OmShanti From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 65 posts, RR: 0 Posted (11 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 3834 times:
Reading the several prev. post regarding USAir and Southwest's sucess in each and every market and the danger it poses to other carrier...I want to know whos side you are on or should there even be sides. I would hate to see USAir go out of business because of Southwest but is that a valid grudge against Southwest, who has changed the idea of travel and passed the savings to travelers, and in some cases made FLYING possible for some.
What are your thoughts on this matter. Is there something SW would be responsible for if USAir goes out of business or is it just plain business??
Pe@rson From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 19451 posts, RR: 52
Reply 2, posted (11 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 3796 times:
It's competition. Nowadays only the 'fittest' airlines exist. Who are the 'fittest' I hear you ask - the ones which are well-run. Some will fail and some will suceed. Some will change the course of history and some will be bog-standard and do little. It's business. If you have competitors you take care of them the best you can, for they are a threat to your success.
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
ATLhomeCMH From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 770 posts, RR: 3
Reply 3, posted (11 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 3770 times:
USAirways is simply the victim of a general American attitude that saving money is number 1, not the overall experience of the flight. The majority of Americans figure that since the amenities offered by the major domestic carriers have been scaled back in recent years, they might as well get the same service for less money. Good philosophy, in theory, but seldom in practice to my experience.
Basically, you get what you pay for. The famous saying, "There's no such thing as a free lunch," applies here. You may be saving money, but you'll pay for it elsewhere for sure.
Every SW aircraft I've ever been on (several of them) has been shoddy, unkempt, and SW's terminals and gates less than eye-catching. On some routes, you make stops in two seperate cities before your final destination, like you're riding on a charter bus.
Basically, SW is the Greyhound of the skies.
I also don't like the fact that on many SW flights, you have to put up with f/a's who joke around, goof off, sing songs, and just to try to be cute. It's unprofessional.
But Americans will put up with a lack of professionalism for the almighty dollar. I have flown US extensively, and though they may cost more, their planes are almost always fresh and clean looking, their staff professional, and their service impeccable. I would rather pay the extra $150 (and I am NOT a wealthy person) to fly with a proven industry leader, than fly on a dirty, cheap cabaret with wings.
[Edited 2004-04-15 01:48:48]
"The most terrifying words in the Engligh language are, 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'"-Ronald Reagan
US AIRWAYS From United States of America, joined May 1999, 432 posts, RR: 3
Reply 7, posted (11 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 3656 times:
I'd have to honestly say that I'm backing US Airways all the way. PHL is my home airport, and I've been flying on them ever since I was 7 years old. I've never had a problem while flying with them.....ever. That may be hard for some people to believe, but it's true. I know at some point I'm going to want to try Southwest just to see what all the hype is about, but I know that if I had to head up to a place like PVD or something, I'd still choose US Airways. The last thing I want to see is US go under. I do believe that if they bring in some new management and some fresh ideas they will succeed and ultimately fend off Southwest.
Vctony From United States of America, joined Aug 1999, 461 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (11 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 3593 times:
I don't get all of this anti-WN sentiment. I live in PHX (their second largest operation) and I haven't seen any of this "shoddy aircraft, gates, etc." to be true at all. WN flies out of Terminal 4 in PHX, the NEWEST and NICEST terminal at the airport, US flies out of T2 which is the "shoddiest, oldest" terminal at the airport as a means of comparison. Ever been to STL (the former TWA current AA terminal is dark, dreary, and has a unique "musty" scent where the WN terminal is new, bright, and clean. WN has the NEWEST gates in the old "terminal from hell (LC Smith/JM Davey complex)" at DTW, as well as several of the newest gates at BWI, MDW, ONT, etc. Also I do think that WN has one of the largest outstanding orders for NEW 737s out of any carrier, meaning that every month from now into the forseeable future BRAND NEW aircraft will be constantly entering their fleet. Every WN flight I've been on has some of the most professional pilots and flight attendants ever (I've run into some really bad ones on HP). Although I've never flown US, and I do think that US is a good carrier, WN's product isn't all that much inferior for the average traveler and it IS much cheaper. I'm sorry but I just can't see how the almighty dollar cannot rule, I always book with the lowest fare carrier, it's just common business sense.
Ltbewr From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13555 posts, RR: 17
Reply 11, posted (11 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 3567 times:
WN is responding to the demand for reliable, always reasonably priced flights. US is right now in the bullseye of WN, other LLC's as well as other majors or their regional partners. Many of the markets US serves in the northeast USA are places losing population and the business pax that really support legacy/majors like US.
I am not angry with WN, but angry with US's management, their failure to change their routes and marketing, and perhaps 'downsize' a bit to face reality. While I have problems with the possible end of US, the market is speaking, which is the 'American way". I don't think we want to have our tax monies subsidise (any more) inefficient majors or overregulate to overprotect the majors.
GSPSPOT From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3287 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (11 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 3527 times:
I'm on US's side. I still favor "full-service" or legacy carriers. Besides, US (more accuately US Airways Express) is the major carrier at my home airport with 30-ish flight a day. What would happen if that all went away? We have nonstops to all US hubs plus RDU, LGA, DCA with US.
