Ouboy79 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 3995 posts, RR: 23 Posted (9 years 4 months 6 hours ago) and read 3845 times:
::sigh::...Hopefully someone can step in and help Oklahoma out if this fails completely.
Great Plains Airlines files for Chapter 11
2004-01-23
By Adam Wilmoth
The Oklahoman
TULSA - Great Plains Airlines filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection on Friday.
The Tulsa-based carrier said it will discontinue all scheduled service during the bankruptcy proceeds and that it will fly charter service only.
"We regret having to make this filing, but we remain committed to our plan of providing direct air service to the people of Oklahoma, New Mexico, Illinois, Tennessee and Washington D.C.," said David A Johnson, the airlines' chairman and chief executive.
Great Plains operated for more than two years with only two aircraft, losing as much as $800,000 a month, but the carrier reduced that loss in 2003 by reducing its work force and adding three new aircraft last month. ¶
Any opinion/comment posted is that of my own and not that of Southwest Airlines Co.
MoPac From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 215 posts, RR: 0 Reply 3, posted (9 years 4 months 4 hours ago) and read 3534 times:
Hey OPNLguy, are you talking about the guy who was gonna start up a regional carrier based at SAT... Mustang Express I think they were gonna call it... he used to work for Fairchild? Or is this a different guy?
Mfricke From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 266 posts, RR: 0 Reply 9, posted (9 years 4 months 3 hours ago) and read 3363 times:
It's a shame, I always hate to see an airline go out of business. I flew then for fun back in April on an AUS-TUL-OKC routing. I try to fly as many airlines as I can, and I kind of foresaw this coming. Well, I guess Chapter 11 is not Chapter 7, so good luck to them!
Freshlove1 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 10, posted (9 years 4 months 3 hours ago) and read 3326 times:
If your looking for work im sure MESA will hire you from what I hear they have people flying their CRJ's that are fresh off the street and have very few hours.
KKMolokai From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 760 posts, RR: 3 Reply 11, posted (9 years 4 months 1 hour ago) and read 3251 times:
AA is accepting Great Plains tickets for *standby* travel. There is a $25 service charge. Original travel dates/itinerary (as purchased from Great Plains) cannot be altered/changed.
Affected Great Plains passengers *must* call AA Reservations (800-433-7300) to flight list (standby) prior to arriving at the airport. A $25 service fee and a waiver release will be collected at the AA ticket counter upon check-in.
We are the people of American Airlines. And we know why you fly.
Type-rated From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 4345 posts, RR: 20 Reply 12, posted (9 years 4 months 1 hour ago) and read 3241 times:
Wasn't that also TechRep that was going/did interview with JetBlue for a trainers position? I don't think I've seen a post from him since. He always has something pretty interesting to say.....
Fly North Central Airlines..The route of the Northliners!
SprxflySWA From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 597 posts, RR: 0 Reply 13, posted (9 years 4 months 1 hour ago) and read 3210 times:
All I can say is it is about time. How they managed this long escapes me!
They served the thinnest O & D routes I can think of, that have any chance of succeeding,that is.
The way they started,quit cities, and always revamping their schedule, no surprise at all.
Does this include Rio Grande Airways in ABQ, or are they separate?
This is one airline that should have been on everyone's list of over ambitious plans for an airline thread.
Needless to say, I was no fan!
I do feel bad for the ex employees. Reminds me when I would talk to MarkAir employees prior to their demise. Real uncertainty of job stability.
Lt-AWACS From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 14, posted (9 years 4 months ago) and read 3173 times:
Hmmm I flew them OKC-BLV (Scott AFB/Bellville far east St Louis) around Thanksgiving, packed airplane, and easy service into BLV, but I am not surprised. Of course the only reason I flew them was a fare sale. Here was the email I got from them:
""""Dear Shareholders and Friends of Great Plains:
Great Plains Airlines has filed to reorganize under Chapter 11 of the U.S. Bankruptcy Code. We have suspended scheduled flight service effective January 24th 2004. While we regret this suspension of scheduled service, January and February are historically weak months for the industry. We will continue our charter operations as we work through the reorganization plan. Fortunately, we have strong charter bookings for the remainder of January, February and March. We anticipate being able to return to scheduled service by March.
