be helpful also.

Now I can say I(and my family) been upgraded to first when coach is overbooked, and I appreciate that. Perhaps when the main cabin is stuffed (but not oversold) and there are seats upfront a complimentry upgrade would be nice particularly when you are on a multi leg-trip.

Now , as with any company in any business, many members of management should get out of their nice offices and visit where the revenue is generated.
It improves morale, impresses customers when they are seated in coach next to an AA exec., and they probably will learn something from interacting with everyone.

Does this mean AA is incompetent..I dont think so. Imperfect, yes!(we all are)

As someone else mentioned, your company has not gone to BK court,as others have and had a Judge tell your company how it will be run. I really think that you all should be glad of that. ( ask some Enron/Global crossing/MCI/UAL.US Airways/many others/ employeees).

Now this will probably piXX a few off..however, if you are really as unhappy with your job or employer as some make out..please do yourself /your family/ and the employer a favor...move on..there are other opportunites. No one should be as unhappy in a workplace as some seem to be..it is a free country..you have no "big brother" planning your life,telling you that you must work at any place. Take the opportunity of a new year to make a fresh start for yourself and those around you.

Thanks!..and May God Bless all of you!


User currently offlineAdh214 From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 360 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (10 years 11 months 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 4659 times:

I flew 65,000 miles with AA this year. By and large I am very pleased with their services. I have a few small suggestions on things that AA could improve

1. put a nicer sandwich in the bistro bags. The bread always appears greasy and the meat on the sandwich is a low quality turkey blend.
2. speed up baggage claim at DFW. I don't normally check luggage but a 20 to 45 minute wait is really crazy.
3. simplify the fare structure. It is shocking to me that I can pay between $180 and $2500 for a the same roundtrip DFW-BOS.
4. Reinstate MRTC in the 757. I hate having to schedule my trip around when I can get on an MD-80 or 737.

Flight attendants on AA have always been very efficient and polite with me. (It probably helps that I am always polite to them. "Please" and "Thank you" are the most underused words by airline passengers. Let's face it most of them have taken major pay cuts and dealt with all sorts of foolishness. Being nice to the flight attendants is the least we (as passengers) can do.)

As for the MD-80, I don't have any problem with these planes. Yes, they are old but let's face it, they get you where you are going safely and comfortably.

Andrew


User currently offlineCanadianNorth From Canada, joined Aug 2002, 3395 posts, RR: 9
Reply 19, posted (10 years 11 months 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 4647 times:

Well from reading above there simple fares do work. When Canadian North was made an independent airline, they simplifyed there fare system and there fares are lower yet the staff pay and service and profit stayed about the same...
Basicly for fares you need the following:
First go later
First go now
Bizz go later
Bizz go now
Econ go later
Econ go now
Its simple and easy... basicly a cheeper fare for those who plan to go next month and the full fare for those who wanna go in the next day or 2...


CanadianNorth



What could possibly go wrong?
User currently offlineAirlinebiznut From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 82 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (10 years 11 months 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 4647 times:

Adh214

Thank you so much for your suggestions. I agree with your observations 100%.

Regards,
Airlinebiznut


User currently offlineTekelberry From United States of America, joined May 2003, 1459 posts, RR: 4
Reply 21, posted (10 years 11 months 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 4638 times:

Col,

1) AA has numerous self-service kiosks at the majority of airports they serve. These machines will reduce the normal line, if you so desire to check-in the old-fashioned way. You can also check-in online and curbside to avoid the lines completely.

2) All airlines are starting not to give you the full can. This is not just AA/DL. All you have to do is ask for a full can and they'll give it to you. Seems to work everytime for me...

3) AA has retrofitted the majority of their fleet with power outlets. The only aircraft you may not be able to find them on are the ex-TWA airplanes.

And to all of those who are moaning about smaller aircraft, take note that most of the other majors fly the equivalent to what AA is flying, if not smaller. At least you're not stuck on a ERJ all the time, which is what you would most likely be doing if you connected in CLE with CO.

How can you complain about in flight service? AA is the only major that offers MRTC on all aircraft besides 757s and A300s. The FAs are equally as crabby on the other carriers.


