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CID To Build New Runway, Expand Another  
User currently offlineIowaman From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4358 posts, RR: 6
Posted (10 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 3627 times:
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CID is going to extend runway 9/27 and build a new runway 9L/27R as part of it's expansion plans. Also G4 starts service to LAS on June 24th Big thumbs up Hopefully someday they will get Independence Air in here. Nuts Maybe WN could have a few flights some day out of CID? What do you think? Great News for CID Smile/happy/getting dizzy

http://crairport.org/guide/mapwbbp.htm
http://allegiantair.com/release050304.html


Next flights: WN DSM-LAS-PHX, US PHX-SJD. Return: US SJD-PHX, WN PHX-MDW-DSM
32 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineDbo861 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 880 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (10 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 3601 times:

Any news about when the expansions are going to start? Oh, and if DSM isn't getting any love from WN, what makes you think that they would consider going to an airport an hour away that gets half the passengers each year.

User currently offlinePlanespotting From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 3516 posts, RR: 5
Reply 2, posted (10 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 3595 times:

Yeah unfortunately CID is aways away from seeing WN start service. Why is CID building a new runway and expanding another when they are (primarily) an all RJ airport at the moment, and can handle anything including a 747 with the 9000 and some odd foot runway they have now. Max departures/arrivals /hour nowadays are about 8, with an average/hour even less than that between the hours of airline svc (630am and 1030pm). CID is a very decent airport, and in 5 years i would say will be back to their pre 9/11 configurations and enplanements, but i still see no need for a 3rd runway and a lengthening of the current main runway. How hard has DSM been campaigning for WN service? Have any near iowa airports done much to try and get southwest in....im talking Des Moines, Sioux City, Omaha, Dubuque, Quad City and Cedar Rapids? Haven't heard much talk, doesn't seem there would be much interest from southwest as of yet for these, or jet blue for that matter.


Do you like movies about gladiators?
User currently offlineDbo861 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 880 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (10 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 3571 times:

It's kind of hard for any Iowa airport to attract Southwest, or JetBlue for that matter, when DSM(the most used airport in the state) is having trouble sustaining the service they have. Also considering that Southwest only flies 737s and JetBlue flies 320s, makes it less likely for the 2 airlines to consider any airport in Iowa. The only airline still flying 737s into DSM is United, with their 4-5 daily hops over to ORD, while just about every other airline in the market are pulling their mainline service from DSM and replacing the routes with RJs. Don't get me wrong, I would love to see a/some new carrier(s) in DSM or even DBQ, but I guess we'll just see what happens...

User currently offlineAtcboy73 From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 1100 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (10 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 3557 times:


Hey let the guy dream a little. Looks like it will be a nice layout.

Who knows WN just might come to CID some day, you never know.

I never thought id see the day that all 6 (UA, AA, DL, US, NW, CO) major airlines were reporting BILLIONS of dollars in loses with no hopes of making a profit for yet another year.

I guess anything is possible.


User currently offlineIowaman From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4358 posts, RR: 6
Reply 5, posted (10 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 3546 times:
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Oh, and if DSM isn't getting any love from WN, what makes you think that they would consider going to an airport an hour away that gets half the passengers each year.

True..........

Have any near Iowa airports done much to try and get southwest in....I'm talking Des Moines, Sioux City, Omaha, Dubuque, Quad City and Cedar Rapids? Haven't heard much talk, doesn't seem there would be much interest from southwest as of yet for these, or jet blue for that matter.

WN already serves OMA........... And its pretty obvious the places like SUX, DBQ, and ALO can only really supports RJ's. WN Will probably never serve CID or DSM in the near future, I'm just happy with G4 to LAS so I can visit my Dad Big thumbs up.

As far as the runway expansion, it doesn't really seem necessary does it..... Although it doesn't say "commercial service runway" like 13/31 and 9/27 so maybe it's just for GA

By the way, wasn't there some talk of CO Ex. Coming to CID? They seem very successful to/from IAH to DSM since they just added another one at the beginning of this month.

