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Dublin/ Shannon Clause?  
User currently offlinePanAm330 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 2672 posts, RR: 9
Posted (10 years 3 months 4 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 1898 times:

I know that there is some sort of predicament that requires certain flights to stop in SNN on the way to/from DUB. I'm just not sure exactly what flights, which airlines, which aircraft, which destinations it applies to, and so on.

For example, CO has a non-stop on some days from EWR to DUB; sometimes it stops on the way back, sometimes it doesn't. Aer Lingus has non-stops to BWI, JFK, BOS, and LAX. Which have to stop in SNN, or is EI exempt from the clause?

What is the purpose of stopping in SNN? Is it simply because the airport would be otherwise under-utilized, or something else? I appreciate all responses. Thank you.

16 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineBritPilot777 From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2004, 1075 posts, RR: 2
Reply 1, posted (10 years 3 months 4 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 1857 times:

Only reason I can think of is, it increases the number of flights going out to America from Ireland, otherwise you only got Aer Lingus. Not sure the reasoning when coming into Europe though.


Forever Flight
User currently offlineTimz From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 6813 posts, RR: 7
Reply 2, posted (10 years 3 months 4 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 1847 times:

And when did the rule change (in the 1990s?), and what was it before?

User currently offlineSnnams From Ireland, joined Apr 2004, 288 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (10 years 3 months 4 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 1788 times:

Hi all,

The Shannon stopover as we refer to it here dates back to the days when SNN was a necessary port of call on Europe-US flights due to the limited range of aircraft in use back then. When longer range aircraft came on the scene, the Irish goverment enacted this law to protect SNN, so it had a guaranteed source of traffic: ALL flights, by all airlines operating Ireland-US had to stop at Shannon inbound and outbound before continuing on to Dublin, or the US. You must bear in mind (because I know this law sounds crazy) that Shannon is located in what was then quite a poor part of a poor country: Shannon airport was a major driver of growth for the west of Ireland.

However, things have changed. Ireland is now a very wealthy country, but a certain group want this crazy law maintained, continually saying things like "Shannon will die as an airport if the stopover goes". There was already a change in the 90's when direct flights ex Dublin were allowed as long as for every flight into Dublin, there was one to Shannon too. In CO's case, this means serving both airports with one flight in the Winter, but seperate flights to each in Summer. EI, with more destinations can do things differently, so all LAX flights only serve DUB. All ORD flights originate in SNN, but stop in Dublin inbound and outbound, thus giving DUB the benefit of a direct flight. To compensate, all BWI and BOS flights go via SNN.

There have been significant movements to get this changed for years; none of the airlines are happy about it: and DL in particular have threatened to pull out on Numerous occasions. In reality, the goverment wants it gone, but politicians from the Shannon area seem to always hold a balance of power that makes it very difficult to get this crazy law changed. Now, with EU/US negotiations taking place, it is finally being taken out of their hands.

I am from Shannon myself, but a supporter of free and unrestricted access, so I believe this law should go. Dublin will always have higher demand: it's the capital and by far the largets population. I am not worried for Shannon as it too has a strong (but not as large) market, and will, I believe, retain the transatlantic network it needs, as determined by the market forces.

Lastly, this law does nothing to boost the numbers of flights out of Ireland: if anything it limits it. The airlines have talked of adding many new flights out of DUB to the US. The market is there and does not need artificial stimulants, britpilot777.

Evening all!


User currently offlineTimz From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 6813 posts, RR: 7
Reply 4, posted (10 years 3 months 4 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 1759 times:

I'd say Snnams gets the prize for Best Ever Initial Post On A.net.

[Edited 2004-04-27 03:22:43]

User currently offlineSsides From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 4059 posts, RR: 21
Reply 5, posted (10 years 3 months 4 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 1750 times:

I can relate. Being from Texas, I want DFW to thrive, but the Wright Amendment protecting it from long-haul competition at DAL is absolutely horrendous. Sounds like a similar situation.


