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Lufthansa To Start Low-frills Longhaul Airline  
User currently offlineUltraviolet From Germany, joined Mar 2004, 10 posts, RR: 0
Posted (9 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 6884 times:

Thomas Cook, the Lufthansa tourism subsidiary wants to start low-frills longhaul flights very soon. They're planning to use the brand "Condor" which was used for Thomas Cook Airlines before.

Following German press Condor wants to fly inside Europe starting at 29 Euro to holiday destinations - but as well fly transatlantic and to Africa starting at 99 Euro.
AFAIK this would be the first no-frills airline flying longhaul...

32 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineBestWestern From Hong Kong, joined Sep 2000, 6953 posts, RR: 57
Reply 1, posted (9 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 6733 times:

Just what we need - another low cost german airline.

Long Haul low cost wont work, as current economy fares are already subsidized by premium cabin passengers. Consider how much taxes alone are to the US.



The world is really getting smaller these days
User currently offlineAndreas From Germany, joined Oct 2001, 6104 posts, RR: 32
Reply 2, posted (9 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 6723 times:

Do you have any links on that one?

Sounds funny...this would be a direct hit on LH operations, so I wonder..but interesting nonetheless!!



I know it's only VfB but I like it!
User currently offlineGodBless From Sweden, joined Apr 2000, 2752 posts, RR: 16
Reply 3, posted (9 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 6705 times:

Well they don't plan that, they have already launched their new website where they promote "shorthauls" (even including destinations such as SHJ!) for as little as 29EUR and longhaul flights starting at 99EUR.
I myself did not see any flights for 29EUR nor for 99EUR though.
http://www2.condor.com/tcf/us/index.jsp

Max


User currently offlineGraham697 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 350 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (9 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 6673 times:

I hope with the new low fare service, there 767s will grace the skys of TPA again. This time if they advertise maybe they can conjur up some local o&d traffic.


Christmas Wish: DL builds a focus city at DCA
User currently offlineTriStar500 From Germany, joined Nov 1999, 4692 posts, RR: 43
Reply 5, posted (9 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 6621 times:

It is very nice and wonderful if you sell tickets at low-cost levels, but as long as the production costs of Condor remain as high as they are and losses mount up, they are still going to be shut down by their owners eventually. Like Mr. Teckentrup demanded: "Wages down 30 percent, productivity up 15%". Or was it the other way around?


Homer: Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!
User currently offlineUltraviolet From Germany, joined Mar 2004, 10 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (9 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 6607 times:

Here are some links:

http://www.ftd.de/ub/di/1085376277573.html?nv=hpm
http://www.faz.net/IN/INtemplates/faznet/default.asp?tpl=investor/tool_infoboxticker_meldung.asp&id=1085567428
http://boerse.ard.de/content.jsp?key=dokument_56843
http://www.reuters.de/newsPackageArticle.jhtml?type=companiesNews&storyID=517674§ion=news


[Edited 2004-05-26 13:09:48]

User currently offlineMrniji From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (9 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 6603 times:

LH intercontinental is almost like low-frill already Big grin

User currently offlineUltraviolet From Germany, joined Mar 2004, 10 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (9 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 6449 times:

It looks like most of the DE-flights are offered under the Condor brand now with the low fares... Is this the end of Thomas Cook Airlines?

User currently offlineTriStar500 From Germany, joined Nov 1999, 4692 posts, RR: 43
Reply 9, posted (9 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 6392 times:

There never was "Thomas Cook Airlines" in Germany. Flights were always operated by Condor under the Thomas Koch brand.

The slogan "Thomas Koch powered by Condor" will always be remembered as one of the worst marketing blunders in German commercial aviation. And rightfully so!  Big thumbs up



Homer: Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!
User currently offlineTs-ior From Tunisia, joined Oct 2001, 3410 posts, RR: 6
Reply 10, posted (9 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 6334 times:


Flughafen Koln-Bonn (CGN) will certainely attract these flights as it is said to be a LCC hub for many airlines including the expected North- American one which intends to start low-cost transatlantic flights by 2005...

What i really hope is to see DE returning to Tunisian airports...they are a big mess !!!


User currently offlineBestWestern From Hong Kong, joined Sep 2000, 6953 posts, RR: 57
Reply 11, posted (9 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 6192 times:

With £199 / €250 return low fares between Europe and the US already on full service carriers we already have low fares.


The world is really getting smaller these days
User currently offlineGeizistgeil From Germany, joined Apr 2004, 149 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (9 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 6047 times:

And here is the story from Thomas Cook website:

http://www.thomascook.info/tck/de/en/gnf/0,2773,0-0-1189928,00.html

Former Vacation Airline, than Holiday Airline, now Leisure Airline...good look new (or old, or what?) Condor!






"If the Wright brothers were alive today. Wilbur would have to fire Orville to reduce costs" (H. Kelleher)
User currently offlineIkarus From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 3524 posts, RR: 2
Reply 13, posted (9 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 5635 times:

$99 is one way.

So, in effect, the "low cost" / "no frills" is just a marketing hype - the prices aren't lower than before. The service may be...

Personally, I wouldn't fly with them unless the prices were significantly lower than they announced.

