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AA 757s To MAN  
User currently offlineBilly From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2000, 895 posts, RR: 7
Posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 7872 times:

As predicted, AA has filed for transatlantic 757 services from BOS to MAN. Aircraft will be domestic configured, and domestic F seats will be sold to full Y and frequent flyers. Services start from April, I think. Not yet in the AA system, but slots are filed at MAN.

64 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineLhr001 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 7729 times:

Oh dear the 757-ization of the North Atlantic continues!

Hopefully BMI will counteract with an A330 on the route!

Perhaps, Virgin will afford an A340 to Boston from Manchester!


Why has American chosen the 757 over the 767-200 it seems odd. And most of all the 767-200 affords travellers the oppurtunity to choose First, Business, or Economy Class. This will have to be played by ear! Didnt American Airlines flop a few years back on DFW-MAN?


LHR001


User currently offlineBilly From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2000, 895 posts, RR: 7
Reply 2, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 7694 times:

LHR001.

Yes, a seasonal DFW failed. The JFK always struggled despite having the highest load factors on the Atlantic.

I think that a MIA service is under review for MAN for later in the year. This will obvioulsy be a 763.


User currently offlineSkymonster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 7598 times:

Hopefully BMI will counteract with an A330 on the route!

Doubt whether BMI will go into Boston - its not a good hub for Star Alliance. BMI's third A330 is in any case allocated to MOD flights from Brize Norton to Ascension Island and Mount Pleasant (Faulklands) until the spring, after which a BMI MAN-YYZ service is currently the favoured rumour.

Andy


User currently offlineBilly From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2000, 895 posts, RR: 7
Reply 4, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 7581 times:

Surely the BMI aircraft will need a reconfiguration? It is heavy on the biz cabin and premium economy. MAN-YYZ really does not need that config. I assume that AC would gracefully withdraw from the route?

User currently offlineFlymeagain From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2003, 11 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 7511 times:

The BMI A-330 is going to be reconfigured after the MOD contract. Andy (sorry) Skymonster is quite correct though, YYZ is the most favorable route at the mo when the mod contract finishes, But, MIA has been blowing in the wind.

User currently offlineSkymonster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 7448 times:

OK, we're sort of off-subject a bit here, but I wish BMI would make its mind up what it is doing with trans-Atlantics and its 3rd A330 next summer. I'm currently trying to arrange some travel into the summer season, and being a gold carder as well as a former nine-year employee, I'd far rather support BMI than the other alternatives.

Andy


User currently offlineDavid_itl From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2001, 7329 posts, RR: 14
Reply 7, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 7390 times:
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Did AA reconfingure the 5 (or was it 6?) 757s that they used on the MAN-JFK run back in 1995? I've no objections to 757s across the pond - far better to try to maximise yields on a smaller aircraft with fewer premium seats to fill before progressing onto the "main" transatlantic aircraft. Anyway, MAN operations for most airlines should concentrate on 2 class configuration!

David


User currently offlineBilly From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2000, 895 posts, RR: 7
Reply 8, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 7376 times:

The 75s AA ran back in '95 were regular domestic configured aircraft. For a short time AA ran a business ExtrAA product - a 'nearly' J class for high-spending Y pax.

User currently offlineLeskova From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 6075 posts, RR: 70
Reply 9, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 7358 times:

If they're domestic configs, does that mean with or without MRTC? Are they already done reconfiguring the 757s to the higher density seating?


Smile - it confuses people!
User currently offlineConair From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2000, 196 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 7346 times:

If I remember rightly the American B757 service was to JFK in the summer of 1995, they only used about 6 different aircraft on the route and it was dropped at the end of the summer season. There have been rumours in the past as to both AA service to DAL & MIA but nothing has yet materialized. As david says the aircraft can be used to develop the market. remember Continental started with 757's on MAN-EWR and have used both DC10's and B777's since, are suposed to be going back to triples this summer. Having said that I remember going to MCO a good few years ago on a Monarch (Charter configured B757, well it was cheap) via BGR, a never to be repeated experiance.

Regard's
Conair


User currently offlineAanalyst From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 136 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 7301 times:

All 757's have ben reconfigured to LRTC :-(

I would like to know where Billy got his info though. There's nothing on any of the company websites about BOS-MAN. It really wouldn't surprise me if the service was a 767-300. All of AAs 767-200s are in 3-Class configuration, and mainly being used on 2 routes: LAX-JFK and SFO-JFK. The 757s that AA flies that are Overwater equipped are already stretched very thin with the extensive Haawaii routes.



