Ord From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 1398 posts, RR: 1 Posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 5816 times:
For those that remember the crash of American 191 at O'Hare Airport in Chicago, it's hard to believe tomorrow (May 25) will be the 25th anniversary of the crash.
The DC-10 from Chicago to Los Angeles had a full load that Friday, partly because of the busy Memorial Day weekend and also because American's chief competitor on the ORD-LAX run, United, was on strike at the time and not operating.
When the left engine fell off on take-off and the airplane crashed, it was at the time the worst aviation disaster in the U.S. and led to the temporary grounding of the DC-10.
Jsnww81 From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 2397 posts, RR: 14
Reply 4, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 5604 times:
I don't know if anything will be done to commemorate the crash... there is currently no memorial at the crash site. The plane went down before I was born, but I live in Chicago and have driven past the crash site many times. There's nothing to suggest that almost 300 people died there.
Contrails From United States of America, joined Oct 2000, 1845 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 5533 times:
I didn't realize I'd gotten that old. I vividly remember hearing the bulletin coming across on TV, and I remember the sadness I felt, even though I did't know any of the pax.
I lived in Ft. Worth at the time, and had not yet ever been to Chicago or ORD. I was at ORD later that summer, however, and watched an AA DC-10 Captain give his plane a very thorough pre-flight check.
My cousin told me that she and her family were circling ORD shortly after the crash and were not aware of what had happened. On one of the circles she looked out and saw the fire and wreckage, and they soon figured it out.
Younger people today may not believe this, in today's post-Robert Crandall era, but there was a time when the airlines filled the skies over the US with DC-10's, 747's, and L-1011's on domestic flights. It was another time and another world. Things sure have changed.
MD11LuxuryLinr From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 1385 posts, RR: 12
Reply 8, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 5287 times:
I was one and a half years old when 191 went down. Needless to say I don't remember it. But having the infatuation that I do with the DC10, I have found myself scouring through 191's NTSB crash report a dozen or so times. It can be pretty upsetting.
~"but there was a time when the airlines filled the skies over the US with DC-10's, 747's, and L-1011's on domestic flights. It was another time and another world. Things sure have changed."~
You got that right, Contrails. Damn I miss those days. Its hard to believe that only 15 years ago, I could watch daily parades of 741s, DC10s, and L1011s coming from ORD, LAX, etc. Nowadays, it's all A319/320/321s, 73G/738s, and the occasional 757 (if we're lucky), being utilized on the same routes. Speaking locally of course..
Caution wake turbulence, you are following a heavy jet.
Dc863 From Romania, joined Jun 1999, 1579 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 5115 times:
RJpieces I've read those stories about ghosts from AA191 as well. Speaking of ghosts and air crashes there is a story of a ghost at Heathrow Terminal 1 that is somehow connected to BE548 that crashed just after take-off from LHR-BRU in June 1972.
Airfinair From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 670 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 4929 times:
I remember driving down the Kennedy Expressway near Harlem Ave., heading into the city and seeing the first plumes of smoke rise up. It was an eerie site, and one I will never forget. We immediately turned on the radio, and listened to reports for the next 5 hours for the start of our Memorial Day weekend roadtrip.
The Chicago Tribune has a great detailed editorial about the crash in today's edition, with details of the upcoming History Channel program on 5/27, "The Crash of Flight 191."
Dadoftyler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 4776 times:
Amazing. Twenty-five years.
I was working the Staff desk in Reservations in Ft. Worth for American at the time. 191 was not only booked full, it had been booked full for several weeks. In fact, I had taken an irate call the day before that fateful Friday from a customer who called me everything but a child of God to try and get me to overbook him on that flight. I didn't.
After the crash, those of us on Staff began to take calls from family members. At the time, we didn't have a positive manifest, but we could confirm that 191 had been involved in an incident but that we had no further information (a blatant lie), and we got their names, relationships, and phone numbers for callbacks, and asked them to remain available at that phone number.
