Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
'Flying Tail' question  
User currently offline767-400ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (15 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 1319 times:

What do they mean when they say that the L-1011 is a 'Flying Tail' compare to the DC-10?

Thank you.

23 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineDC-10 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (15 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 1319 times:

It might be pointing out the fact that the L-1011 has more tail/rudder surface area than the DC-10

User currently offlineMirage From Portugal, joined May 1999, 3122 posts, RR: 14
Reply 2, posted (15 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 1319 times:

or maybe because the L1011 engine is almost "inside" the tail and the DC-10 engine is "under" the tail.
Just a question of design, being the L1011 tail more atractive.



User currently offlineMichael McDonal From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (15 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 1319 times:

Actually, the DC-10 has it's engine in the tail (vertical stabilizer), while the L-1011 has it's engine in the tail cone. the round opening that you see on the L-1011 is nothing more than an airscoop to feed the engine. On the DC-10, however, the engine itself is seperated from the fuselage and mounted part way up the tail. I don't know what flying tail refers to, I just wanted to clear that up. BTW, the DC-10 looks better.

User currently offlinejrw From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (15 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 1319 times:

A flying tail is when the whole horizontal tail moves, instead of only the elevators, as on the Piper Cherokee, and also the L-1011.

User currently offlineMirage From Portugal, joined May 1999, 3122 posts, RR: 14
Reply 5, posted (15 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 1319 times:

Well....my english is not very good, so, sometimes I can't explain very well what I want. One picture is worth for one thousand words......here are two pictures.

Mirage, Faro, Portugal


User currently offline767-400ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (15 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 1319 times:

What is the advantage of having the whole horizontal tail move than just the elevators?

User currently offlineDC-10 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (15 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 1319 times:

Actually the DC-10s engine is inside and behind the tail, the L1011's is below it

User currently offlineJETPILOT From United States of America, joined May 1999, 3130 posts, RR: 29
Reply 8, posted (15 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 1319 times:

The L1011 does not have an all flying stabilator. It has a standard horizontal stabilizer and elevator.

User currently offlineDC-10 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (15 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 1319 times:

on both the L1011 and DC-10 both the elevators and horizontal stabilizers move.....they move independently or as a whole...the advantage is of course handling...on take off the whole piece moves to bring the plane to rotate, as the plane climbs out of the airport, there is a trim tab for the elevators to keep the aircraft in a climb so the pilots don't have to continue to hold the stick back

User currently offlineJETPILOT From United States of America, joined May 1999, 3130 posts, RR: 29
Reply 10, posted (15 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 1319 times:

All commercial airliners are like this. The horizontal stabilizer is adjusted by hydraulic jacks. This jack adjusts the angle of attack of the horizontal stabilizer to trim the aircraft. The only way the horizontal stabilizer moves is through the use of the trim wheel. The control yoke has no effect on the position of the horizontal stab.This is called a variable incidence tailplane. The DC10, or L1011, have no trim tabs.

User currently offlineDC-10 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (15 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 1319 times:

interesting.....tell me more....the yoke doesn't control the Hor Stab? How is this not so? Don't they yank back on the yoke when they reach take off speed, and doesn't that move the hor stab into position to pull the rear down and bring the front up to rotate?

User currently offlinejrw From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (15 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 1319 times:

A "flying tail" is more efficient, but is also more complex, especially in large aircraft. And it works as elevator and horizontal stabilizer simultaneously.

User currently offlineDL1011 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 386 posts, RR: 2
Reply 13, posted (15 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 1319 times:

On the L1011, when you move the control column
forward or aft, hydraulic fluid is ported to 4
large actuators that move the horz stab. The
elevators are moved by cables attached to the
aft fuselage and elevator position is a function
of horz stab position. Pitch trim changes reposition the horz stab. On the MD11, fwd/aft
movement of the control column ports hydraulic
fluid to elevator actuators. Pitch trim changes
drive a hydraulic jackscrew that repositions
the horz stab. Hope this helps!


User currently offlineDash8 From New Zealand, joined Aug 2005, 2 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (15 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 1319 times:

DL1011 is right your trim only the stabilizer and you fly with both. The elevators are attached to the stabilizer and move proportionally.
The reason this is done is to remove access drag in all phases of flight. What would you rather have in cruise, a large trim tab sticking out like a sore thumb into the airstream, or a flat "perfect" airfoil? The answer would be obvious.
And of course the faster a plane goes, the more critical drag becomes.
That's my side o' the coin.


User currently offlineJETPILOT From United States of America, joined May 1999, 3130 posts, RR: 29
Reply 15, posted (15 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 1319 times:

I looked at the FOM for the L1011 today. It said no such thing about the horizontal stab moving in correlation with the elevator when the stick was moved. Is it model specific? Where did you get your info? I'm interested.

User currently offlineL-188 From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 29791 posts, RR: 58
Reply 16, posted (15 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 1319 times:

I posted the reasons for a flying tail up a couple of pages. There may be some variation for the specific model but the aerodynamic reasons are the same. To increase the CG range of the aircraft and to prevent a phenonom called "Mach Tuck"


OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
User currently offlineJETPILOT From United States of America, joined May 1999, 3130 posts, RR: 29
Reply 17, posted (15 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 1319 times:

I fully understand the reasons for an all flying stabilizer, and have for a long time. What I posted is that the L1011 doesn't have one.

User currently offlineL-188 From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 29791 posts, RR: 58
Reply 18, posted (15 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 1319 times:

Sorry about that Jetpilot. I was moving a little too fast and didn't change the title topic. That comment was directed at the general population out there.

Sorry about the confusion.



OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
User currently offlineDl1011 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 386 posts, RR: 2
Reply 19, posted (15 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 1319 times:

On the L1011 when the control column is moved, the horz stab moves. Elevators are cable driven and position is determined by horz stab position only. Most other
airliners use a horz stab driven by a jackscrew and elevators driven by hydraulic
actuators.


User currently offlineJETPILOT From United States of America, joined May 1999, 3130 posts, RR: 29
Reply 20, posted (15 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 1319 times:

I asked you where you got this information. It conflicts with the locheed operating manual.

User currently offlineDL1011 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 386 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (15 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 1319 times:

This info comes from the L1011 maintenance manual.

User currently offlineJETPILOT From United States of America, joined May 1999, 3130 posts, RR: 29
Reply 22, posted (15 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 1319 times:

Could you possibly scan it and send it to me? I would be interested to see it. What airlines manual is it?

User currently offlineDL1011 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 386 posts, RR: 2
Reply 23, posted (15 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 1319 times:

How about a fax or by mail?

Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
KLM/AF Flying Blue Question? posted Mon Nov 13 2006 20:57:57 by Ryanair737
Air Atlanta 747 With Different Blue Tail Question posted Mon Oct 9 2006 18:10:12 by MIAMIx707
Pan Am Flying Boat Question posted Tue Dec 4 2001 07:34:28 by Hugo
Flying Time Question? posted Mon Oct 9 2000 10:48:26 by Montenegro
767-400ER flying tail answer posted Wed Mar 10 1999 20:39:07 by L-188
Question For Flying Blue Gold & Platinum Members posted Mon Mar 19 2007 07:46:36 by Goldorak
Hola Airlines 737 Now Flying For Cubana Question posted Sun Jul 2 2006 23:50:34 by LTU932
Flying To GIG Question posted Sun Apr 30 2006 05:05:45 by Tonytifao
Question About Different Tail Units On MD-80s posted Sun Apr 30 2006 04:55:17 by AviationAddict
Flying Through RNO Question posted Sun Apr 23 2006 05:13:40 by Cschleic