Knowledge is Power. Power Corrupts. - Study Hard, Be Evil
User currently offlineLeskova From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 6075 posts, RR: 70
Reply 12, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 7265 times:

Thanks, AAnalyst - I wasn't sure about that, although I was afraid that that would be the answer...

Anyhow, wouldn't even a 3-class 762 make more sense on this route? After all, if they're planning to sell the domestic-first-class seats as Y-full fare? Why not use a three class aircraft redesignated as "Economy/Coach", "Economy-Full-Fare" and "Business Class" config? This way they could still get some of the business traffic on this route, and even if it's not a lot (although I don't know if it isn't) it would still be some...

I can't really see any scheduled carrier opening a transatlantic flight with essentially an all-economy-seating (even if they have a separate, better, cabin for full-fare-payers) - or is any airline (scheduled, not charter) doing something like this already?



Smile - it confuses people!
User currently offlineBilly From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2000, 895 posts, RR: 7
Reply 13, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 7232 times:

Is it the case that an AA 757 carries marginally more pax than the 762? So the cost for AA would be fewer cabin crew but no significant cargo revenue.

I would also assume that the 757s are range-restricted, making the UK and Ireland the most suitable markets for the type and then only to the East Coast. Everything else would need to be wide-ride.


User currently offlineAA777MIA From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 686 posts, RR: 3
Reply 14, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 7219 times:

The 767-200's are used for the JFK LAX, JFK SFO markets... Using them out of BOS would throw a ripple in that system, and these are premium markets within the United States.... Highly doubt that they would be moved out of those markets...

User currently offlineLeskova From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 6075 posts, RR: 70
Reply 15, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 7191 times:

AA777MIA, you're right, but do you think that a 757 without MRTC makes sense on this route? Or, for that much, that this route really makes sense for AA?

What, by the way, is AA's seating capacity on the 752, 762 and 763 (I'm quite certain that I've seen it on other threads on occasion, but I don't really know where that was)?

Billy, do the slots in MAN specifically mention AA flying 757s on that route? I'm just asking, because, to be honest, I do not have a single bit of an idea what information gets put into slot applications...



Smile - it confuses people!
User currently offlineContinentalEWR From United States of America, joined May 2000, 3762 posts, RR: 13
Reply 16, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 7175 times:

Even if American were to fly a 767-200 across the pond to MAN from BOS, it would most likely be configured in Business and Economy only. AA has removed First Class from a number of 767-300's flying to non-primary European routes (Brussels, Rome, etc....) and the 767-200 has not been flying to Europe since 2000 when service was standardized around the 767-300 and the 777.

And someone said that the JFK-MAN route had the highest load factors on the North Atlantic, I would say no. The highest load factors are probably on the LHR flights from JFK and EWR.

The JFK-MAN route operated from 1991 to 1993.

ContinentalEWR


User currently offlineMYT332 From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2003, 9112 posts, RR: 71
Reply 17, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 7137 times:

Seating Capacity

B757-200 168/176
B767-200 158
B767-300 212

Go here for more info

[Edited 2004-01-02 14:18:14]


One Life, Live it.
User currently offlineBilly From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2000, 895 posts, RR: 7
Reply 18, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 7131 times:

Leskova,
Airport slots indicate airline, aircraft type, destination, arrival/departure times at slot airport, as well as period of operation and whether the flight is a charter/cargo positioning etc. Fairly detailed info. Most US airports are not slot controlled. Most large European airports are slot controlled.

The AA flight was their highest load factor on the NA according to my knowledge. LHR-JFK is a busy route but they also have larger aircraft. Getting 95% loads on a 757 is much easier than on the MD-11 (as they were flying then). However, the MAN yield was also one of the lowest on the NA.


User currently offlineAA777MIA From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 686 posts, RR: 3
Reply 19, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 7124 times:

To be real honest, not sure why they would start this flight, but I would assume the logic is for holiday travelers.. If that were the case, then it goes with the logic of using the 757 is "leisure" markets, which is what the majority of the passengers would be. The LRTC config I believe is basically the same as UK aircraft, if I am not mistaken.. The 767-200's were left in 3 class config, so they could serve the Premium Market in the JFK, LAX, JFK, SFO markets.. To answer your question on capacity..

