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Horizon At OMA?  
User currently offline5280AGL From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 414 posts, RR: 1
Posted (10 years 3 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 3104 times:

Does anybody know why a Horizon CRJ (QXE4332) was in Omaha today? I know there have been rumors for quite awhile about them entering the market, could this be a sign of things to come?

43 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineDSMav8r From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 579 posts, RR: 7
Reply 1, posted (10 years 3 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 3065 times:

Good question...The Horizon CRJs have been flying in here for the past 2-3 days, all operating 4000-number flights between Denver and Omaha. My guess would be proving runs or pilot training, but, it does seem a little strange that they would choose that particular route. Omaha will get Horizon/Alaska, it is just a matter of when.


To most people, the sky is the limit. To those who love aviation, the sky is home
User currently offlineAAJAXFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (10 years 3 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 3046 times:

It isn't operating a Frontier Jet Express flight?

User currently offlineAAJAXFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (10 years 3 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 3035 times:

From Frontier's website... it's scheduled.

4332 DEN
5:41 pm
ABQ
6:40 pm
Delayed

4332 OMA
6:27 pm
DEN
6:34 pm
In Air


User currently offlineDash 80 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 309 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (10 years 3 months 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 3012 times:

Yeah, Horizon started flying Frontier Jet Express to OMA I believe on the 10th of this month. It's the whole reason Frontier relocated from Gate 3 to Gate 9. Gate 3 used to serve all the aircraft in Frontier's fleet (which isn't much), but it would not go down to the CRJ. Gate 9 does them all. It's been nice having them here so far. Hopefully it will lead to nice little relationship between OMA and Horizon that will entice Alaska Air to give it another look.


...where the rubber hits the runway...
User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25004 posts, RR: 85
Reply 5, posted (10 years 3 months 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 2971 times:
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It's nothing to do with Horizon. They simply provide the planes and the crews and get paid on a cost plus basis.

Frontier does all the scheduling, selling, etc., gets the profit if there is any and stands the loss if there is one.

cheers

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineInnocuousFox From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 2805 posts, RR: 14
Reply 6, posted (10 years 3 months 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 2895 times:

"that will entice Alaska Air to give it another look."

That would be a good thing. We are a little thin on westbound options right now. We could use Alaska/Horizon around here.



Dave Mark - Intrinsic Algorithm - Reducing the world to mathematical equations!
User currently offlineASBOIRR From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 55 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (10 years 3 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 2865 times:

I haven't heard anything about OMA but I would seriously doubt AS would fly there. It would most likely be QX.

Anyways, about the planes. Horizon still seems to mix things up. Recently while I was waiting for a QX flight to SEA, a F9 Express pulled up operating as a regular Horizon flight from PDX.


User currently offlineInnocuousFox From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 2805 posts, RR: 14
Reply 8, posted (10 years 3 months 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 2812 times:

"I haven't heard anything about OMA but I would seriously doubt AS would fly there. It would most likely be QX."

And why would that be?



Dave Mark - Intrinsic Algorithm - Reducing the world to mathematical equations!
User currently offlineDash8tech From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 732 posts, RR: 5
Reply 9, posted (10 years 3 months 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 2720 times:

Simple, we're still in the process of getting all the F9 Express aircraft painted and stickered so if one of the F9 livery birds is broken we'll sub in one of regular QX line as a spare if available. That is what you're seeing when our regular paint-job jets are showing up waaaaaay out there on F9 flight numbers.

Cheers!


User currently offlineInnocuousFox From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 2805 posts, RR: 14
Reply 10, posted (10 years 3 months 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 2629 times:

I may have to slip down to the airport and see if I can track one down. Do they still show up as FFT#### on the ATC stuff?


Dave Mark - Intrinsic Algorithm - Reducing the world to mathematical equations!
User currently offlineAAJAXFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (10 years 3 months 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 2610 times:

Why would it show up as FFT? It isn't Frontier Airlines operating the flight. Air Wisconsin doesn't show up as UAX or whatever to ATC whether it's operating AirTran or United... always uses their own Air Wisconsin code.

User currently offlineInnocuousFox From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 2805 posts, RR: 14
Reply 12, posted (10 years 3 months 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 2577 times:

Duh. I didn't even think about that. The funny thing is, I have a massive Flight Explorer filter set that has the different regionals colored the same as the parent they fly for... so I already knew that the regionals show up differently. My brain hurts today.