Also, what's up with DSM? They also are planning a new runway. Wasn't there a 3rd runway at DSM one time that ran parrell with 13/31? Sure seems like it...... Or maybe that was some where else

http://dsmairport.com/PDF/0429%20Project%20Update.pdf

MCW is also planning a runway expansion it was in the paper....

Does Iowa think it's going to see a "Explosive" amount of air travel in Iowa?? I'm going to laugh if they do...

I guess they think these farmers are gonna fly everwhere more often now. Yeah sure  Insane



Next flights: WN DSM-LAS-PHX, US PHX-SJD. Return: US SJD-PHX, WN PHX-MDW-DSM
User currently offlineSwardu From United States of America, joined May 2004, 79 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (10 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 3543 times:

***Planespotting says.."Have any near Iowa airports done muchto try and get Southwest in?....I'm talking Des Moines, Sioux City,, Omaha, Dubuque, Quad City and Cedar Rapids?"*****

Southwest already serves Omaha with about 13 flights per day roughly and has been serving Omaha now for about 6 or 7 years. I doubt CID would be on our radar screen but I could see possibly Des Moines as a target down the road.


User currently offlineDbo861 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 880 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (10 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 3527 times:

Iowaman~

DSM is planning to build a parallel runway to the existing 31/13. Several years back, a parallel runway existed to 31/13, and was used primarily for general aviation purposes, but was closed for some expansion to the cargo complex...I think... anyways, they recently expanded 5/23 and they are in the process of obtaining the land for the future 5000 ft 31L/13R which also is intended for general aviation use as was the previous. I think plans are to eventually extend that runway to 9000 feet.


User currently offlineIowaman From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4358 posts, RR: 6
Reply 8, posted (10 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 3524 times:
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Southwest already serves Omaha with about 13 flights per day roughly and has been serving Omaha now for about 6 or 7 years. I doubt CID would be on our radar screen but I could see possibly Des Moines as a target down the road.

Soon to be 14 flights daily........................



Next flights: WN DSM-LAS-PHX, US PHX-SJD. Return: US SJD-PHX, WN PHX-MDW-DSM
User currently offlineLAS757300 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 261 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (10 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 3506 times:

CID has outstanding facilites...nice terminal, good location (south of the city on I-380 to get closer to Iowa City), decent destinations, and great parking. Which is the reason why DBQ will never be a big time airport in eastern Iowa (NW does not serve DBQ any longer).

Cedar Rapids has some large companies (Archer Daniels Midland, General Mills, and Rockwell Collins) which keep CID going, prehaps this will be their key to growth in the future.



KMSP
User currently offlineInnocuousFox From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 2805 posts, RR: 15
Reply 10, posted (10 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 3492 times:

Funny thing is CID used to get TWA MD-80s from STL.


Dave Mark - Intrinsic Algorithm - Reducing the world to mathematical equations!
User currently offlineCoronado990 From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 1596 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (10 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 3484 times:

Perhaps CID is trying to get some cargo traffic much like DSM and RFD.


Uncle SAN at your service!
User currently offlineIowaman From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4358 posts, RR: 6
Reply 12, posted (10 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 3470 times:
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TWA's MD-80's are now replaced with those tiny tiny Jetstreams  Insane
The only manline is 1 to 2 DC9's to MSP and soon to be G4 to LAS.
We will lose 3 more Sabb's when ATA pulls out this summer. Maybe Airtran would take there place........... ya right who am i kidding.........LOL



Next flights: WN DSM-LAS-PHX, US PHX-SJD. Return: US SJD-PHX, WN PHX-MDW-DSM
User currently offlineIowaman From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4358 posts, RR: 6
Reply 13, posted (10 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 3445 times:
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Maybe Airtran would take there place........... ya right who am i kidding.........LOL

I take that back, I was thinking, Nobody flies to ATL from CID and only Comair from DSM, Comair charges a lot, I would think that would be a gold mine for Airtran. Maybe 2X daily to ATL from CID and DSM and maybe 1X to CO / KMCO), USA - Florida">MCO? And CO Ex to twice daily to IAH? That would make a few non-stop destinations and a variety of carriers.........................



