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Air France A380 Coming To Beirut In The Summer 07?  
User currently offlineToBEYwithMEA From Lebanon, joined Feb 2004, 304 posts, RR: 2
Posted (10 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 9903 times:

Just got word that Beirut International will get the A380 in the summer of 2007 or 8. That is if MEA have not opened North American Routes (this is coming from my source in Air France). It will re-place the ageing B747 that has been coming to Beirut in the summer. My source say its still to late to tell but has been brought up and thing look good. If all stays the same till 2007 then we could see some A380's at Beirut. As much as I want to see A380's at BEY I want thing to change.
Does any one have anymore info?
What gates are they going to use?




MEA FLYING HIGH AND RETURING TO IT FORMER GLORY!
47 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineDonder10 From Canada, joined Oct 2001, 6659 posts, RR: 22
Reply 1, posted (10 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 9821 times:

Is this with a decrease in the number of CDG-BEY flights to 2 or remaining at 3?

User currently offlineToBEYwithMEA From Lebanon, joined Feb 2004, 304 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (10 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 9743 times:

I have no clue.
But I'm sure in the winter it will remain 3



MEA FLYING HIGH AND RETURING TO IT FORMER GLORY!
User currently offlineBA From United States of America, joined May 2000, 11153 posts, RR: 59
Reply 3, posted (10 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 9611 times:

The Paris - Beirut market is very big and according to one member on this forum who works for Air France, Beirut is Air France's 2nd highest yielding market.

Air France operates service to Beirut jointly with MEA. They code-share with each other.

Below is the year-round schedule:

Beirut (BEY) - Paris (CDG)


Paris (CDG) - Beirut (BEY)


The Air France 747 that they operate to Beirut every year isn't old. They fly the 747-400. In the past, they flew the 747-200, but not anymore.

However, this summer, they will not be flying the 747 because MEA is increasing the Paris service for the summer.

The Friday & Sunday MEA A321 flight will instead be operated on an A330 for the summer, so on those days, you will have 2 MEA A330s and the Air France 777.

If Air France were to fly the A380, they would use the same gates that they use when they fly the 747-400. They'll use Gates 2 and 3 which are the two gates in BEY that are capable of handling the A380:



I've seen the Air France 747 use Gate 1 which is a heavy gate, although it is only a single jetway, not dual jetway while Gates 2 and 3 are dual jetways:


The daily Air France 777-200ER always uses Gate 23 which is a widebody gate used heavily by MEA, Emirates, Malaysia Airlines, and Air France. But I do not think it can support the A380. I believe only Gates 1, 2, and 3 can handle it.


Below you see the Air France 777 parked in Gate 23:

MyAviation.net photo:
Click here for bigger photo!
Photo © Mahmoud Chehab


Here is a good map of the terminal and it shows the gates and what type of aircraft can use each gate:


Beirut's terminal is only 3-years old and has been specifically designed in mind of the A380.

It's been said that Emirates will fly A380s to Beirut during the summer. Currently in the summer, they fly a bunch of 777-300s.

Regards



"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
User currently offlineJmhLUV2fly From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 559 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (10 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 9563 times:

Slightly off topic but I heard today that the a380 will not be allowed into US airspace...is this true at all?
JMH


User currently offlineKorg747 From United States of America, joined Mar 2003, 549 posts, RR: 6
Reply 5, posted (10 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 9532 times:

" I heard today that the a380 will not be allowed into US airspace"

Now that would be sad! But here is boeing's chance(right time) for making an all new 747 if it's true!  Big grin



Please excuse my English!
User currently offlineBA From United States of America, joined May 2000, 11153 posts, RR: 59
Reply 6, posted (10 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 9487 times:

I highly doubt that.............

If it's true, then you will have a lot of pissed off airlines.....

Regards



"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
User currently offlineSpike From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2004, 1170 posts, RR: 5
Reply 7, posted (10 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 9456 times:

Perhaps the A380 would be banned from US airspace as with 600 or so pax, there is bound to be a queue for the toilets at some point.

User currently offlineBehramjee From Canada, joined Aug 2003, 4745 posts, RR: 44
Reply 8, posted (10 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 9367 times:

hahaha...well maybe US doesnt want to risk a fatal crash or attack on a filled up A 380.

But I highly doubt that it will be banned because EU can easily respond back by banning all B 747s in EU airspace as well as B 773s!!!

So this is highly highly unlikely to happen!!!