757-200's hold 22/166 in the LRTC confg... If there are any left MRTC 22/154
767-200's hold 9/30/119
767-300's hold 30/182 in 2 class config...


User currently offlineIflyatldl From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 1936 posts, RR: 3
Reply 20, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 6937 times:

It's seems like a trend is starting in using the 757 on North Trans Atlantic routes. Depending on the market, I can see MAN being ideal for the 757 and more so for AA because it would be a leisure market. CO has been using the 757 on CLE-LGW(can't remember if seasonal or year round), and it seems to work for them. Didn't TW at some point run 757's on some North Atlantic routes?


Ah, Summer, Fenway Park, Boston Red Sox and Beer.....
User currently offlineDutchjet From Netherlands, joined Oct 2000, 7864 posts, RR: 57
Reply 21, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 6876 times:

I have no problem with the 757 operating transatlantic routes, its the right aircraft where demand is thin and/or yeilds are an issue, I have flown on CO 757s transatlantic many times without issue both in Business and Economy. However, I do think its odd that AA would use a domestic configured LRTC aircraft for the route and why would AA go with a BOS-MAN service - arent JFK-MAN (why did AA have problems with this route in the first place, one would think it be a huge money-maker) would make more sense, as would MIA-MAN to tie into the large AA hub.


User currently offlineCrosswind From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2000, 2597 posts, RR: 58
Reply 22, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 6881 times:
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The JFK-MAN route operated from 1991 until 1995, but for the last couple of years it was seasonal.

The route's final season was summer 1995, when AA used the B757 for the first time head-to-head against the new Continental Newark service, also on the B757, and BA's usual B767.

While the Continental route was a success and was quickly upgraded to a DC-10 in 1996, AA threw in the towel after 5 years of trying...


User currently offlineUaord From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 86 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 6779 times:

Why bother with a first class section on transatlantic flights on the 757? The layout and configuration is so weak compared to any widebody. The fare would have to be significantly less expensive to rationalize flying F on any 757.





User currently offlineTommy767 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 6584 posts, RR: 11
Reply 24, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 6692 times:

Smart thinking. That route doesn't need a 763/777. IMO, expand 757 Biz class by putting in new seats, and put new seats in Coach with the "Winged" headrests.