Next flights: WN DSM-LAS-PHX, US PHX-SJD. Return: US SJD-PHX, WN PHX-MDW-DSM
User currently offlinePlanespotting From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 3516 posts, RR: 5
Reply 14, posted (10 years 1 month 3 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 3408 times:

Sorry dude but airtran flies to ATL from MLI (and so does Comair), about an hour and a half away from CID. FL isn't going to try and take away customers from that operation who are making the drive to Moline to fly out on one of their 2 non stops per day. The closest Air Tran has ops to MLI is in BMI (Bloomington Illinois) about a 3 and a half hour drive. You could possibly see FL at DSM in the future, but probably have to wait about 6 months for them to get more of the 737's. Cedar Rapids used to be a pretty decent airport, AA MD-80's, NW DC-9's and Mesaba ARJ's, UAL 733's, TWA DC9's and M80's. I think sun country even flew DC-10 charters in there from time to time. le sigh. All my iowa airports are dying  Sad


Do you like movies about gladiators?
User currently onlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 22679 posts, RR: 20
Reply 15, posted (10 years 1 month 3 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 3374 times:

Planespotting- You are overstating the distance between BMI and MLI. It's about 130 miles, or less than two hours in the car barring delays getting through Peoria. CID is about 90 miles from MLI. It's not inconceivable that FL would serve both, but I don't know how their MLI loads are. Since it's a good 2+ hour drive from DSM to MLI, FL service there is certainly a possibility.


I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineIowaman From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4358 posts, RR: 6
Reply 16, posted (10 years 1 month 3 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 3353 times:
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Sorry dude but Airtran flies to ATL from MLI (and so does Comair), about an hour and a half away from CID. FL Isn't going to try and take away customers from that operation who are making the drive to Moline to fly out on one of their 2 non stops per day. The closest Air Tran has ops to MLI is in BMI (Bloomington Illinois) about a 3 and a half hour drive.

AirTran flies out of IAD, DCA and BWI, and EWR and LGA - much closer together than MLI and CID. On their website though it says travel to CID via MLI. but it has no via for DSM or OMA. I would think AirTran would be more of a possibility for DSM or OMA.

http://airtran.com/destinations/routemap/index.jsp

Just for the heck of it I checked how much Delta (Comair) via their website it was for a flight to ATL. It was $334.80 r/with a plane change in CVG.That was leaving July 1st and Returning July 5th, more than a month in advance. I would think Airtran could have 2X daily into DSM or CID with $99 one way fares to start with and still be much cheaper than Comair, and you wouldn't have to make a connection.

By the way, no wonder ORD is all clogged up with RJ's, CID gets 16 RJ's from there daily. You would think they could put a couple Super 80's in their so they wouldn't have so many RJ's  Confused



Next flights: WN DSM-LAS-PHX, US PHX-SJD. Return: US SJD-PHX, WN PHX-MDW-DSM
User currently offlinePlanespotting From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 3516 posts, RR: 5
Reply 17, posted (10 years 1 month 3 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 3308 times:

Sorry for the distance error i was thinking dubuque to bloomington.....apologies. It does however seem to take about 2 1/2 hrs to get from the quad cities to Illinois State (in bloomington) sometimes. the airport is on the other side of town also.

IAD, DCA, BWI, and EWR and LGA have MUCH higher population densities than central and eastern iowa. The population of one of these places (DC metro or NYC) is greater than the entire state population of Iowa. But you make good points about DSM or OMA, it would be nice to see the green tail and giant "A" in there soon as well.



Do you like movies about gladiators?
User currently offlineIowaman From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4358 posts, RR: 6
Reply 18, posted (10 years 1 month 3 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 3274 times:
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It would be nice to see the giant A in DSM, and the Globe Tail (CO Ex) in CID. Like I said, I know there is some talk about CO Ex. coming to CID.  Big thumbs up


Next flights: WN DSM-LAS-PHX, US PHX-SJD. Return: US SJD-PHX, WN PHX-MDW-DSM
User currently offlineIowaman From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4358 posts, RR: 6
Reply 19, posted (10 years 1 month 3 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 3225 times:
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Good News Eh?  Big thumbs up



Next flights: WN DSM-LAS-PHX, US PHX-SJD. Return: US SJD-PHX, WN PHX-MDW-DSM
User currently offlineVorticity From United States of America, joined May 2004, 337 posts, RR: 5
Reply 20, posted (10 years 1 month 3 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 3207 times:

I just flew out of CID a few weeks ago on American Eagle, I liked the airport. I can handle either DSM or CID really, I would be happy if one of them got Southwest or AirTran. Continental Express to CID would be nice too. I'll keep my fingers crossed.


