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Is The 737-800/900 Totally Ruled Out For WN?  
User currently offlineJohn From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 1374 posts, RR: 5
Posted (10 years 1 week 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 4127 times:

Just wondering when or IF they will ever consider larger equipment, since they continue to add more transcon flying to their schedules. It would seem to make sense, anyway....

22 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineDfwRevolution From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 912 posts, RR: 51
Reply 1, posted (10 years 1 week 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 4103 times:

It is possible, but I doubt it would happen. WN ordered the 735 back in the 80s/90s which was a breakaway from the 733. However, opperating a 738 or 739 would require an additional FA which would upset WNs crew flexibility. I don't think lack of capacity is a huge issue at WN either.

Regards,
DFW


User currently offlineCkfred From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 5065 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (10 years 1 week 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 4083 times:

I've heard that the problem is that the -800 and -900 need a fourth F/A. The rule is one F/A for every 50 seats. So, if there is a last-minute change of aircraft to a larger 737, then crew scheduling has to scramble to find a fourth F/A.

User currently offlineGigneil From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 16345 posts, RR: 86
Reply 3, posted (10 years 1 week 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 4055 times:

Again, I don't think they'd necessarily fill it with seats.

Their 73Gs are capable of holding a great deal more people than they currently seat onboard. Its reasonable to believe if they operated a 738, they'd just do so with 149 people aboard.

N


User currently offlineCOAB767 From Guam, joined Nov 2003, 1377 posts, RR: 9
Reply 4, posted (10 years 1 week 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 3991 times:

A 738/739 requires a 4th f/a. WN isnt interested in having more than 3 f/as on any of their flights. It's just easier for them. Plus the 73G have the range to to fly transcontinental flights. If CO can fly from EWR-SEA, and vice versa on a 73G, then WN can do the same. So I don't see WN ordering any 738s or 739s in the future.


Continental Micronesia: "Fly With The Warmth Of Paradise"
User currently offlineSwacle From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 368 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (10 years 1 week 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 3953 times:

I don't know that it ever will happen, but I think there is a much greater possibility that you will see -800's in our fleet than RJ's. If WN were to expand to another aircraft type, it would be planning ahead, not for the present, so I think a larger aircraft rather than a smaller one would be ordered....


Aircraft Flown: SF3 DH8 DH4 328 ERJ CRJ CR7 CR9 E70 E75 D9S M80 712 72S 732 733 734 735 73G 738 739 739ER 752 318 319 32
User currently offlineA340Spotter From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 1977 posts, RR: 24
Reply 6, posted (10 years 1 week 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 3856 times:

Regarding the 738/900 needing a 4th flight f/a, that's only if the configuration is 150 seats or more...as Gigneil mentions, they could fly it with 149, but that wouldn't be practical under their business model.

JD



"Irregardless, it's a Cat III airplane, we don't need an alternate!"
User currently offlineYyz717 From Canada, joined Sep 2001, 16228 posts, RR: 57
Reply 7, posted (10 years 1 week 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 3837 times:

If WN ever becomes slot constrained in a signif market such as LAX or MDW, I could see WN ordering a small fleet of 738/739 to be based at just that one market.


Panam, TWA, Ansett, Eastern.......AC next? Might be good for Canada.
User currently offlineGreaser From Bahamas, joined Jan 2004, 1092 posts, RR: 4
Reply 8, posted (10 years 1 week 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 3813 times:

What's the point of placing 149 seats in a 738??? Unless there will be a 738 Combi (unlikely) or Southwest Business or Southwest Executive starts up. For $20 more, you get wider seats and 39" pitch!!!


Now you're really flying
User currently offlineYyz717 From Canada, joined Sep 2001, 16228 posts, RR: 57
Reply 9, posted (10 years 1 week 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 3801 times:

Incidently, where does WN fly their small fleet of 20 735's? Throughout their system? Or are they based in Texas only?




Panam, TWA, Ansett, Eastern.......AC next? Might be good for Canada.
User currently offlineOPNLguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (10 years 1 week 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 3755 times:

>>>Incidently, where does WN fly their small fleet of 20 735's? Throughout their system? Or are they based in Texas only?

Actually, there are 25 of the -500s in the fleet, and they go just about everywhere except on the really long-haul flights...

As far as possible -800s/-900s go, the -700 actually has the best range/payload balance of any of the NG variants, and (IMHO) I think we'll be staying with those for commonality reasons. Starting with April deliveries, new -700s are also coming equipped with the more powerful -B24 engines, and all -700s already in the fleet will be upgraded over the next few months.

I think this performance upgrade for the -700s should pretty much quash the -800/-900 rumors (until next time someone brings it up again, that is...)


User currently offlineAirframeAS From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 14150 posts, RR: 25
Reply 11, posted (10 years 1 week 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 3701 times:

Will WN get -600s to replace their 735s? Will that happen?