Dave Mark - Intrinsic Algorithm - Reducing the world to mathematical equations!
User currently offlineLambertMan From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 2070 posts, RR: 36
Reply 13, posted (10 years 3 months 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 2565 times:

I would probably have to agree with ASBOIRR, OMA isn't quite ready to support a flight to SEA on AS. Maybe QX would be more suited to the market. Just an opinion from a complete AS outsider, AS739x would probably be the guy to ask. I think for AS destinations he listed previously on this site it was something like SLC, MSY, ATL, PIT, and STL.

Fox, if you are looking for more westward options, maybe F9 would consider including OMA in its LAX expansion.


User currently offlineInnocuousFox From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 2805 posts, RR: 14
Reply 14, posted (10 years 3 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 2540 times:

Actually, I wouldn't mind WN to SJC or LAX.


Dave Mark - Intrinsic Algorithm - Reducing the world to mathematical equations!
User currently offline5280AGL From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 414 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (10 years 3 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 2519 times:

I have to agree with LambertMan as well, I am not sure if OMA could support AS mainline to Seattle...Unless, AS were to enter another midwest market as well (STL for example) and run a STL-OMA-SEA flight. But, I don't see any real benefit of doing that. QX 2x daily, OMA-SEA seems like a good place to start.

As long as we are talking about west coast routes, the LAX run is the one that needs to come back. Despite what Midwest said (they were obviously leaving regardless of how the OMA hub or LAX route was doing, KC gave them a sweeter deal), everyone I ever talked to said the LAX loads were very good. Hell, you figure OMA has had nonstop LAX service for what, 25-30 years? That doesn't happen unless the route is profitable.


User currently offlineAAJAXFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (10 years 3 months 4 days ago) and read 2484 times:

Hell, you figure OMA has had nonstop LAX service for what, 25-30 years? That doesn't happen unless the route is profitable.

Actually, in the route case where OMA-LAX service initially came about, the airlines were given a choice of where to stop by the Civil Aeronautics Board. It was either Omaha or Des Moines. United chose Omaha. Kind of like why Eastern flew STL-OMA-SEA-PDX and reverse (and OMA-PDX-SEA)... the CAB made them. Can't really say any route before deregulation was profitable based on the length of time it was served. There was also service OMA-SUX, OMA-OLU, OMA-LNK for as long and it wasn't necessarily profitable.


User currently offlineInnocuousFox From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 2805 posts, RR: 14
Reply 17, posted (10 years 3 months 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2439 times:

"There was also service OMA-SUX, OMA-OLU, OMA-LNK for as long and it wasn't necessarily profitable."

Wow... THOSE are rediculous. Especially Columbus.

One reason for the SEA route is that OMA is a very tech-heavy city. I personally have flown to SEA to visit Microsoft on business a few times on various contracts for companies here. Just a thought.



Dave Mark - Intrinsic Algorithm - Reducing the world to mathematical equations!
User currently offlineDSMav8r From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 579 posts, RR: 7
Reply 18, posted (10 years 3 months 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 2417 times:

Those were old Ozark and Frontier "milk-run" routes...None of these routes had anything to do with profitability. The CAB told the airlines where to fly and they did. Which is why you no longer see DC-9s sitting on the ramp in Mason City, Ft. Dodge, Dubuque, or Waterloo these days.  Smile


To most people, the sky is the limit. To those who love aviation, the sky is home
User currently offlineInnocuousFox From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 2805 posts, RR: 14
Reply 19, posted (10 years 3 months 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 2380 times:

Regulation was so stupid.


Dave Mark - Intrinsic Algorithm - Reducing the world to mathematical equations!
User currently offlineAAJAXFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (10 years 3 months 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 2321 times:

Regulation was so stupid.

Depends on your viewpoint. More communities had better air service than they do today. Fares were understandable, and actually lower in some markets. It was also more feasible to fly shorter distances.... like Omaha out to Grand Island for business for the day.

The CAB did make numerous efforts to ween carriers, especially local-service airlines, off of the government subsidies, such as their "use it or lose it" declaration to communities. If they didn't average five passengers a day, the government wouldn't offer a subsidy to stop there.


User currently offlineAirframeAS From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 14150 posts, RR: 24
Reply 21, posted (10 years 3 months 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 2294 times:

QX would never start service to OMA. I think the only reason why some of you saw a QX a/c in OMA is because QX probably leased one of their planes to Frontier Jet Express. Frontier probably ran out of spare aircraft because of this. Also, QX is a regional airline so OMA is way out of their 'range'. As for AS flying to OMA, that wont ever happen, at least for right now. There's no market for a SEA-OMA routing.