Thermodynamics and english units don't mix...
User currently offlineIowaman From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4358 posts, RR: 6
Reply 21, posted (10 years 1 month 3 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 3189 times:
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Vorticity,

Did you connect in DFW or ORD??



Next flights: WN DSM-LAS-PHX, US PHX-SJD. Return: US SJD-PHX, WN PHX-MDW-DSM
User currently offlineVorticity From United States of America, joined May 2004, 337 posts, RR: 5
Reply 22, posted (10 years 1 month 3 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 3182 times:

I connected through DFW, though I think there were a few options that did connect through ORD. Someone is coming to visit me from CID in a bit over a week with the same route through DFW. The waits aren't too bad in transfering flights, but a direct flight from IAH to CID would be cool.


Thermodynamics and english units don't mix...
User currently offlineIowaman From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4358 posts, RR: 6
Reply 23, posted (10 years 1 month 3 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 3173 times:
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Ya it would. It may happen soon.............................
Connecting through DFW is definently better than ORD, unless you like delays, that is.

and NW has DC-9's to MSP today!!!!



Next flights: WN DSM-LAS-PHX, US PHX-SJD. Return: US SJD-PHX, WN PHX-MDW-DSM
User currently offlineIowa744fan From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 931 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (10 years 1 month 3 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 3159 times:

Someone asked about the plans for expansion of DSM, and I thought that I would mention some things since no one has said anything.

Back in the mid 90s, when the airline industry was on one of its upswings and looking for some good years, the city laid out ambitious plans for expansion. As someone mentioned, there used to be a short parallel runway (13R/31L) to the current 13/31 off to the southwest by about 2000 feet I think. Anyway, it was close enough that the crosswinds 5/23 still intersected both. Anyway, UPS was looking for a regional hub for expansion (not Louisville type expansion, but a regional sorting center with a consdierable number of flights a day...by the way, anyone know how many UPS birds we get in DSM on average during the normal time of year - not Christmas?), and thus the expansion of the cargo facilities were given top priority. In order to expand - and I believe double the apron area - the parallel GA runway had to go.
The initial plans that they drew up also included the extension of 5/23 (which has been completed) and a new 13R/31L parallel runway that was to be around 10,000 feet long and spaced further out to accomodate the expanded cargo facility. The final addition to the plans was to be a new terminal building. For those of you who have been to DSM, the current concourses cannot be expanded much further due to the runways. Plans had called for a new terminal at the northwest end of the airport in the upper portion of the "H" that was to be formed by the three runways. This would have allowed significant expansion of gates for us.
However, reality set in, and although Des Moines traffic increased, it was not as much as hoped for (largely because we don't know how to treat the LCCs when they do come!). As mentioned, the third runway has been scaled back to a GA runway for now, but with the possibility to expand. As for the terminal, they decided to keep the current one and "fill in the gaps" in the terminal. The current concourses have a waiting area with gates on each side, then a narrow corridor, then another waiting area. The plan was to expand the corridor portions and make one long continuous wide concourse and add gates between the current locations. The current separation of gates will easily allow another gate to be added between them and the largest aircraft that would likely serve DSM (737s, 717s, MD80s, 319/320s) would have little trouble parking. The only change would be that many would have to go to a more straight in park and use tugs or power backs to push back instead of the open space that some have to simply roll forward and turn around in the gate area.
I am still not aware of when or if this expansion is planned. They redid the baggage claim area and rental car desks, as well as adding a parking garage many years back. So, they are not likely to build a new terminal any time soon.