A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
User currently offlineDan2002 From United States of America, joined Dec 2002, 2055 posts, RR: 5
Reply 12, posted (10 years 1 week 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 3605 times:

"Will WN get -600s to replace their 735s? Will that happen?"
LOL, I dont think so, the 735's have fewer capacity and greater range, the 736 can cram 2 more pax into it but has shorter range, and it obviously doesnt fit very well into the markets in the USA.


-Dan



A guy asks 'What's Punk?'. I kick over a trash can and its punk. He knocks over a trash can and its trendy.
User currently offlineThrust From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 2686 posts, RR: 10
Reply 13, posted (10 years 1 week 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 3582 times:

Don't the -800s and -900s require an extra F/A? The extra length also cuts the airplane's range too. But WN would have no problem's filling them up, plus if they install winglets, it might be beneficial. But the -700s already serve WN's needs, especially now that a respectable number have winglets. Does WN plan to install winglets on all of its -700s? I hope so. Have you noticed how much bigger they look head-on with winglets?  Love  Smile/happy/getting dizzy


Fly one thing; Fly it well
User currently offlineAsuflyer05 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 2371 posts, RR: 3
Reply 14, posted (10 years 1 week 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 3561 times:

Does WN's average load factor warrant a larger aircraft? The 73Gs have all the range they need for a transcon. Plus they seem to like to add frequency w/smaller aircraft over less frequency w/bigger aircraft.

Matt


User currently offlineBoingGoingGone From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (10 years 1 week 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 3530 times:

The 737-800/900 would require addition crew increasing crew costs. In addition, SWA's hourly aircraft costs would be significantly impacted due to increased turn times with these aircraft. These costs cannot be offset in their fare structure by the seats. So the answer is no.

User currently offlineThrust From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 2686 posts, RR: 10
Reply 16, posted (10 years 1 week 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 3521 times:

Will WN eventually give all of their -700s winglets?


Fly one thing; Fly it well
User currently offlineBarney Captain From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 885 posts, RR: 13
Reply 17, posted (10 years 1 week 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 3438 times:

"Will WN eventually give all of their -700s winglets?"

Yes, all 700's will get winglets. I believe the deliveries starting in mid 05' will come from Boeing that way, until then, they are all after delivery mods. The latest from training is that the fuel savings for the -300 is even better than the -700, so we may see them on the -300 as well.......



...from the Banana Republic....
User currently offlineChiGB1973 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 1612 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (10 years 1 week 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 3411 times:

What is with the 149 seats?

150 is 3 F/As.


User currently offlineYyz717 From Canada, joined Sep 2001, 16228 posts, RR: 57
Reply 19, posted (10 years 1 week 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 3381 times:

The 737-800/900 would require addition crew increasing crew costs. In addition, SWA's hourly aircraft costs would be significantly impacted due to increased turn times with these aircraft. These costs cannot be offset in their fare structure by the seats. So the answer is no.

Perhaps, but if WN is unable to grow in some markets due to slot constraints, it may fine it more cost effective to operate larger aircraft than to purchase/lease addl slots or not to grow at all.





Panam, TWA, Ansett, Eastern.......AC next? Might be good for Canada.
User currently offlineDfwRevolution From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 912 posts, RR: 51
Reply 20, posted (10 years 1 week 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 3363 times:

Perhaps, but if WN is unable to grow in some markets due to slot constraints, it may fine it more cost effective to operate larger aircraft than to purchase/lease addl slots or not to grow at all.

One of WN's philiosphies is to fly into smaller airports rather than big-city mega airports. There are exceptions to this, like LAX, but WN usually avoids slot constrained airports. And I really don't think there are any U.S. airports with domestic slot restrictions that would interfer with WN.


User currently offlineTxAgKuwait From United States of America, joined Aug 1999, 1803 posts, RR: 43
Reply 21, posted (10 years 1 week 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 3289 times:

WN stays with the -700. here's why (some of these have been mentioned):

1. Commonality. Samne capacity as their -300s. Something breaks, plug and play with another aircraft. No trying to fit 149 passengers on a substitute 137 seat airplane.

2. Frequency. If loads get high enough to where they need more seats.....don't run 5 flights a day with 149 seat planes, run 6 trips a day with 137 seat planes. Frequency always sells.

3. Efficiency and economies of scale. Yes, the -800 or -900 is a lot like the -700. But they aren't EXACTLY the same. The -700 does everything WN wants it to, does it well, so there really is no reason to add another variant. Why have 400 -700s and 100 -800s in your fleet when you can get 520 -700s for the same price?


User currently offlineGigneil From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 16345 posts, RR: 86
Reply 22, posted (10 years 1 week 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 3221 times:

What's the point of placing 149 seats in a 738???

The same as only seating 137 in one class on a 73G, while Easyjet seats what, 167 on an A319?

M


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