"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
User currently offlineSnnams From Ireland, joined Apr 2004, 288 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (10 years 3 months 4 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 1740 times:

Why thank you Timz.. I am most flattered and encouraged! I will try to keep up the good work!  Wink/being sarcastic

Oh, and by the way hello to all of you here on a.net  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

[Edited 2004-04-27 03:46:41]

[Edited 2004-04-27 03:55:09]

User currently offlineSnnams From Ireland, joined Apr 2004, 288 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (10 years 3 months 4 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 1676 times:

One other thing I should mention to those of you wanting to sample the delights of the A330...

one nice side affect of this law is that you get probably the worlds cheapest flight on an A330.. SNN-DUB for about $35 each way.. and only 20 minutes flying time! Should you be in Ireland any time soon and be needing to get from Dublin to Shannon/Limerick, it compares with a 3 hour train journey costing about $35 dollars one way or return. Enjoy it while it lasts! (The scenery en route is pretty special too!)


User currently offlineLeviticus From New Zealand, joined Oct 2007, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (10 years 3 months 4 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 1643 times:

Welcome to A.net Snnams !

How long is the DUB-SNN ride anyway, could not be more that 20-25 minutes from takeoff to landing, right ? I was actually planning on trying that trip out last time I was back at the island but in the end I did not have enough time :-(


User currently offlineLeviticus From New Zealand, joined Oct 2007, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (10 years 3 months 4 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 1633 times:

By the way, what if you know that there are going to be low loads, and then buy a ticket from SNN to DUB but do not disembark instead hide somewhere and continue on to the states, assuming you only travel with hand luggage you could cross the pond for 30 bucks  Laugh out loud (oh well not really but it sure sounds good)

User currently offlineM404 From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 2225 posts, RR: 5
Reply 10, posted (10 years 3 months 4 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 1565 times:
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Thanks for the lesson. I took a TWA 707 from JFK to SNN in the early 70s (yes it went on to Dublin) but I was always happy that we got off there. A rented car for a week and their was so much gorgeous country to see that we never even got near Dublin. Snnams I would hope that these same businessmen put the money in advertising and possibly the rental car companies would give a break on dropoff charges and the two airports would have a great lure and reason to use both.

I promise to see Dublin next time.



Less sarcasm and more thought equal better understanding
User currently offlineSnnams From Ireland, joined Apr 2004, 288 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (10 years 3 months 4 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 1471 times:

Hiya,

I can assure you there is already plenty of lure to see both!  Wink/being sarcastic Over the last number of months, Aerlingus have been turning away passengers from flights from both Dublin and Shannon. Over the last two weeks many flights have seen 110% of aircraft capacity turning up at the airport with some obviously denied boarding. The low fares have certainly done the trick! CO too is adding capacity to both DUB and SNN this year, and DL is going back to 777 operation for summer.

For the second year, we will welcome US airways back to SNN and DUB too.

What has changed the situation a lot is that Irish originating passengers are now often in the majority on these services. It was once a case that most passegers were Americans, but the low fares and good (for us!) Euro/Dollar exchange rate mean more Irish than ever before are going stateside. For example, during winter, it was possible to get a one way seat from DUB or SNN to JFK for 99 Euro (about $75) plus tax.... in many cases it was as cheap for us to go to New York as it was to go to Amsterdam!


User currently offlineSnnams From Ireland, joined Apr 2004, 288 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (10 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 1449 times:

Leviticus,

Thank you for your words of welcome!

The flight from DUB-SNN takes about 20-25 minutes depending on runways in use at either. You wont climb much higher than about 10,000 feet, so views are good.

It is pretty impossible to remain on the plane too... Wink/being sarcastic a full, complete security check of the aircraft is done at both airports before it leaves for the U.S. Any passengers in transit must leave the aircraft with all belongings if transiting through SNN, or remain on the aircraft for a full security check on board if transiting through DUB. If you still managed to remain on board through all that, the U.S immigration guys based here in Ireland will then come lookin' for ya!


User currently offlinePlanespotting From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 3527 posts, RR: 5
Reply 13, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 1361 times:

Funny thing about DUB, you actually "enter" the United States at the gate. You pass through US Customs before entering the airplane. Oh and Ireland f*cking rules. Most fun (and beer) i ever had.


Do you like movies about gladiators?
User currently offlineSebwhite From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 1342 times:

Boston gets both BOS and SNN flights in the summer. 3x daily on some days!

User currently offlineBazzaldonbond From Ireland, joined Feb 2001, 95 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 1340 times:

its climbs to fl140 going west and fl150 going east to dublin

User currently offlineSnnams From Ireland, joined Apr 2004, 288 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 1311 times:

Planespotting,

Glad to hear you enjoyed yourself in Ireland  Wink/being sarcastic


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