"Folks that's the news and I'm outta here!" -- Dennis Miller
25 AA7573E : I would like to see some documented proof of this. New service is typically well hyped by the AA marketing machine, and I have not seen anything regar
26 AirJamPanAm : I'm confused.. I thought the thread was meant to spark a discussion on the aircraft type being used between BOS and MAN? A past topic has been the inc
27 Aaway : "Am I to understand that market between BOS and MAN is somewhat small or low yield?" With the exception of LHR, and some CDG and FRA routes, it's prob
28 Tan flyr : No surprise here..I have wondered where AA was going to use all the LRTC 757's anyway, especially after the heavy winter/early spring travel to the ca
29 Post contains images Iflyatldl : I think what's happening here is that AA is "testing the waters" so to speak. I totally get it. Why not utilize a medium capacity a/c on BOS-MAN and f
30 Aaway : Tan flyr and Iflyatldl, The "surprise" is that this is so unlike AA. Low yield Europe??? "Testing the waters"??? Historically has that been AA? That's
31 Post contains images Iflyatldl : Aaway: I hear ya loud and clear!
32 STT757 : AA's 767-200s are some of the oldest (if not the oldest) aircraft in AA's fleet, they will probably be phased out over the next 3-5 years. Also AA's 7
33 Aaway : "AA's 767-200s are some of the oldest (if not the oldest) aircraft in AA's fleet, they will probably be phased out over the next 3-5 years." Off topic
34 GKirk : A couple of years ago, Olympic planned an ATH-MAN-BOS flight (2 x weekly)using A300s. This never happened, and as I understand OA fly ATH-BOS nonstop
35 Bartond : I don't think OA flies into BOS, do they? BOS has quite a few European carriers but I don't think Olympic is one of them. Atleast they didn't have the
36 Gigneil : Heh they don't fly anywhere at all anymore. N
37 AA777MIA : Anyone know the fly time from BOS to MAN? Im guessing 51/2-6hrs??
38 Dutchjet : Actual flying time is about 6 hours outbound, about 5 1/4 hours on the return......add about 15 minutes due to 757 service on the route. Of course, th
39 N62NA : AA's 767-200s are some of the oldest (if not the oldest) aircraft in AA's fleet, they will probably be phased out over the next 3-5 years. Also AA's
40 AA777MIA : That plane has been on the MIA JFK MIA route for a while now, not sure why, but that is one small exception to that isolation, and the plane does not
41 CALMSP : why do people complain about 757 service across the atlantic, when you travel NYC-west coast it can be even longer, especially if your comparing BOS-M
42 FlyCaledonian : As regard 757s on NA routes in the late 90s BA operated two aircraft on BHX-JFK-YYZ and GLA-JFK-BOS services, operating in a two class layout. With re
43 MAH4546 : I think that a MIA service is under review for MAN for later in the year. This will obvioulsy be a 763. Yes, MIA-MAN is under serious consideration fo
44 STT757 : If im not mistaken I think one of AA's EWR-LAX flights is a 767-200, though it might be a 767-300.
45 Bmi330 : Is this not suppose to be happining from GLA-BOS also and the ORD flights to both GLA and MAN going to a single 777to something like ORD-GLA-MAN-GLA-O
46 LatinAviation : AA's BOS-MAN should be announced soon, as early as this week. A friend has done some back-end analysis on this route. It will operate as an all-Y serv
47 Col : Manchester has been fairly interesting as a NA departure airport. Those airlines with Hubs seem to do very well. CO - EWR going to 777. DL - ATL 763/7
48 Crosswind : AA's MAN-ORD continues to enjoy healthy loads, the presence of bmi hasn't had a major negative effect on AA. The MAN-GLA-ORD 777 rumour is a very old
49 Post contains links and images Ryder10uk : actually AA flies 767-200 to LHR still so they are still utilised over the atlantic View Large View MediumPhoto © Colin K. Work
50 Nickofatlanta : That photo is from a year ago!! LHR is now all 777.
51 Ryder10uk : counteracting the saying that aa hasnt flown 762 over the atlantc since 2000
52 Ckfred : I'm not surprised that AA wants to fly BOS-MAN. I am surprised that they want to use 757s. AA file for DCA slots for service to LAX using 757s. Right
53 Billy : For all you doubters out there: AMERICAN AIRLINES ANNOUNCES FIRST NON-STOP JET LINK BETWEEN MANCHESTER-BOSTON American Airlines is launching a new dai
54 Oerk : So this exciting new venture will feature: > LRTC What is the IFE like on the 757?!?! Are you sure there are no 757s left with MRTC that they have dec
55 Sebwhite : Sounds like a fake press release. What is the source? It's definitely not on the AMR web site!
56 Post contains links Oerk : I thought it had to be fake... but this would suggest otherwise :/ http://www.manchesterairport.co.uk/content.nsf/NewsLookUp/513703686D5028EB80256E1B0
57 B4real : Wow, it is official now. But this is what I don't get: "The daily service, on board a single-class 188-seat Boeing 757 aircraft, ..." This is a new br
58 LatinAviation : This is a new brand/product for AA. Are there other routes with this type of a/c? No, it's the standard configuration for AA's 757s (22F/166Y) but wil
59 BestWestern : American Airlines today announced the launch of a new trans-Atlantic route that will link Boston with Manchester in Northern England with nonstop flig
60 Post contains images ConcordeBoy : On the plus side: more 752s over the puddle On the negative side: all coach ...oh well, allow me to be the first to apologize to Billy for believing h
61 Thrust : AA 757s to join CO 757s. The RR-powered 757s are becoming a common sight over the Atlantic. By the way, will this include the ex-TWA 757s? By the way,
62 ConcordeBoy : The 752s are based at NRT, and sent there to replace the former A320s opping some routes therefrom. They do not fly to the USA
63 B4real : LatinAviation: Nothing against you but if this is true: No, it's the standard configuration for AA's 757s (22F/166Y) but will operate as a single-clas
64 Cloud4000 : I think AA is running BOS-MAN with 757s first to see if it is viable before upgrading it to a 767. Anyway, I believe this flight will also act as some
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