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Dulles Intl Airport  
User currently offlineUSAir734 From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 57 posts, RR: 0
Posted (10 years 8 months 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 3394 times:

Does anyone know what size operation UAL has there? Could IAD handle the size hub of DL at ATL? What plans are there to expand/update the airport and concourses?

17 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineSQ25J From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 308 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (10 years 8 months 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 3269 times:

IAD has approx 10,000 acres of land and recently paved additional ramp space-believe was for another UA midfield concourse, which I believe has been shelved. IAD is starting to construct underground connector from parking, main terminal to mid-field terminal. FIS facilities are woefully inadequate and what I last heard was they are not being expanded. Obviously Independence Air will merit additional space, possibly Virgin US, but that will probably be extent of IAD expansion. Furthermore they have been debating expanding Metrorail to IAD for decades and it still has not been authorized, which is a drawback for IAD as it is not easy to get to.

User currently offlineFrugalqxnwa From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 565 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (10 years 8 months 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 3216 times:

If you go to you will find literature on plans for a fourthrunway and a new midifeld. UA has had quite a large operation at IAD for quite some time now, ever since they built the first midfield.

User currently offlineFrugalqxnwa From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 565 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (10 years 8 months 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 3155 times:

And here is where I am telling you to go:

http://www.mwaa.com


User currently offlineMoose1226 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 250 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (10 years 8 months 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 3121 times:

I know that work has begun (or will begin soon) on a ramp area for UA Express (since Terminal A is going to be used by Independence Air). That is the only expansion that I know of at the moment besides the new ramp is the automated train system.

User currently offlineCjuniel From United States of America, joined exactly 11 years ago today! , 146 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (10 years 8 months 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 3041 times:

To begin with, Metro DC is served by three major airports (National, Dulles and BWI) as well as extensive train service connecting DC with some of the largest metro areas in the US (Philadelphia, New York and Boston). There is no need for an airline to have a hub the size of Delta's operation in the National Capital Area. In the near term, there probably will be little United expansion at Washington Dulles. However, once United emerges from bankruptcy, I believe we will see United begin to beef up their services in and out of Dulles. With United shutting down their Latin operation in Miami, I would not be surprised to see expansion to Latin America from Dulles. Also, United is adding flights to Zurich from Dulles beginning in June, and I have heard rumors that United is interested in flying to Madrid from Dulles. Regarding access to Dulles, Dulles is 25 miles outside of the city and is not difficult to get to. There is shuttle service from downtown, as well as the West Falls Church Metro station in suburban Virginia, and there is rarely traffic on the Dulles Toll Road if you choose to drive to Dulles from the city. There will be a decision regarding expansion of the Orange Line to Tysons Corner and Dulles before the end of 2004.

User currently offlineStevenUhl777 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (10 years 8 months 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 2942 times:

Cjuniel: Yes...in fact, UA has started IAD-CUN (saturdays only) and the ZRH service is actually a resumption of service, having been discontinued several years ago. If they began flying to MAD, it too would be a restart of previously discontinued service from the '90's. Still, it's great to see ZRH back, and hopefully soon MAD. When I flew through IAD last summer, I noticed they were operating an IAD-EZE nonstop, probably moved up from MIA. Also, ORD has gained a route to EZE as well.

I don't believe we'll see any more 'bricks and mortar' expansion by UA at IAD, but rather some increased service to both int'l. and domestic cities. The fate of US will have a big impact on how UA proceeds at IAD.


User currently offlineCjuniel From United States of America, joined exactly 11 years ago today! , 146 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (10 years 8 months 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 2914 times:

Steven,

I agree 100%. I foresee increased services also. UA has been flying IAD-EZE and ORD-EZE for some time now, and I believe that the Dulles flight was the Miami service at one point. The only way I can imagine United would undertake a huge expansion at Dulles is if US Airways went under, and even then, they themselves would have to be in a much better financial position then they are now.