As you know, Great Plains has faced a number of challenges as a result of the general economic slowdown and the events of September 11, 2001. In addition, for some time we have struggled with certain engine issues on the 328 Fairchild Dornier jets, which have resulted in significant down time for our jet aircraft and a reduced level of service for our passengers. In addition, this has had a significant negative impact on our financials. Because of these issues and our inability, to date, to negotiate a reduction in the debt for these aircraft on our balance sheet, we are in the process of turning the aircraft back to the bank.
While for many months, we were having difficulty in obtaining aircraft, this issue has been alleviated by a division of Daimler Chrysler that is providing us with Fairchild Dornier Propjets. We now have two in service and are expecting an additional four aircraft in February. Subsequently, we expect approximately 2 aircraft per month.
Our principal issue is obtaining sufficient working capital to put the aircraft into service. We went out with a new PPM in late December. We are projected to be profitable in 2004 and expect to be at break even before mid-year. However, two sources of funding that were expected in January did not materialize on schedule. This has created a temporary short-term funding difficulty for the airline. While we expect this to be rectified by March, if not before, we determined that this along with the jet aircraft issue required that the airline seek Chapter 11 protection.
We expect to be able to come out of this reorganization as a strong regional airline with an improved balance sheet and financials. This should position us to return to our scheduled service with new cities and improved frequency.
We recognize that these actions will affect you and we regret that it was necessary for Great Plains to take this action.
We are committed to keeping you informed of developments at Great Plains Airlines. The developments about our reorganization will be posted on our website at www.gpair.com. Further, we will send you a letter about our progress from time to time. In the meantime, if you have any questions about this matter, please feel free to contact me at david.johnson@gpair.com.
Sincerely,
David A. Johnson
Chairman and CEO"""""
Ciao, and Hook 'em Horns,
Capt-AWACS, Yankee Air Pirate
WGW2707 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 1197 posts, RR: 38 Reply 15, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 3087 times:
This is extremely unfortunate. Hopefully they will be able to emerge. The CEO made it sound as though this would be a short term bankruptcy. BTW is it likely Great Plains stock will be cancelled?
Contrails From United States of America, joined Oct 2000, 1818 posts, RR: 0 Reply 16, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 2969 times:
"Charter service only". Where have I heard that before?
This is a real bummer. I had hoped they would make it.
KKMolokai From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 760 posts, RR: 3 Reply 17, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 2914 times:
Rumor has it, an unidentified firm wants to buy Great Plains, and part of the term was they'd have to file for bankruptcy by 23JAN. Again, this is just what I heard at work this morning.
We are the people of American Airlines. And we know why you fly.
Lt-AWACS From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 18, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 2809 times:
THe local OKC paper said in a Tulsa dateline that the two 328Jets were withdrawn, almost a month ago, due to MX issues and the Engine repairs were delayed. I believe from reading this article it is a private company with no stock.
Ciao, and Hook 'em Horns,
Capt-AWACS, Uncle Sam's AWAX, the best shine for your jet
Mariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 22711 posts, RR: 88 Reply 20, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 2671 times:
I'm wondering what anyone would buy - other than the Air Operating Certificate, which would have a fair dollat value.
The planes are leased, the routes are available to anyone, the company is mortgaged to the hilt and has a deal of ill will attached to it. I have read that several of the city/states groups that gave the airline financial backing feel that they were misled.
But that AOC - now someone could be interested in that.
SunValley From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 21, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 2649 times:
Mariner, I do believe that the interested parties are only interested in the
operating certificate which does have value. The "rumor" will run rampant, but 2 carriers looking for an operating certificate right now are the group wanting
start the "new" Cascade Airways, and also Ed Beauvais and his airline out of PIT (which has been said to be called SkyAmerica) Other than that,
I'm sure the aircraft will be returned to their lessors. The operating certificate I believe is the one that the reborn Ozark had.
Mariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 22711 posts, RR: 88 Reply 22, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 2606 times:
SunValley:
We agree, but the potential bidders surprise me very slightly. Did Sir Richard Branson ever get his AOC for Virgin USA?
I wonder how much business there is out of OKC? Part of the problem (withe the backers) appears to be that Great Plains promised service to the coasts, but never delivered those routes.
Okie From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 2355 posts, RR: 3 Reply 23, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 2553 times:
Is OKC to LA or NYC viable?
Yes, but you have to have enough planes to have viable schedules. You can't have planes leave OKC-TUL in the am and go to the left or right coast and sit at the gate for 6hrs and then do the return trip, or as in the case of Great Plains have a Noon or so return flight.