User currently offlineAirxLiban From Lebanon, joined Oct 2003, 4506 posts, RR: 54
Reply 9, posted (10 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 9357 times:

Behramjee,

But I highly doubt that it will be banned because EU can easily respond back by banning all B 747s in EU airspace as well as B 773s!!!

So what will BA, AF, LH, AZ and several others do with their fleet? Park them offshore?



PARIS, FRANCE...THE BEIRUT OF EUROPE.
User currently offlineFLYSSC From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 7401 posts, RR: 57
Reply 10, posted (10 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 9182 times:

The A380 is said to replace the B772 on AF566 CDG-BEY, on certain days and during the high season.
BEY is a lucrative, profitable, and historical destination for AF, economically, politically, and "sentimentally"... AF has always sent its newest planes to BEY, from the Lockheed Constellation in the late 40s to the Comet, Caravelle, B707, etc... so why not the A380 especially if the traffic can justify it ? Moreover, BEY is with CAI the shortest "long-haul" destination for AF, and this line is often used for training pilots, in-flights control checks etc...


User currently offlineMEA310 From Lebanon, joined Feb 2002, 660 posts, RR: 12
Reply 11, posted (10 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 9142 times:

An A380 at BEY would be a "delicious" sight! I wouldn't count on it before I see the first A380 prototype airborne

MEA310



M5 Fastest Sedan On Earth
User currently offlineToBEYwithMEA From Lebanon, joined Feb 2004, 304 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (10 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 8971 times:

If you want to see some really nice photos at BEY then check out these out
CHECKS THESE OUT ON PLANEPICTURES.NET
HOT!!
phttp://www.planepictures.net/netsearch4.cgi?srch=Chadi+&stype=name&offset=0&range=50



MEA FLYING HIGH AND RETURING TO IT FORMER GLORY!
User currently offlineHorus From Egypt, joined Feb 2004, 5230 posts, RR: 60
Reply 13, posted (10 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 8956 times:

FLYSSC

Does that mean there is a chance Egypt will get AF A380s too. With Air France operating double daily services to Cairo with widebodies, I think it might be a possibilty, right?



EGYPT: A 7,000 Year Old Civilisation
User currently offlineBA From United States of America, joined May 2000, 11153 posts, RR: 59
Reply 14, posted (10 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 8855 times:

Horus,

Air France is going to 12x weekly to Cairo. 6 of them will continue to Saudi Arabia. They are making the Saudi Arabia flights stop in Cairo so the crew sleep in Egypt instead of Saudi Arabia during these unstable times.

When things get back to normal hopefully in Saudi Arabia, they will return to being non-stop rather than via Cairo.

Regards



"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
User currently offlineHorus From Egypt, joined Feb 2004, 5230 posts, RR: 60
Reply 15, posted (10 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 8800 times:

BA

They are 12x weekly but will go up to 13x weekly during the winter, and then 14x weekly next year (according to Al-Ahram). Once the Saudia Arabia flights become direct, frequency to Cairo will remain the same.



EGYPT: A 7,000 Year Old Civilisation
User currently offlineFlyssc From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 7401 posts, RR: 57
Reply 16, posted (10 years 4 months 1 week 22 hours ago) and read 8710 times:

The flights to/from JED and RUH will be operated nonstop again as soon as possible.

As CAI was only served 1/Daily until next summer, Air France will add frequencies to face the increasing traffic; rather than using bigger planes (like the A380) as frequencies are more interesting for an airline working with a logic of a HUB.

BEY is served already by 3 daily flights. A 4h daily flight should be added sooner or later, leaving CDG in the late afternoon, so the flights would cover all parts of the day. As I mentioned above, chances to see punctually the A380 in BEY are real, but more for "promoting" the aircraft, training pilots, etc... than a real capacity need.

If, one day, 4 or 5 daily CDG-BEY are not enough, then you might see the A380 regularly on this route.

AF chose to buy the A380 for this reason. On the busiest routes, AF considers that you can't meet the increasing demand by just simply adding frequencies : where is the interest to have 3 or 4 flights leaving to NRT within 2 hours ?

On the CDG-JFK route, AF will operate 5 daily flights next summer + 1 daily CDG-EWR. There should be 6 daily in 2005... The A380 will be perfect for AF on this kind of route (NRT, JFK, YUL etc...)