NIKV69 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (11 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 3495 times:
I believe WN started in 71'
USAirways will be dead in a few months due to a few factors, 9/11, poor management, huge debt and the evolution of the LCC. USAirways must be eliminated. It is the nature of the beast. No cost cutting or employee concessions are going to save them know. Especially with WN coming to Philly. Sad as it is, this can't be avoided. USAirways huge amount of debt is the final nail in their coffin. I wish them luck but just can't see them surviving. You can't blame WN, or Jetblue or any other carrier for that matter. As much as the hardcore aviation enthusiast hates this, the average passenger doesn't care about Boeing or Airbus, this plane or that one, they want the cheapest fare to get from this place to that place. WN does this better than anyone and at the best price.
N628AU From United States of America, joined Oct 2000, 353 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (11 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 3441 times:
Southwest is just 6 years younger than US silly. USAir: Born 1968 Southwest: Born 1974 (or was it 71 or 72?)
US actually traces it's roots back to the 1920s as All American Airways (an air mail carrier at the time). A bigger problem they have is the old fashioned union contracts. The mechanics scope clause with the IAM goes back to 1949.
Aa757first From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 3350 posts, RR: 7
Reply 17, posted (11 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 3389 times:
US Airways side. I think people are thinking of WN as the little guy still. Its funny to see people outraged at AA for buying TW and killing them and all, but still support WN, displacing US Airways in California, BWI and now PHL. Let's face it: WN wants US dead.
Airtran737 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 3731 posts, RR: 11
Reply 18, posted (11 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 3372 times:
US needs to look into the mirror to find the person to be mad at for them going out of business. It really stinks that thousands of workers stand to lose their jobs, but that's how business works. One of the big six needed to die, and it looks like the bell has begun to toll for US Airways.
Nice Trip Report!!! Great Pics, thanks for posting!!!! B747Forever
CMB320 From United States of America, joined Oct 2000, 421 posts, RR: 5
Reply 19, posted (11 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 3348 times:
I understand the sentiment attached to an airline for different people. If you love US Airways, I'm sure you're very sad about what's happening.
However, you can't let that override common sense. US Airways is not going out of business because of Southwest. US Airways has been struggling for years... thus, they have had years to do something about it. They can't compete, so they're dying. It's like animals in the wild... the strongest and fastest survive. US Airways may have been strong enough to survive this long, but they're not fast enough... and a faster cat is gonna get 'em.
As someone mentioned above, you do want a little comfort along the way. Yeah, so do I. But what is US Airways offering in comfort that any other airline is not? If I want to fly from PHL to LAX, I can fly America West first class and get fabulous comfort for a reasonable price, or I can fly US Airways coach and get the same uncomfortable crappy service that most Legacy carriers offer. THEY CAN'T COMPETE AND THEY'RE NOT TRYING TO AT ALL. I don't see US Airways doing anything that will keep them afloat. Nothing.
I'm certainly sorry that US Airways is struggling so much... it's sad that so many people will lose their livelihoods. However, US Airways has been struggling for so long... it's time to turn off the life support.
727200er From Canada, joined Mar 2004, 318 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (11 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 3345 times:
Personally I agree that you can't blame WN for doing the things that make them money. Those of you who prefer a better experience can pay the extra and fly the legacy carriers. The rest of the people can cram themselves into the LCCs. I hate cattle class but I will put up with it on short hauls. I think I will be flying more on Jetsgo here on Canada though. $25 to get legroom
"they who dream by day are cognizant of many things which escape those who dream only at night" - Edgar Allen Poe
MATURRO727 From Colombia, joined Apr 2004, 306 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (11 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 3335 times:
I think this is a world of competition and the strongest have to survive and it's very sad the hole deal of US but the thing of WN is impressive, they had changed the way of fly and made easier to some people to fly as my friend OmShanti said, so the strongest is the survivor.
ERJ From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 245 posts, RR: 2
Reply 22, posted (11 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 3319 times:
I'm a bit annoyed at Southwest moving into Philly. I really don't like Southwest. I have flown them and I really, really did NOT like the experience. The unprofessional atmosphere made me very uncomfortable. F/A's joking during the safety briefing is not cool.
I am bitter about WN 'hunting' US. The fares aren't even cheaper for the lesser product on WN. I plugged in some random dates for May for PHX-PHL and WN was $80+ more expensive than US, DL, HP, AA, UA or NW.
Another reason I hope US survives, all the regional and Int'l flights. Southwest isn't going to replace those flights.
Rjpieces From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (11 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 3303 times:
While I totally respect WN's decision to enter PHI, I do feel badly for US, which IMO is a fine airline. And I don't think they will go under, I think they will continue to exist in some form, but on a much smaller scale of an airline than they are now and in different markets.
They should refocus their entire operation out of CLT with a good mix of 32X, RJs, and 330s. No sense in wasting assets fighting WN when WN is going to win one way or the other.
Also, WN entering PHI is also a huge slap in the face of B6. It is WN saying "We aren't afraid to enter major airports," it is one less major market for B6 to enter in the near future, it is a warning shot to JetBlue.