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SYD-Europe Direct Flight? Possible?  
User currently offlineThaigold From Australia, joined Sep 2003, 315 posts, RR: 2
Posted (10 years 6 months 4 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 3363 times:

Gday

I was just wondering if it would be possible with a slightly modified 340-500 or 777-200LR (or other plane) to fly direct from SYD to Europe and if it would be a profitable routing? I know that it would be a 20+ hour flight but still believe that it could have some potential. I fly the route a few times a year and don't think it would bother me too much as I HATE the time wasted in between the connecting flights.....

Is it possible now or in the near future??

Thanks!


Dunbar Rovers forever
20 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineSonic From Lithuania, joined Jan 2000, 1670 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (10 years 6 months 4 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 3342 times:

Vilnius-Sydney is possible in theory (with Boeing 747SP). However, it doesn't seems such route would be very popular unless it would be advertised in western Europe as a good way to reach Sydney (via Vilnius).
If Vilnius-Sydney is possible, than Moscow-Sydney, Athens-Sydney, etc. should be as well. However, no direct flights from major cities such as London, Frankfurt, Amsterdam or Paris would be possible with equipment available nowadays.
I am not sure however werether flight such long would be permitted (some aviation authorities, I am not sure here about the Lithuanian one, does limit the maximum flighttime).
And I also hate the time wasted waiting for connections, by the way.


User currently offlineBDRules From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2000, 1501 posts, RR: 3
Reply 2, posted (10 years 6 months 4 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 3289 times:

There is already direct flights. They are defined as using the same aircraft from the point of departure to stated point of arrival even if having to make tech or refueling stops.

If you mean a Non-stop flight then not yet but maybe in the future. Regarding profitaility then you never know. Either you can fly 20hrs non-stop for £1000 or with GF from LHR to SYD with 2 stops in which you can strech your legs for £489 rtn. What would people go for???? For an extra 4 hrs id take the stops

Regards

Stu


User currently offlineANA From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2004, 294 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (10 years 6 months 4 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 3219 times:

Sonic

I flew SYD - DXB - LGW on the same aircraft (345), so I have flown direct Sydney - London but not non-stop....right? However, it was on two tickets, so does that still make it direct?

Anders


User currently offlinePe@rson From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 19220 posts, RR: 52
Reply 4, posted (10 years 6 months 4 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 3165 times:

I don't understand why so-called aviation enthuasists don't like flying via other places when they have the time available, and thereby seeing the local aviation. Seems very odd to me.


"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
User currently offlineSonic From Lithuania, joined Jan 2000, 1670 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (10 years 6 months 4 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 3084 times:

Pe@rson, there are several reasons for this. The first is delays and a chance to miss your second flight (this is especially bad if you have connecting flight of other airline). Secondlty, there are long waiting times. Sometimes they are like 10 hours or so. There is not much you can do for this time at the airports - some of which doesn't has good views to runways, by the way. Also, all these "hubs" makes the overall journey longer. There may be "better" enthusiasts than I am, but for me it is hard to concentrate on planes after 24 hours of flying/waiting at airports (e.g. Vilnius-Frankfurt-Madrid-Santiago flight I did).

User currently offlineAirtrainer From Belgium, joined Aug 2003, 1558 posts, RR: 12
Reply 6, posted (10 years 6 months 4 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 3013 times:

Pe@rson you're right... As an enthusiast I would rather choose a multi-stop routing if I had to fly for a long time (hope I will be able one day !!!) but I understand it would interest some people for many reasons...
Would love to fly to A345 leadership SIN-LAX but would also enjoy a stopover in Japan with a regular flight  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
Be well

jef



Life is short : eat dessert first !
User currently offlinePe@rson From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 19220 posts, RR: 52
Reply 7, posted (10 years 6 months 4 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 2949 times:

"The first is delays and a chance to miss your second flight."

Indeed, but if you're flexible enough you can time your flights so as to give yourself the maximum time between flights.

"Secondlty, there are long waiting times."

Indeed, but if you're a spotter or photographer or both then that can, of course, be very productive.

Ah well, each to their own.

I personally will always fly via as many places as possible instead of going for a non-stop service, presuming the option is available. For example, instead of flying LHR-SIN-LHR in November 2003, I flew LHR-MLE-CMB-K UL-SIN-CMB-LHR. Yes, I had long times between connecting (9-13 hours), but by gum it was well worth it - and the airfare was cheaper than what it would have cost to have flown non-stop.  Smile



"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
User currently offlineBDRules From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2000, 1501 posts, RR: 3
Reply 8, posted (10 years 6 months 4 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 2825 times:

ANA,

Thats right you have flown direct from SYD but not non-stop. If you have a stop for a few days or change aircraft then thats not a direct service. Did you have 2 boarding cards?????? If thats the case then maybe. I flew from LHR to BOS via KEF but had to change planes. while when i went to SYD from MAN and LHR I only got a transit card.