User currently offlineMozart From Luxembourg, joined Aug 2003, 2162 posts, RR: 13
Reply 17, posted (10 years 4 months 1 week 20 hours ago) and read 8608 times:

It would be exciting to have the 380 go to BEY, although I am surprised that news like this come out already 4 years ahead. Don't airlines typically say that they will intro new planes on "routes like xxx to xxx", i.e. being more on the examples side than on concrete cities.

Still, glad if it happened. Just a question here, is BEY already 380-ready in terms of taxiways etc?


User currently offlineAmirs From Israel, joined Dec 2003, 1333 posts, RR: 4
Reply 18, posted (10 years 4 months 1 week 19 hours ago) and read 8561 times:

maybe AF 380's to TLV !!!

I'm joking.


User currently offlineToBEYwithMEA From Lebanon, joined Feb 2004, 304 posts, RR: 2
Reply 19, posted (10 years 4 months 1 week 19 hours ago) and read 8504 times:

Mozart,
I think so



MEA FLYING HIGH AND RETURING TO IT FORMER GLORY!
User currently offlineStefandotde From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (10 years 4 months 1 week 18 hours ago) and read 8470 times:

By the way: what exactly is "380-ready"?
long runway, wide terminal, ...?


User currently offlineBA From United States of America, joined May 2000, 11153 posts, RR: 59
Reply 21, posted (10 years 4 months 1 week 14 hours ago) and read 8397 times:

Mozart,

Yes, BEY is fully equipped to handle the A380 in every way.

Stefandotde,

Yes, long and strong runways, wide enough and strong enough taxiways, wide enough gates to be able to support the massive width of the A380, etc.

Beirut has 3 runways, 1 of which was built in 1998 and 1 of which was built in 2001, both designed to handle the A380.

Beirut International Airport completed a massive airport redevelopment program which lasted from 1994 to 2001. It was one of the largest airport redevelopment programs of the 90's and it lasted 7 long years. The plan is that Beirut will become a regional hub connecting the East and West, competing with Dubai.

It consisted the rehabilitation of several buildings such as the radar building and the construction of several new buildings such as a new fire rescue building and most importantly, a brand new 23-gate terminal replacing the old terminal built in the 50's.

It also consisted of the construction of two brand new concrete runways, runway 03/21 and runway 17/35.

The old one is the one directly parallel to it which is old and gray looking. It was converted to a taxiway when the new 03/21 opened. The new 03/21 opened in 1998.

The new 03/21 is 12,467ft. long (big increase), made of concrete, is HIRL/CL (High Intensity Runway Lighting and Centerline Lighting), and has at least CAT I ILS (I believe it is being upgraded to CAT II or CAT III), it opened in 1998.

When the new 03/21 was completed, the old 03/21 was converted to a taxiway. It was only 10,433ft. long, made of asphault, was only HIRL (High Intensity Runway Lighting), and didn't have an ILS at all, not even LOC.

17/35 is 11,138ft. long, the one that goes out into sea which is CAT III. It opened in 2001.

Below is the new 17/35:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Salim Helou
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Salim Helou


The old asphault 10,663ft. long 18/36 was kept open, although it isn't used much at all anymore. All the big stuff lands on 17/35 and occasionally 03/21.

The new 03/21 is the runway on the right, while 17/35 is the sea runway on the left, and the old 18/36 is the one that is pretty much completely perpendicular in the middle:


Like I said, a brand new terminal was constructed. Phase I which consisted of half of the terminal and Gates 1-12 was completed in 1998 (the eastern concourse), while Phase 2 which consisted of the western half of the terminal and Gates 13-23 was completed in 2000. Total number of gates is 23, 21 of which have jetways, 2 of which are dual jetways. Gates 4 and 22 are bus boarding gates which are not used at the moment because there is no need.


The photo on the left is what the area looked like in the early 90's (photo was taken in 73, but nothing changed) while on the right is what it looked like in 2000 taken from roughly the same spot on the tarmac.

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Allan Rossmore
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Salim Helou


Here is a nice overview. The runways do not intersect even though runway 18/36 just touches 03/21. The reason for this is so aircraft that land on runway 03 can exit off of the tip of runway 36 when it is not in use (and it is rarely used these days). Both runway 17/35 (the primary landing runway) and runway 03/21 (the primary take-off runway) are equipped to handle the A380s.


The new taxiways and taxiway connecters built for the new runway were specifically built wide enough and strong enough to handle the A380. They were also built out of a high grade concrete making them very strong and long lasting. Many of the old taxiways were refurbished and reinforced as well.