User currently offlineAirlinebiznut From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 82 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (10 years 11 months 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 4621 times:

Tekelberry

Thanks. It's nice to know that we are competitive when it comes to crabbiness.  Smile


User currently offlineBaw2198 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 637 posts, RR: 4
Reply 23, posted (10 years 11 months 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 4568 times:

Cheaper flights and better connections. AA is pricing them selves right out of business. Example, I'm going to mardi gras this year. CID-MSY at least thats what I would've prefered. AA via EGF price checking 3 mo. ahead (most of the time this has worked for in the past for getting the best price) cheapest fare was $482 round trip and this leave the sun. before and coming back thurs. before the big weekend. UA out of CID isn't any better they matched AA price, MLI had the cheapest with $217 round trip on UA and thats what I picked. Even though its an hour and half drive to get it, its worth it. My point is that if the airlines want passengers they have to reduce the price which will increase the amount of people that want to buy tickets. Better in the long run, but the AA exec's must not be looking into the long term type thinking. Thats whyAA might gone in 2 yrs. time unless they change strategy.

[Edited 2003-12-31 22:07:34]

[Edited 2003-12-31 22:10:37]


"And remember, Keep your stick on the ice"--->Red Green
User currently offlineUAL747DEN From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 2392 posts, RR: 11
Reply 24, posted (10 years 11 months 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 4545 times:

Baw2198
You are that crazy passenger that wants all the service at the LCC price. Like I said above if AA did that they would be out of business. I think that $482.00 is an average price. Im not saying that you should have not booked UA, however that does not make AA a bad airline.



/// UNITED AIRLINES
25 RamerinianAir : The airline economy is very cyclic. When the economy prospers there won't be as much as a need for the LCC's. They are really for bad economic times a
26 Baw2198 : UAL747DEN I'm not that crazy passenger THANK YOU!!!!! As far as the service goes in econo class its the same. I fly quite a bit and no buddy has offer
27 Startvalve : Better prices. I typically fly on the cheapest flight I can find. I do prefer to fly AA . I do not give a rats furry butt about IFE, i don't care if t
28 Tommy767 : When you think about it, AA doesn't have that old of a fleet. A300s: Still young Late 1980s-Early Mid 1990s MD-80s: Are old, but have the new seats an
29 Airways6max : To be #1 again, American Airlines would need to: Sell off American Eagle. Many of Eagle's routes do not make much profit. Let someone lose money on ro
30 Baw2198 : What was the main reason for AA pulling out of STL other than the terminal not being very user friendly for gate changes? STL at least pulled some tra
31 AA7573E : @Baw2198 Just for reference, three months in advance is way to early to get the cheap fares you want. Think of pricing for tickets as a sliding scale.
32 Baw2198 : AA7573E Thank you very much for the insight. Is there a good place to or way to find deals on flights. Usually I just go to the airlines web sites th
33 Post contains images Amhilde : A little off topic, but in regards to the Full Can Issue- I always thought it would be lovely if US carriers had the wee cans of soda like the Europe
34 Aa757first : AA made a mistake removing MRTC in the A300s and 757s. Everyone who flew AA that I have heard of was raving about it. So they took it away? The full c
35 AA777MIA : Amhilde: I wrote that idea into out catering department, and believe it or not, they came back with an answer of, the small cans would be too hard to
36 Post contains images Iflyatldl : AA777MIA: I agree, it's just plain stupid...they have it in Europe and if you'll notice- they sure as heck have no problem doing with those tacky cans
37 Luv2fly : Maybe AA should focus on being the BEST that they can be, and not worry about being number one. AA was the first airline I EVER flew on and for that t
38 Wedgetail737 : Here are my 2 cents: I would like to see MRTC return on the 757's and A300's. The MRTC is what separated AA from the rest of airlines...in my eyes. I
39 AApilot2b : I was going to post a comment, but after reading Chautauquasaab's posting, I really have no more to say. Those were exactly my words.
40 Thrust : Keeping all their promises, and finding a way to preserve all their hubs, like STL! STL residents like myself and TWA workers are still feeling the ef
41 PVD757 : I know one thing that would help. If they could find a way of gaining some flexibilty on the scope clause, such as combining AA and AE pilot lists lik
42 Post contains images AM : American Airlines has been my favorite airline by far since I flew with them for the first time when I was 13, but I think that's because of very diff
43 Eva744 : Get rid of the blacklist at AMR.
44 Post contains images Atrude777 : Thrust- because of ur comments...you are on my respected user list. we the STL people feel the effects greatly however AA DOES kep the prices as low a
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