User currently offlineMoose1226 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 250 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (10 years 8 months 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 2889 times:

UA has also started service to San Jose, Costa Rica (MROC) with the 757, and MEX with the A320 UA also operates nonstop service to Buenos Aires and Sao Paulo (both 763) and Saturday Service to Cancun, in addition. TACA Flies nonstop to San Salvador, El Salvador.

And US has a big presence at DCA, so the Star Alliance will have a stronghold in Washington.


User currently offlineDCA-ROCguy From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 4528 posts, RR: 34
Reply 9, posted (10 years 8 months 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 2779 times:

Several factors make Dulles's future unpredictable right now, it seems to me. The density, type, and distribution of air traffic from IAD will depend on how several items go in the next couple of years.

First, whether Independence Air succeeds. If they do, they will undermine UA's ability to get enough feed on RJ's to support most of its current domestic traffic. If they don't, UA will continue to fly in most pax from medium and smaller markets in the East. That will affect the number of int'l destinations UA can support out of IAD, and the size of a/c used.

Second, as Steven notes, if US makes it or not. If US goes Ch. 7, UA has an excellent infrastructure at IAD ready to absorb US traffic from all three of its hubs. (though a fourth runway would then become needed sooner rather than later, and MWAA has been doing planning work on that).

But that will also depend upon whether another network carrier wants to give it a go at PHL in the face of Southwest. I think NW might be willing to run an MEM-like mostly-RJ hub at PHL, primarily to feed international flights. NW's CASM is lower than US's and they probably could run a smaller hub like that at PHL side by side with WN's presence.

Dulles might be easy to get to from within Virginia, but it's not at all convenient from DC or much of Maryland. Getting to that long and relatively-uncongested toll road from across the Potomac can be real hell at certain times of day. Blue-van shuttle services are expensive and (like the Wash Flyer buses) have to fight their way through traffic, unlike the $5, four-stop MARC train to BWI. I live in Northeast DC and find BWI much, much easier (and usually about 10 minutes faster) to get to. I avoid Dulles like the plague.

Jim



Need a new airline paint scheme? Better call Saul! (Bass that is)
User currently offlineAirportplan From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 469 posts, RR: 3
Reply 10, posted (10 years 8 months 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 2705 times:

"I don't believe we'll see any more 'bricks and mortar' expansion by UA at IAD, but rather some increased service to both int'l. and domestic cities."


United announced a new 'brick and mortar' project for Dulles in January (see link).

http://www.united.com/press/detail/0,6862,51600-1,00.html


User currently offlineCjuniel From United States of America, joined exactly 11 years ago today! , 146 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (10 years 8 months 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 2590 times:

DCA,

I think it just boils down to preference. I live in NW and find Dulles no more difficult to get to than BWI. Traffic on the Parkway is just as bad, if not worse than traffic on 66. Not to mention that awful construction zone they have at BWI right now. If you catch Metro to West Falls Church, you can pick up the Washington Flyer there (not sure about the blue van), eliminating the need to sit in traffic. Since many of my flights involve flying to Denver and the West Coast, I would much prefer to deal with the hassle of getting to Dulles to ensure being on a 763 or 777 on United. If I am flying Midwest or east coast, I fly from National.


User currently offlineDesertJets From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 7811 posts, RR: 16
Reply 12, posted (10 years 8 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 2480 times:

I think one other factor that plays in favor of Dulles long-term growth is the massive population surge in Northern Virginia. The Washington Post reported that since the 2000 Census Loudon County was the fastest growing county in the US. Throw in the growth going on in western Fairfax and Prince William counties, and elsewhere down US 29 and I-66 Dulles' future is looking good. The DC-Baltimore metro region is sufficiently big, population wise and geographically, to support 3 major airports. Plus the economy in NoVA remains fairly strong and weathered the economic downturn reasonably well.

As for the orange line extension we'll see. Apparantly there is some controversy between WMATA and Virginia over a private funding plan that was not opened to public bidding. But in a practical sense the distance from say Metro Center to a Dulles station is pretty far. Making it easily an hour ride or more.