This massive rehabilitation project of the airport which took almost 10 years to complete was done specifically so that Beirut could have a world-class facility able to handle the A380 and hopefully one day in the future compete with Dubai.

Regards



"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
User currently offlineFLYSSC From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 7401 posts, RR: 57
Reply 22, posted (10 years 4 months 1 week 9 hours ago) and read 8314 times:

Mozart,

The A380 is not due to be operational "4 years ahead"...

The first deliveries are scheduled for spring 2006 and AF should operate its first A380 at the autumn 2006, that is to say in 2 years and a half...


User currently offlineBA From United States of America, joined May 2000, 11153 posts, RR: 59
Reply 23, posted (10 years 4 months 1 week 9 hours ago) and read 8268 times:

FlySSC,

What is AF's loadfactor to BEY like?

Regards



"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
User currently offlineToBEYwithMEA From Lebanon, joined Feb 2004, 304 posts, RR: 2
Reply 24, posted (10 years 4 months 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 8190 times:

Check these out
phttp://www.planepictures.net/netsearch4.cgi?srch=Chadi+&stype=name&offset=0&range=15







MEA FLYING HIGH AND RETURING TO IT FORMER GLORY!
25 Horus : BA During 2003 Air France had an average loadfactor of 89% on it flights to the Arab Middle East. Not sure about each destination though. But 89% is p
26 FLYSSC : BA, Here are some figures concerning AF at BEY : 65% of AF's PAX on CDG-BEY-CDG are in Transit on another AF flight at CDG : 25% to Europe, 25% to Nor
27 Horus : FLYSSC Do you have facts and numbers on AF's Cairo operations?
28 BA : Interesting FlySSC. Thanks for the detailed info! I noticed that the number of seats the airlines "own" on each others flight is split evenly. So will
29 Horus : BA Does this mean the price of tickets with both airlines are the same?
30 BA : According to Trip.com, if you buy the seats through MEA, it is more expensive. Regards
31 Horus : How much more expensive? What are fares like on the routes (all classes)?
32 BA : How much more expensive varies depending on the day. However, all 3 flights are the same price when bought from either MEA or Air France, but if you b
33 Horus : BA Shokran FLYSSC Do you have facts and numbers on AF's Cairo operations?
34 Post contains images FLYSSC : Horus, I'll try to get some figures concerning CDG-CAI tomorrow...(I have to go to CDG to work tomorrow ) BA M.E.A was supposed to codeshare ALSO in F
35 Horus : FLYSSC That would be great! Whats wrong with working in CDG, I wouldn't turn down the chance to work in an airport (though it does depend on the job).
36 ToBEYwithMEA : Shou Cedar Class is not good enough
37 Post contains links and images ToBEYwithMEA : YA Hours, Yeah AF do have sleeper seats on the 777-200ER which are the aircraft that fly to BEY and CAI. And since your the only Egyptian on a.net, ho
38 Horus : ToBeywithMEA Tislam. They look very comfortable, but not as nice as those used by BA, UA, AA and QA. Its not difficult taking photos at CAI though you
39 ToBEYwithMEA : Sukran ya Hours. I asked becasue I plan on going to CAI in april, Should I go MEA or Eqypt Air. Shoufo, Hours will tell me Egypt Air and ال
40 Post contains images Horus : ToBeywithMEA Yahala yahala Hahaha Ah well its upto in the end, Egyptair or MEA-That is the question! p.s. Egyptair off course-no competition Seriously
41 AirxLiban : there was another guy, EA777, wonder what happened to him.
42 Post contains images FLYSSC : Hi Horus ! I am back from work... There is nothing wrong working at CDG...Well, I am working for AF as a Flight Attendant and I am based at CDG. Today
43 Horus : FLYSSC Thanks for all the information. AF will be increasing their flights to double daily next year too. If AF lost market share, why didn't they lau
44 Post contains images FLYSSC : Horus, To answer your question : AF didn't add flights to CAI this summer because...we didn't have enough planes ! AF is going to receive soon the bra
45 Post contains images Horus : FLYSSC Will the B777-300ERs be used on any flights to the Middle East, perhaps at the start to train pilots maybe? About AZ they fly 2x daily out of M
46 FLYSSC : Horus, The A319LR are configured in two class : 28 Business / 54 Economy I have some pics of the aircraft interior, I can mail them to you if you are
47 Post contains images Horus : FLYSSC That would be great if you email them to me, can't you post them on the forum? I suppose Kish will work then! Have you been able to get the loa
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