DCA-ROCguy From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 4590 posts, RR: 32
Reply 3, posted (11 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 5742 times:
Long Beach can't be getting near the revenue out of that airport that they did when McDonnell Douglas was going full tilt. Now that Boeing is down to 717's, one wonders if the cash potential of bigger JetBlue ops is going to overcome the city's idiotic NIMBY politics and lead to reduced or eliminated slot restrictions.
The impression that I have is that that unhinged LGB-area NIMBY's pretty much have the airport boxed in. But the only thing that often speaks louder to local governments than the NIMBY peanut gallery is cold hard cash, and LGB has the potential to rake in lots of it through jetBlue.
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Mark777300 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 388 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (11 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 5689 times:
I seriously dobt that B6 will even consider LAX as an alternative. I would see them first out of ONT before anything. But it's been no secret that LGB does have numerous slot restrictions, and I'm not sure how the whole thing that involved AA going to court over their unused slots at LGB ended up. My personal opinion is that in due time, specifically when B6 begins to receive their new ERJs, you will see an increase in operations out of LGB, and I still feel that a new "focus city" will be created down in the southeast, probably FLL or MCO. We'll see what happens.
PW100 From Netherlands, joined Jan 2002, 2885 posts, RR: 17
Reply 7, posted (11 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 5571 times:
What are the chances that Jetblue would manage to bypass LGB slot restirctions through using the EMB190?
Can the EMB-190 be classified as a RJ under LGB definitions?
I believe that LGB slot restrictions don't apply for RJ's. Is this correct?
[Edited 2004-05-20 22:41:45]
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Modesto2 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 2870 posts, RR: 5
Reply 19, posted (11 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 5058 times:
What is OAK's T2 plan? B6 should seriously consider OAK as another focus city. It already operates to BOS, IAD, JFK and LGB. B6's operation at OAK is quite impressive, and I only see it expanding in the near future. It's nice to see OAK with good number of transcons.
Jetbluefan1 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3110 posts, RR: 12
Reply 20, posted (11 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 5021 times:
LGB - IMO - will see more flights by JetBlue soon. The NIMBY's there really are strong, no doubting that, but as stated above, the airport lost a lot of traffic ever since the MD plant closed down. The 717 production line is almost dead, and therefore LGB is not making as much money as it can possibly make. Therefore, if they turn to JetBlue and give them - say - another 15 slots, LGB will make more money. And not only does this money benefit the airport, but also the library, where all the landing fines go (late arrivals, etc.).
If this does not happen, Neeleman said that their only alternative is to drop LAS, OAK, and SLC (he didn't exactly say SLC, but I'm assuming he's thinking it) and to use those slots for transcons - which are much more profitable. But think about it - JetBlue can do A LOT with those 8 slots at the airport.
As far as OAK, JetBlue already has a focus city there. I'm pretty sure they are 2nd in terms of volume - right behind WN. 7x JFK, 3x IAD, 5x LGB, 2x BOS. It's quite a sizeable number, and from what I can gather, the BOS flights are doing all right from OAK, so perhaps we will see additional frequency? I also see a 1x-2x FLL, 1x-2x MCO, and maybe if JetBlue opened their eyes - 2x MSY. I'm also sure as JetBlue adds cities, they'll put more flights to those destinations out of OAK.
IMO, the Bay Area is underserved. Sure, UA has a hub at SFO, but it's not huge or a mega-hub (I'm NOT saying that it's small). But there's still a few routes that are starving for LCC's, and that's where B6 & OAK come into play. The airline and the airport have a very tight relationship.
Sllevin From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 3376 posts, RR: 5
Reply 22, posted (11 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 4932 times:
Mark my words
There will never be an expansion of slots for LGB. Yes, the city has lost money since McDD (now Boeing) is tapering off production. What jetBlue could bring to the area is trivial compared to that. If you argue finances, understand that the best and most valuable use of LGB to the city of Long Beach would be as a shopping center! However, the city is willing to forgo that revenue for the ability to have an airport. But they will never expand the airport.
Look for jetBlue to morph LGB into a pur destination point as they bring more cities online and offer 2x service from those cities into LGB. All the "local" routes will go away in the next year or so...
As739x From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6303 posts, RR: 24
Reply 23, posted (11 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 4897 times:
Scotty...easy there about Oakland. They have not even started it and its a long way from being done. They will continue to be pressed for space at OAKas well. I personally can not see over 25 flights being operated out of there till they can get 6-7 gates to their own.
"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
OzarkD9S From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 5425 posts, RR: 20
Reply 24, posted (11 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 4855 times:
Would it be possible for B6 to sue the city of Long Beach and force them to open up more slots?
*Slot restrictions at LGB are based on noise, not operational limits such as DCA and LGA. With a 10,0000 foot runway it could theoretically be as busy as Gatwick, tho the terminal is in no way capable of handling the volume.
*Slot restrictions are a barrier to free trade.
*The airport was there before most of the people living in the area were born.
*Maximizing the revenue potential of the airport would improve the entire region econmically.
*Today's airliners are categorically quieter than the aircraft that were operating when the limits were imposed.
Worth a shot, don't you think?
Next up: STL-EWR-BTV-ORD-STL
: The slot issue at LGB is the third rail of politics in the city of Long Beach. Most local politicians won't touch the issue unless they never plan to
: Silevin: I agree with you. It doesn't matter how many arguments airline (or airplane) people put forward, the residents are determined that the area w
: FATflyer, Absolutely great summation of the LGB case history. The regulatory controls in place at LGB (and, for the matter, SNA) are considered to be
: FATFlyer Can you send me an email email@example.com Mike
: Jetblue has plans to expand out of LGB there are already plans to tear down the Boeing buildings on the north side and either extend or add another ru
: Well B6 ever get a gate at SAN for a focus city here and add non-stops to BOS, IAD, MCO & FLL? No slot restrictions here. Just a departure curfew betw
: UAMAYBACH1239 That tearing down of the Douglas/Boeing plants is for the Boeing Real Estate project, there are plans for Housing and a shopping comple
: The problem with LGB isn't capacity, it's those darned Nobody IMportant But Yourstruly's that refuse to allow additional slots at LGB...heck, LGB is A
: "Nobody IMportant But Yourstruly's " Uh... I thought it was "Not IN My Back Yard"?
: It is...I sometimes enjoy coming up with my own fitting acronyms, and both certainly work...
35 ONT 737
: SHUPirate1 the irony in the LGB noise ordinance is that you *can* fly A380s into there. The way the ordinance is written there will be no less than 41
: Unless jetBlue is paying some serious money to Boeing, I doubt that Boeing has any interest whatsoever in giving up valuable real estate at LGB to an
: Scott Pretty good information in there, I heard from some of the Jetblue pilots that Airbus can a way to fix the "whistling" that you hear up descent
: I thought the construction company the Port of Oakland hired broke ground on the new T2 expansion a couple of months ago. In any case, when the termin
: "And not only does this money benefit the airport, but also the library, where all the landing fines go (late arrivals, etc.)." Personally, I find thi
: IIRC jetBlue began a second daily ONT-JFK (daytime) in June 2001, it was axed shotly after 9-11.
: I believe they axed the second daily to ONT because they were adding a 3rd to LGB, and therefore were afraid that the passengers would overlap. JetBlu
: What I really find stupid is the NIMBYs forget in most cases airports were there before their homes were even built. It seems every time a city builds
: Which airports in the US are slot protected?