They would hop into a market with hope/hype/and the blessing of the local communities and by the time I would find a reason to book a flight with them to that location they would have pulled out, it was like trying to hit a moving target. There schedules were not very business oriented as far as I was concerned. I just generally rely on later in the day return flights to OKC an just would not invest in another days lodging to take a 1:00 pm return flight unless of course maybe the Concorde or something.
They have had trouble everywhere they turned whether it be financing, or aircraft, but I have to admit they have plenty of optimism.
SunValley From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 24, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 2553 times:
Viable yes, but not with an airline like GP. It would have to be a
point to point operation through AA or CO or DL or something of that nature.
Filling 38 out of 50 seats on an CRJ 5 days a week would be reliant upon fairly high yield
fares. The OKC and TUL market have extremely high loyalty to frequent flyer mileage. There would be no feed to the flight & it would be completely reliant on O & D traffic to either market, so you wouldnt even have a fare dilusion of "something" for feed, just an empty seat that carries no revenue.One flight per day in those markets would not satisfy the business community-It would have to have a mulitple frequency. The state of OK would have been far better off to have subsidized a major operator to LA & NYC utilizing a CRJ or ERJ, rather than investing in a start up carrier such as Great Plains.
25 SegmentKing: I wonder how much money the Mid America Airport folks have lost.. didn't they have some level of subsidy for a while? -n
26 Mariner: SegmentKing: There's an article in the St. Louis Post Dispatch which lays out some of the Mid America financial involvement. The url for the actual ar
27 MAH4546: Is OKC to LA or NYC viable? Continental Express flies both OKC-EWR and TUL-EWR. American Airlines flew TUL-LAX for a while between 2000 and 2002.
28 SprxflySWA: Maybe Southeast Airlines will star BLV flights. Or TransMeridian, Allegiant, Hooters, or another well established carrier!!
29 SprxflySWA: That is supposed to say starT! No disrespect to the above airlines, but it seems too many airports (BLV,GYY,YNG,RFD) are setting their sights too low
30 Freshlove1: Ah yes if you are in financial trouble and can be had for a cheap price Johnathan Orienstein will buy you and "welcome" you into the MESA family. Just
31 Krags: Is OKC to LA or NYC viable? Yes, but not with some half assed attempt. Great Plains never had a solid schedule and didn't pick the best destinations t
32 Ouboy79: A few thoughts on everything posted. Vacation Express to YNG is not meant for business flyers. It is for people who want to go to Orlando on...vacatio
33 Okie: I was wondering what were the technical problems were that they were having on the 328jet w/ pw306b engine. Was it something waiting on an engineering
34 Pilotpip: The story at BLV was that parts were simply not available. Great Plains was flying the crud out of their aircraft and had more on order. My manager is
35 Techrep: OPNLguy, Hello OPNLguy I am the person who worked at Fairchild/Dornier and Great Plains. Great Plains laid-off 127 employees and 47 now remain. I am s
36 LMP737: Techrep: Hopefully things will work out for you. With your resume I'm sure someone will pick you up if you have to leave Great Plains. "God I love avi
37 SprxflySWA: Ouboy79, That is exactly my point. Why would a city's leadership waste time and money to lure such an airline operation? Why not try and get someone
38 Scottb: Ouboy79, The problem with the OKC-based carrier you propose is that many of those markets you list couldn't even support more one 70-seat RJ at a 70%
39 Okie: Scottb, I don't doubt your numbers there, but the online airport guide for OKC shows about 3.2 million passengers per year which maybe a streach from
40 Scottb: Okie- I only addressed the markets that Ouboy79 listed (i.e. the ones that are "underserved" with respect to non-stops). Most of OKC's biggest markets
41 Paulinbna: I really liked there color scheme It would change from blue to purple depending on the way the light hit it. I have one picture on the DB of them [Edi
43 Okie: Thanks for the help there Scottb, the numbers make more sense now. I went through the airport Monday the 26th out on Mesaba/NW which is right next to
44 SprxflySWA: As of Wednesday, there was still a Great Plains sign on the US Airways baggage carousel at IAD. It is not attached, so maybe someone should "acquire"
45 Okie: here we go, but does not say anything in particular about Great Plains http://biz.yahoo.com/djus/040130/1408000807_1.html
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