Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Qantas From AKL  
User currently offlineAirxliban From Lebanon, joined Oct 2003, 4536 posts, RR: 52
Posted (12 years 1 week 17 hours ago) and read 1956 times:

It looks like Qantas flies to LAX from Auckland...

Isn't this a bit funny...why would the New Zealand government allow QF to fly this route in direct competition with Air New Zealand?

This might sound like a dumb question and it might well be a dumb question. What i mean to say is that is there any reason beyond "Qantas applied and got rights to fly this route" as to why a non-NZ and non-US carrier is flying this route in addition to Air NZ.

[Edited 2004-05-23 21:17:48]

9 replies: All unread, jump to last
User currently offlineStarFlyer From Germany, joined Sep 2002, 987 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (12 years 1 week 16 hours ago) and read 1930 times:

New Zealand and Australia have an open skies agreement. In the past Air New Zealand has served SYD-LAX in return. This route has been dropped after 9/11, but the agreement remains.

On a related note, New Zealand as an open skies agreement with UAE, hence Emirates would be able to theoretically serve routes between the US and NZ as well!

All this is a result of the liberal policies NZ has applied since the late 1980s in many sectors, including airlines.

Yours truly - StarFlyer
User currently offlineAl From Australia, joined Jun 1999, 593 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (12 years 1 week 15 hours ago) and read 1922 times:

Any designated Oz carrier has had access to beyond rights, routes and traffic from N.Z. since late '94, as did any N.Z. carrier have the same access beyond Oz. There was a limit on the number of operations per week each country could have from the other country until Nov 2000, when both countries signed an agreement to drop all beyond restrictions for carriers of both countries.
At one stage NZ had a decent sized Asian route mini-hub operating in BNE, but this didn't last too long and apart from the on again/off again SYD-LAX route, NZ hasn't tried to capitalise on the agreement, either pre or post AN, whereas QF are making use of the agreement as you found out.

User currently offlineGigneil From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 16347 posts, RR: 79
Reply 3, posted (12 years 1 week 15 hours ago) and read 1917 times:

I believe NZ actually has completely open skies, not just with those countries.

I may be incorrect.


User currently offlineAirxliban From Lebanon, joined Oct 2003, 4536 posts, RR: 52
Reply 4, posted (12 years 1 week 14 hours ago) and read 1892 times:

thats the answer i was looking for, thank you gentlemen.

if NZ has completely open skies, might there be a market for other US carriers to come down that way? Has UA pulled out of this market?

Fares on the LAX-AA), New Zealand">AKL route are pretty expensive...not sure if that is just because they need to be or because Air NZ and UA know that they can charge that much.

Air NZ is running a promotion right now...865 to Auckland from Los Angeles...otherwise it looks like its about 1500.

Is there room for another airline other than QF and NZ? (Are there other airlines other than these two even? Damn amadeus is down...).

If AA were to open up such a route, could the 777s fly them or would they have to use an inefficient routing?

User currently offlineNZ767 From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 1620 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (12 years 1 week 13 hours ago) and read 1850 times:

Hi Airxliban,

United pulled out of New Zealand over a year ago although they still operate codeshare with NZ.

I AA wanted to serve NZ, they certainly could use B777's as UA did, albeit with ETOPS restrictions.
AA however, codeshare on LAX-AA), New Zealand">AKL with QF under the Oneworld Alliance.  Smile

User currently offlineAussie747 From Australia, joined Aug 2003, 1170 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (12 years 1 week 12 hours ago) and read 1805 times:

I guess the same could be said when NZ pulled out of the SYD-LAX route early last year. THe above posts answer my question further.

User currently offlineNZ767 From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 1620 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (12 years 1 week 11 hours ago) and read 1772 times:

Geez, I don't know what I was smoking when I posted that, but before someone points it out (as they're bound to), my last sentence should have read:

"AA however, codeshare on Los Angeles-Auckland with QF under the Oneworld Alliance."  Smile

User currently offlineMotorhussy From New Zealand, joined Mar 2000, 3892 posts, RR: 8
Reply 8, posted (12 years 1 week ago) and read 1633 times:


I believe NZ actually has completely open skies, not just with those countries.

I may be incorrect.

Yes you are, incorrect that is.

New Zealand has reciprocal open sky agreements with a few nations, including Singapore, UAE & Australia. Airlines from these nations are allowed, by the New Zealand government, beyond rights as well, but often not from any other governments.


come visit the south pacific
User currently offlineGemuser From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 6285 posts, RR: 6
Reply 9, posted (12 years 1 week ago) and read 1601 times:

Airxliban (reply 4)

ANY US airline that wants to operate to OZ/NZ can do so. It just has to get US DOT approval & FAA operational clearance. US State dept then notifies the other government of the details,which then has to approve the flights. If they are within the parameters of the current bilateral treaty this approval is a formality and will be quickly issued. If the proposal is outside the current bilateral then negotiations must take place, this can delay things, but not for long in the current climate.

So why are there not at least two US carriers to OZ (HA doesn't count(yet)) and none to NZ?
Because they don't believe that they can make money on the route OR (& more likely) they believe they can make more elsewhere. I have said it before and I'll say it again, the US - SW Pacific is a difficult route to operate, its long, its thin and it has compertision that will fight you to the death because they have no where else to go!

What ever happens, on the US-SW Pacific route - 2nd last carrier standing = QF. Last carrier standing = NZ.

DC23468910;B72172273373G73873H74374475275376377L77W;A319 320321332333343;BAe146;C402;DHC6;F27;L188;MD80MD85
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Qantas From IND To HNL posted Fri Oct 13 2006 19:28:04 by 744fan
Qantas From Auckland To Singapore posted Tue Jul 18 2006 13:34:05 by QANTASpower
Qantas From SFO To SYD Nonstop posted Thu Feb 16 2006 03:37:59 by N471WN
Flying LCC From AKL To MNL Or CEB Possible? posted Thu Jan 5 2006 12:03:59 by Aviationfreak
Info On EK From AKL And DJ (virgin Blue) Please posted Fri Aug 19 2005 11:21:48 by 777ER
Pacific Blue From AKL To OZ posted Fri Feb 11 2005 01:54:46 by Zkojh
SQ Flights From AKL - 11/01 posted Sun Oct 31 2004 20:21:22 by RupesNZ
Qantas--LAX-AKL USD$498RT, LAX-SYD USD$598RT posted Sat May 1 2004 04:28:11 by IndustrialPate
UA 777 Diversion From AKL posted Thu Sep 11 2003 06:36:09 by Irishpower
Qantas Dumps AKL-EZE, Launch AKL-SCL posted Tue Mar 26 2002 06:02:15 by Jiml1126