That day was horrific. At the time, I was surprised that the people I talked to were not more hysterical--later, I realized they were all in shock. The one really bizarre one I talked to was from a lady who wanted to confirm if her husband was aboard. I gave her my shpiel, to which she replied, "well I hope the son of a bitch was on that plane, and hope the whore he's screwing was sitting next to him."
The manner in which airlines handle incidents like this has changed dramatically since 1979. Now, airlines have "care teams" specially trained to handle phone inquiries and have teams constantly ready to be deployed to assist each family involved in tragedies like this. That's wonderful, but I sure wish I had had some sort of advance training or preparation for what I went through 25 years ago. I didn't sleep well for many, many weeks.
Ord From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 1398 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 4750 times:
Another note on the crash that I remember is that there was a famous author on the flight; I believe her name was Judith Wax but I can't be sure. One of her books was an autobiography, and in that book she described her fear of flying and the danger of it all. The page in her book where this was written? Page 191.
RayChuang From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 8346 posts, RR: 4
Reply 17, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 4667 times:
Stories like this makes you wonder what would have happened if the FAA had decided right there and then to permanently pull the plug on DC-10 certification (I'm sure that had been considered given the the chequered history of the plane at that time).
My guess is that it would have dramatically increased 767 sales as both AA and UA scrambled to replace the lost capacity from the grounding of the DC-10. And it might have pushed Boeing to get earlier ETOPS certification, too.
Tristarenvy From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 2265 posts, RR: 3
Reply 18, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 4594 times:
Seems to me, if you reads the Trib artice from the link back at AIRFINAIRS reply, that the 10 wasn't the culprit HERE. That McD/D reccomended a certain way to maintain the engine and pylons, and that AA had done it ANOTHER way to save time. Bad engineering? Bad maintenance? Bad combo of both? As I had nothing to do with AA or McD/D, I'll leave the "armchair quarterbacking" to others.
Yes, this argument will go on for years about who gets the blame. And the fact it was the fourth fatal accident involving a 10 doesn't look so good, either.
I'll be anxious to watch the History Channel program Thursday, about the incident.
If you don't stand for SOMETHING, you'll fall for ANYTHING.
Ord From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 1398 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 4543 times:
"My guess is that it would have dramatically increased 767 sales as both AA and UA scrambled to replace the lost capacity from the grounding of the DC-10."
This is a good thought. But keep in mind if your scenario played out and the DC-10 was grounded permanently, that would have been in May of 1979. The first 767 didn't enter service until September 1982 with United. So something other than the 767 would have been needed to fill the gap for almost 3-1/2 years.
PHLBOS From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 7634 posts, RR: 21
Reply 24, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 4412 times:
I was 13 at the time of the crash. I remember seeing a photo similar (but shot at a different angle) to the one shown in Reply #14 in a then-current LIFE magazine article.
A few days following the crash, for something to do; my mother took my brother and I over to Saratoga Road (Route 145) at the East Boston-Winthrop line to watch the planes land at BOS' 22L. We had done something similar weeks before the crash and noticed the sizable void created by the DC-10 groundings when comparing the 2 visits.
At the time, the only widebody trijets we saw landing were TWA L1011s (I don't believe DL had any L1011s operating out of BOS at the time). We did see a few more 707s or 720s than usual during the post-crash visit.
Man, does time fly.
"TransEastern! You'll feel like you've never left the ground because we treat you like dirt!" SNL Parady ad circa 1981
: After this Crash TWA started putting a statement in all of its timetables essentially "The ONLY WideBodies TWA flies are 747 and L1011's"" In other wo
: Should also be mentioned that today is the 2nd anniversary of the latest CI crash.... though, doubt that title will last long 225 people died.
: Ultrapig, I believe this was also the time when TWA placed "L-1011" on the center engine of their L-1011 fleet so that nobody would think it was a DC-
: Ord-you and I must be old-you are right