As for CID adding a third runway, I don't really see why. As others have mentioned, the traffic levels are so low that fitting GA traffic into the pattern should not be a significant problem. DSM only has two runways, but they have at least double the commercial movements, probably 20-25 UPS, FedEx, Airborne, etc. movements per day, and we have F-16s of the Air National Guard doing exercises. To my knowledge, SUX is the only other airport in Iowa with ANG operations and I doubt any of the parcel carriers are looking for a new sorting hub.

With regards to WN or other LCCs coming to Iowa. As someone mentioned, WN serves Omaha (2 hours away) and Kansas City (3 hours away). Given how many people make the trek to these places already, it almost seems that WN would just be taking a lot of their own business. This was actually the argument in favor of CID a few years back since the nearest WN city is MDW (3.5 - 4 hours?). STL might be closer, but there are few direct and quick road links. I personally would expect WN to start serving Rochester, MN before they started any Iowa routes. I don't know the size of the terminal up there, but you have the MSP area only an hour or so away. Perhaps the terminal size is a problem, but one that could be solved.

Also, many LCCs probably remember how Iowans have treated past ones that have come here. I have mentioned this before on other threads. Air Tran actually operated here in the mid and late 90s with nonstop and direct service through MLI to CO / KMCO), USA - Florida">MCO (We had one flight a day that reversed which direction it went through the two cities). However, when majors matched them, Iowans went with the majors and the LCCs suffered. The same happened when Vanguard came here. They started off with 2 to 4 flights a day each to MSP, MDW, and MCI. The majors matched them and Iowans flew the majors, so eventually Vanguard was down to just the MCI route before closing up shop completely. Accessair was the same story. So, I think that a lot of LCCs are going to think twice about coming here. Thankfully, I think that we have been better with Allegiant and their flights to LAS. Hopefully, they do well out of CID as well. Perhaps Independence Air would consider testing the market with a CRJ to IAD. We are losing Midwest's nonstop service to DCA, so the city will probably try to entice Independence to start. I doubt WN will start anytime soon to DSM. They seem to have their sites set on the East Coast anyway. Air Tran might give it another shot when a few 717s are freed up. ASA operates two flights daily (might be three, but I thought they decreased) to ATL. It would also be interesting to see CO Ex try their luck in CID to IAH.

Finally, someone mentioned that mainline services are only operated from DSM by UA to ORD and Allegiant. UA currently flies six flights to ORD - 3 737s, 1 146, and 2 CRJs. However, they are stepping up service this summer to 5 737s and 1 146. They also serve Denver with 6 flights - 4 737s and 2 CRJs. In addition, NW still operates two of its MSP flights with D9S's (and four with the larger ARJs). We lost the TWA/American 717s and 80s to STL a couple of years ago - miss having 6 or 7 of those mainline jets in here each day. AA also switched their DFW service to all RJs in the past year. So, on the plus side, we have more flights, frequencies, and destinations than we used to. However, most are on RJs, so it is a mixed bag.

Oh, one last thing. Omaha is in Nebraska, not Iowa!  Smile


25 Post contains images Iowaman : I have a question for anyone that knows the answer. There are usually 1-3 "Flight Line" flights that come in from from OMA and ORD daily. Are these so
26 Iowa744fan : Iowaman, I should have an answer for you in a little bit. There was something in one of my aviation magazines about that recently. I'll take a look an
27 Iowa744fan : Found the magazine, but my mistake Iowaman. It was Ameriflight, a small package operator. They fly to CID from DSM and CVG, so I guess not them. Sorry
28 Iowaman : Thanks for trying to find out Iowa744fan!
29 Dbo861 : I think people in DSM are treating LCCs better, at least in Allegiant's case. So far, Allegiant has added flights to DSM and recently announced it wil
30 Iowaman : That's too bad they're discontinuing the HP service, My dad flew on that just a couple of weeks ago. The flights are real late leaving and early comin
31 Dbo861 : I haven't heard any news from HP about the discontinuing of the DSM-LAS flight, or maybe it hasn't officially been announced. All I know is that half
32 Iowaman : Does anyone know when you get the seat assignments for G4? I'm booking a flight DSM-LAS I don't see where you can select seats online. Thanks.
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