A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
User currently offlineAAJAXFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (10 years 3 months 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 2279 times:

Also, QX is a regional airline so OMA is way out of their 'range'.

By the stricted definition you are applying, any destination south of about Eureka is out of their 'range.'

Horizon is no longer a regional, nor is Comair, ASA, American Eagle, ExpressJet, Chautauqua, etc.... they are more appropriately termed "small jet providers" as none of them sticks to the geographic constraints of a regional and some serve more of the country than any major airline (hell, two of them are major airlines: Eagle and ExpressJet).


User currently offlineAs739x From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6090 posts, RR: 24
Reply 23, posted (10 years 3 months 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 2254 times:

N601QX
N604QX
N605QX
N609QX
N613QX
N616QX
N617QX

These are the A/C from Horizon that are currently operating for F9 Express. We do see thse bird rotate in and out per maintance and QX/AS let all the agents know this when this first started to no be surprised about these planes showing up. Some A/C (616,617) are in all white so those are the choice of aircraft that will operate either/or.
Flight will show up on flight trackers with QX4*** flight numbers.

To answer the question of OMA service by Alaska Air Group (AAG), don't count on it. I would expect Wichita to be the first city in the central plains that will be served. but not in the near future!

ASSFO



"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
User currently offlineInnocuousFox From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 2805 posts, RR: 14
Reply 24, posted (10 years 3 months 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 2224 times:

"I would expect Wichita to be the first city in the central plains that will be served."

Why ICT over OMA? The Boeing connection?



Dave Mark - Intrinsic Algorithm - Reducing the world to mathematical equations!
25 As739x : From what I have heard, yes! That is why ICT is on the watch list. but this would be all far down the road. I wouldn't hold your breath on AS or QX (f
26 LambertMan : TWA even had ICT-OMA flights on a S80. As739x, ICT will come before MCI, STL, and OMA?
27 Frugalqxnwa : I doubt AS will start OMA, at least not at first. QX maybe, but even so they would be competing directly against NW, a code-share partner with a hub l
28 InnocuousFox : I know we have been looking for a new airline around here... and it looks like it would be AirTran... although I bet JetBlue could actually make it wo
29 SuperDash : Indeed the current OMA service (2x/day) is Horizon operating as Frontier JetExpress to/from Denver. As for service to Seattle or LA for Horizon from O
30 AirframeAS : I hope that AS goes to ICT rather than OMA....the Boeing connection seems appropriate to put it. TWA even had ICT-OMA flights on a S80. As739x, ICT wi
31 InnocuousFox : "that is a painfully long flight on a CRJ" Good point. CO does OMA to IAH which is about 2:15... even that is kind of obnoxious.
32 Post contains links Mariner : It's just been announced - from July 18, Frontier Jet Express is adding a 3rd flight DEN/OMA,for a total of 2 x Frontier mainline, 3 x express. http:/
33 InnocuousFox : That's still well down from what it used to be. It wasn't long ago that we had a lot of mainline F9 traffic. Probably at least 4 per day... maybe more
34 Mlsrar : Good point. CO does OMA to IAH which is about 2:15... even that is kind of obnoxious. You think OMA-IAH is bad? Try RDU-DEN on a CRJ.
35 Greg : I do iah-oma on coex frequently in the summer since we have a ranch just west of Omaha...it's not bad at all. Beats the heck out of UA through DEN or
36 Post contains images Mariner : Fox: Are you sure about that? I've been following Frontier fairly closely for at least five years, and I don't remember any more than three x daily to
37 InnocuousFox : "I do iah-oma on coex frequently" But it is a helluva lot nicer on the 73s. "Fox: Are you sure about that?" No, I'm not. It just seems like we had mor
38 DSMav8r : The maximum number of daily F9 flights out of OMA was 4...That was back when there were flights to BMI and MSP (97-98?). This new flight is good news,
39 InnocuousFox : I have to agree. More F9 flights to DEN doesn't help us out much at all. Giving us a new non-stop to a highly traveled destination is much cooler.
40 Post contains images Mariner : "More F9 flights to DEN doesn't help us out much at all..." Gosh, that sounds a bit negative, Fox. I hope F9 doesn't cut flights back. cheers martiner
41 Greg : No way...nonstop is King! Not gonna waste my time connecting if I don't have to.
42 AAJAXFlyer : I have to agree. More F9 flights to DEN doesn't help us out much at all. Giving us a new non-stop to a highly traveled destination is much cooler. Mu
43 Rj777 : F9 is growing in OMA, United is shrinking... I hope UA doesn't leave us completely!
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