Regards

Ikarus


User currently offlineAV8AJET From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 1311 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (9 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 5624 times:

I wonder if they would try getting into the PHX market again...AB) (FRA / FRF / EDDF), Germany">FRA, or maybe even DUS??? Just a thought.

[Edited 2004-05-26 16:26:29]


"To fly or not to fly there is no question!"
User currently offlineRamerinianair From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 1486 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (9 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 5492 times:

This sounds like what MidwestExpress did. They have A/C with signature service and then saver service. Condor will be taking away from LH if they don't make certain cities only Condor. Midwest Express isn't doing so well last time I checked.
SR



W N = my Worst Nightmare!!!!!
User currently offlineRichardw From United Kingdom, joined May 2001, 3744 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (9 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 5381 times:

Most cheap fares on Long Haul require a saturday night stay, which are no good for the business traveller, that is where a no frills service would be popular if it offerred fares without such restrictions.

User currently offlineL1011aaron From United Kingdom, joined May 2004, 139 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (9 years 10 months 4 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 4996 times:

They will have direct competition on the long haul side. Back packers xpress is planning to start up offering services from Munich to Goa, Australia, Africa, India, Thailand and some others with a 742. This will be no frill service too.  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

User currently offlineConcordeBoy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (9 years 10 months 4 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 4983 times:

AFAIK this would be the first no-frills airline flying longhaul...

Not even close.


User currently offlineManni From South Korea, joined Nov 2001, 4221 posts, RR: 23
Reply 19, posted (9 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 4713 times:

Delta's transatlantic economy class has been nearly no-frills for years now.


SUPPORT THE LEBANESE CIVILIANS
User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16693 posts, RR: 51
Reply 20, posted (9 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 4645 times:

Im guessing they would offer flights to destinations LH does not serve, Orlando, Las Vegas, Ft.Lauderdale, Phoenix etc..


Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineBlueshamu330s From UK - England, joined Sep 2001, 2785 posts, RR: 25
Reply 21, posted (9 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 4528 times:

Have to side with Crosswind on this one....too many F/J fares subsidising very low economy fares at the moment.....would need to be considerably cheaper to make a success of 29" pitch, no meals, no free IFE and no free beverages...and german charter config. is traditionally more generous than other european states, so there's another dilution of the profit potential.

Shamu



So I drive a 4x4. So what?! Tax the a$$ off me for it...oh, you already have... :-(
User currently offlineEmiratesA345 From Canada, joined Jun 2003, 2121 posts, RR: 9
Reply 22, posted (9 years 10 months 4 weeks ago) and read 4496 times:

"AFAIK this would be the first no-frills airline flying longhaul..."

Don't forget Zoom Airlines with prices as low as $500 CAD (YYZ-LGW-YYZ).

http://www.zoomairlines.com

EmiratesA345 Smile/happy/getting dizzy



You and I were meant to fly, Air Canada!
User currently offlineBlueshamu330s From UK - England, joined Sep 2001, 2785 posts, RR: 25
Reply 23, posted (9 years 10 months 4 weeks ago) and read 4427 times:

Thinking about this one still.........perhaps TC and Condor have finally found a potentially profitable niche for their 753s....... c. 250 seats, roughly 31" pitch, IFE, alcohol and hot meals pay-on-demand............ remember how well (and profitably) the charter carriers World, TransAm, Worldways etc used the super -8s for donkey's years ....?

Shamu



So I drive a 4x4. So what?! Tax the a$$ off me for it...oh, you already have... :-(
User currently offlineSnnams From Ireland, joined Apr 2004, 288 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (9 years 10 months 4 weeks ago) and read 4358 times:

There is absolutely no point in cannabalising your mainline operation by creating a low cost offshoot. Get your main airlines cost's down and offer low fares to all. That is what the vast majority of travellers want and it is the airlines that have realised this eg EI, KL etc that are prospering.

25 HZ747300 : Wasn't there supposed to be a startup called Backpacker Express? I recall reading that in Airliner World. It would seem hard to be profitable for long
26 LTBEWR : Mmmmmm, seems like back to the future for LH. Didn't Condor (and LTU) used to be a charter subsidaries of LH at one time? Sound like one-class cattle
27 Sydscott : "There is absolutely no point in cannabalising your mainline operation by creating a low cost offshoot. Get your main airlines cost's down and offer
28 Aa757first : AFAIK this would be the first no-frills airline flying longhaul... PEOPLExpress? AAndrew
29 A330Fan1 : I don't understand how the airline plans to operate - sounds too good to be true, I mean. Flying such a distance for 99 bucks? How does long-haul, no-
30 MUCFLYER : Hi just to clarify... Condor doesn't want to sell all 269 seats on a longhaul B767-300 for 99,-€. They mentioned a minimum low fare capacity on each
31 FraT : "Mmmmmm, seems like back to the future for LH. Didn't Condor (and LTU) used to be a charter subsidaries of LH at one time?" Thomas Cook, the company t
32 Snnams : Sydscott, You may have a point about none of the legacy carriers having made it work. In the case of Asia/Australia though it is a bit early in the ga
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