Stop drop and roll will not save you in hell. --- seen on a church marque in rural Virginia
User currently offlineWorldperks From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (10 years 8 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 2382 times:

In addition, I've been on DCA-bound flights actually sent to Dulles because of high winds at National limiting runway usage there. If IAD didn't already exist, we'd have to invent it.  Smile

Even so, traveling between Dulles and National is a special pain because of the routing -- over congested I-495, and down the congested George Washington Parkway. On the plus side, traveling out-bound in the airport-dedicated lanes of the Dulles Toll Road early in the morning, if you drop below 80 mph, you'll get rear-ended. It's hard to miss an early IAD flight.  Smile



[Edited 2004-04-26 17:40:22]

User currently offlinePHLBOS From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 7558 posts, RR: 23
Reply 14, posted (10 years 8 months 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 2325 times:

IAD has approx 10,000 acres of land and recently paved additional ramp space-believe was for another UA midfield concourse, which I believe has been shelved. IAD is starting to construct underground connector from parking, main terminal to mid-field terminal.

The midfield concourse (actually, there was 3 of them planned; Tier 2, 3 & 4) plan stated above was suspended due to the economic downturn following 9/11.

Some airfield paving at the northwest corner of the future Tier 3 building has since been constructed. The underground connector being constructed will eventually become an automated people mover (APM) similar to what ATL has. The APM will ultimately connect the terminal building with the future concourse (tiers). The existing mid-field terminal will ultimately be demolished after the future Tier 2 is constructed.

Given the size potential of the IAD expansion, had the merger with US occurred; you can bet your bottom dollar that any future expansions at PIT and PHL would have been passed over in favor of IAD. UA would've probably dehubbed PIT and PHL because of its relatively close proximity to IAD.

While the terminal expansion plans have been shelved for now; MWAA still has this project in its long range master plan. Whether UA will be the dominant tenant or another airline is anyone's guess at this point.



"TransEastern! You'll feel like you've never left the ground because we treat you like dirt!" SNL Parady ad circa 1981
User currently offlineUsdcaguy From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 1010 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (10 years 8 months 21 hours ago) and read 2175 times:

Any expansion at Dulles would benefit fully from train service to the airport. Public transportation at IAD is virtually nil at one bus an hour. This is a serious problem, as many international visitors coming to the US for the first time get their first taste of America in bus 5A, a ramshackle contraption compared to the sleekness of the Heathrow Express or even CDG's RER. Let's all cross our fingers as airline fans that Northern Virginia will come to its senses and help fund the extension of the Orange Line to the airport.

User currently offlineDesertJets From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 7811 posts, RR: 16
Reply 16, posted (10 years 8 months 6 hours ago) and read 2014 times:

The fact of the matter is that the transportation infrastructure in Northern Virginia and DC metro, just plain sucks. Try going anywhere under 5 miles in less than 20 minutes.

Personally I am not all that convinced that an Orange Line extension from WFC to Dulles is viable at this time, unless there are major changes in the nature and density of the development in that corridor. Plus there are more pressing issues that Metro needs to solve, like another Potomac tunnel between Rosslyn and Foggy Bottom. It is going to be a long ride from Dulles to say Metro Center or L'Enfant Plaza... pretty close to an hour, and Metro can be downright awful during rush hour. I cannot imagine trying to schlep all your luggage onto the train to go downtown. Though I wouldn't wish a ride on a Metrobus on my worse enemy, the bus service could be expanded/improved. And perhaps a viable competitor to the "fine folks" at Washington Flyer could be introduced as well.



Stop drop and roll will not save you in hell. --- seen on a church marque in rural Virginia
User currently offlineLxsaab2000 From Switzerland, joined Feb 2004, 325 posts, RR: 1
Reply 17, posted (10 years 8 months 6 hours ago) and read 1972 times:

In an aviation forum in Italy someone ,with sure numbers about it, says that the new flight IAD/MXP isn't going so well;
medium LF for 1st month of operation (the flight is operated by AZ in codeshare with DL) shows:
127 in Y class
12 in C class
I wish in the next months that the LF will be better!
Hi


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