Regards

Stu


User currently offlineMotorhussy From New Zealand, joined Mar 2000, 3199 posts, RR: 9
Reply 9, posted (10 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 2701 times:

With either the A345 or 777LR, it would be possible to fly to anywhere in Europe from PER. From SYD or MEL, you'd only be able to reach Talinin, Vilnius, St Petersburg or Moscow (of the majors) and I can't see a great commercial demand for this.


come visit the south pacific
User currently offlineConcordeBoy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (10 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 2662 times:

That's not exactly true...

772LR is expected to be able to op MEL/SYD-FCO, and a few other southern Europe destinations as well.

__________________
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
~ConcordeBoy


User currently onlineRayChuang From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 8005 posts, RR: 5
Reply 11, posted (10 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 2647 times:

I think LHR-SYD non-stop could be possible fairly soon on a revenue flight. The 777-200LR--probably with uprated GE90 engines to carry even more fuel than now--could have a range of around 9,500 nautical miles, more than enough to fly this route non-stop if the plane is configured similarly to what SQ did with their A340-500's.

User currently offlineAhlfors From Canada, joined Oct 2000, 1347 posts, RR: 5
Reply 12, posted (10 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 2601 times:

I think everyone is forgetting the Northern oneworld hub, Helsinki. Wouldn't it be great if Finnair got a few A345s to fly HEL-SYD/MEL with connections to major European cities. They could codeshare with oneworld partners Qantas, British Airways and Iberia. Personally I think it could work, but I doubt it will come into fruition at least as long as Finnair's M11 fettish continues  Big grin

User currently offlineThaigold From Australia, joined Sep 2003, 315 posts, RR: 2
Reply 13, posted (10 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 2433 times:

Well it might not be planned yet but I'm sure if SIA is successful with their SIN-LAX/NYC routes we will see a lot of new ultra long range flights.

I would just love to go straight to Europe from Australia.......



Dunbar Rovers forever
User currently offlineConcordeBoy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (10 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 2247 times:

the question is... would the incentive be enough for the majors to introduce nonstop service.

Take AA/QF for example... they make considerable bank on their SIN stopovers in the Kangaroo route. If any one of them (not to mention all BOTH of 'em) took up a premium-passenger nonstop, it would trash the yields on their remaining 1stops.

__________________
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
~ConcordeBoy


User currently offlineIL76 From Netherlands, joined Jan 2004, 2237 posts, RR: 48
Reply 15, posted (10 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 2211 times:

If possible, I wonder how many people will collapse on arrival due to Deep Vain Trombosis...


User currently offlineJGPH1A From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (10 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 2209 times:

Re nonstops by AY from HEL

AY would no doubt try and squodge in at least 9 seats abreast on the A340-500, and everyone flying nonstop to SYD would die of DVT or suffocation before they got halfway.


User currently offlineTRENT500 From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2004, 97 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (10 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 2147 times:

It has been done. But as a delivery flight. Qantas A330-200,
Tolouse>Melbourne i think. Non stop a little over 20hrs.
But obviously no pax or luggage etc.


User currently offlineOV735 From Estonia, joined Jan 2004, 909 posts, RR: 3
Reply 18, posted (10 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 2140 times:

What's the range of the 7E7 going to be? I've heard that it should be able to do London - Perth, but London - Sydney... don't know. Anyways, as Sonic said above, in theory a flight from Europe to SYD would be possible but I doubt if it would be very profitable when starting from VNO or SVO.

OV735


User currently offlineSonic From Lithuania, joined Jan 2000, 1670 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (10 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 2111 times:

According to Boeing website, 7E7 range will be 14500 km, 7E7SR - 6500 km and 7E7 Stretch - 15400 km .
Of course it could and probably will change as the time passes.


User currently offlineSonic From Lithuania, joined Jan 2000, 1670 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (10 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 2076 times:

It means that:
The farthest destinations out of Sydney for 7E7SR will be Jakarta, French Polynesia
For 7E7 - Tel Aviv, New Orleans, Sao Paulo, Panama City, Brazaville
For 7E7 Stretch - Tallin, Istanbul, Lagos, Caracas, Detroit

Here you can see the map of all three ranges shown from Sydney:
http://gc.kls2.com/cgi-bin/gc?PATH=&RANGE=14500km@SYD%2C+6500km@SYD%2C+15400km@SYD%0D%0A&PATH-COLOR=red&PATH-UNITS=mi&SPEED-GROUND=&SPEED-UNITS=kts&RANGE-STYLE=outline&RANGE-COLOR=navy&MAP-STYLE=

[Edited 2004-02-10 18:15:13]

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