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CO's International Network  
User currently offlineCory6188 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 2692 posts, RR: 6
Posted (10 years 5 months 4 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 3075 times:

It seems as if in comparison to the other major US airlines, CO always is at the forefront of announcing new and unusual international destinations.

They have many unique routes, such as EWR-OSL, EWR-EDI, EWR-GVA, EWR-TLV, among many other cities in Europe. They have also been expanding greatly in the Caribbean, with EWR-PSE being unofficially announced today, and recent new service to BGI, POS, and PUJ.

Also, their network in the Pacific with CO Micronesia is a route map that no other airline in the world has - most of the islands along their "island hopper" route have no other international airlines that serve them.

Why is CO so bold with their international destinations in comparison to the other US carriers? I know the use of the 752 is a factor, but it isn't as if the other members of the Big Six don't have 752s as well.

I think CO is in a great position with their multitude of unique international routes, and I would greatly appreciate it if someone could explain their philosophy to me.

Also, on a side note, are there any other new routes in the works at the moment? I know this topic has been brought up before, but more often than not, there is a planned city (domestic or international) that the CO employees here know about that the public doesn't.

[Edited 2004-05-29 04:36:18]

19 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineConcordeBoy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (10 years 5 months 4 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 3022 times:

One of the great advantages CO has is their NYC superhub... which can tap both O&D and transfer traffic effectively.

This contrasting to AA's/DL's JFK gateway in that those two cannot feed their operations with the same ease/consistency/frequency as CO can, and thus must rely on a larger percentage of O&D.

That, combined with the 763ER being the smallest aircraft typical of their transoceanic routings (though AA is scheduling the 752 on one transatlantic route), doesn't give them the flexibility CO has.


User currently offlineDiesel33 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 305 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (10 years 5 months 4 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 2990 times:

I am actually quite surprised about CO's continued commitment to Europe.

I thought that with the strong alliance with KL, that they're focus on Europe might decrease.

But as always, Continental is doing great work.

-diesel33


User currently offlineN670UW From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 1606 posts, RR: 8
Reply 3, posted (10 years 5 months 4 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 2981 times:

I am actually quite surprised about CO's continued commitment to Europe.

CO's alliance with KL is not nearly as extensive as NW's is with KL.

CO's KL alliance is primarily for reaching the Middle East and Africa.



670


User currently offlineMasseyBrown From United States of America, joined Dec 2002, 5549 posts, RR: 7
Reply 4, posted (10 years 5 months 4 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 2894 times:

It will be interesting to see how the Skyteam alliances work out. Continental could end up flying extensively to both AMS and CDG, since Air France has said the two hubs will specialize with AMS taking northerly European and Asian cities to the east and CDG taking southerly (including the Mideast and Africa) destinations.






I love long German words like 'Freundschaftsbezeigungen'.
User currently offlineRoseFlyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 9687 posts, RR: 52
Reply 5, posted (10 years 5 months 4 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 2894 times:

While reading Gordon's book (from worst to first) it talked about how successful Europe is. Most US airlines are scared of Europe because the high costs of going transatlantic. Gordon was considering dropping some routes before he realized that it was their most profitable segment. The competition is a lot less because of these obscure destinations they fly to in Europe, Central America and the Pacific. CO is making its money on a market that only a legacy carrier can have. International. It makes sense. No LCCs in Micronesia to compete with, so you have higher fares and control the market. It makes sense. Trying to fight LCC's like UA and DL are doing with Song and Ted is difficult. CO is going for a market that is tangible, and that is a reason that it is a more successful airline and not in bankruptcy compared to others of the big six.


If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
User currently offlineCoexjhknight From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 20 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (10 years 5 months 4 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 2871 times:

I think this says it all. They've come a long way! I'm proud to say I am part of it! What an accomplishment!



Continental Airlines is the world's sixth-largest airline with more than 2,800 daily departures throughout the Americas, Europe and Asia. Continental serves 149 domestic and 117 international destinations -- more than any other airline in the world -- and nearly 200 additional points are served via codeshare partner airlines. With 41,000 mainline employees, the airline has hubs serving New York, Houston, Cleveland and Guam, and carries approximately 51 million passengers per year. FORTUNE ranks Continental one of the 100 Best Companies to Work For in America, an honor it has earned for six consecutive years. FORTUNE also ranks Continental as the top airline in its Most Admired Global Companies in 2004.


User currently offlineTexdravid From United States of America, joined May 2004, 1363 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (10 years 5 months 4 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 2832 times:

In a way, CO international flights, with smaller planes flying to less busy foreign airports is Boeing's vision as well with the 7E7.

Airbus' vision is big airplane between hubs I think.

I think CO will do very well...they are very agressive in CLE, IAH, AND EWR...look for them to leapfrog United, and maybe AA and DL in the next few years.



Tort reform now. Throw lawyers in jail later.
User currently offlineContinentalEWR From United States of America, joined May 2000, 3762 posts, RR: 13
Reply 8, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 2675 times:

Continental leverages its NYC hub (375+ daily departures) in the world's largest O&D market, as well as the huge connecting opportunities there, via a clean, modern, and efficient terminal. Second, Continental has one of the most flexible, streamlined fleets of the US legacy carriers, flying the 737, 757, 767, and 777. While cockpit commonality is absent here (only Airbus has that), the capacity flexibility of the -300/500/200/400 etc. more than make up for it. Third, CO flies a lot of 757's across the Atlantic. The 757 has low seat costs and is efficient for cargo and pax. The 767 and 777's are used on the biggest routes across the pond.

ContinentalEWR


User currently offlineCALMSP From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 4023 posts, RR: 8
Reply 9, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 2607 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

cockpit commonality is available on our 757's & 767's. I'm just waiting for us to announce some wide bodie cities out of IAH. We have 3 widebodies overnight every night down here. Let's hook up MAD!!


okay, I'm waiting for the rich to spread the wealth around to me. Please mail your checks to my house.
User currently offlineND From Belgium, joined Feb 2004, 280 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 2586 times:

CO's KL alliance is primarily for reaching the Middle East and Africa.

Actually, CO has an arrangement with EK for reaching the Middle East.



ND - Hated By Many, Confronted By None
User currently offlineCospn From Northern Mariana Islands, joined Oct 2001, 1637 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 2399 times:

One of the Stories I Heard was about Robert F. Six CEO of the OLD Continental he married TV Actress Audrey meadows (Alice of the Honeymooners) any way he told her he would take here any where in the World on a CO 707..So She said she wanted to go Back to Japan now it was the 50's and the war was over..She was Born in Japan before the war as her parents were missionarys..Anyway Mr. Six was amazed at how Japan was coming along and knew they would like to have a Vacation someday in the Pacific Islands so when the Airmike Contract was being farmed out by the US Trust territories He said he would Fly it with 727 Jets in 1968 and the Rest is History the flew the 727's to Japan from 1976 and JAL added DC-8 Service to SPN in 1977.. CO Heave some Great People and Ideas Many years before Gordon Came in...Other US Legacy airlines worry about BIZ travel only..Thuds it..Continental looks at the big picture...Lets hope things keep going good after Gordon leaves Jan 1

User currently offlineCXA330300 From South Africa, joined May 2004, 1567 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 2329 times:

CO has more int'l routes than any other US airline.

Mind you, Europe is a big moneymaker for CO. EWR-TLV alone has two dailies, and they are the only airline to fly NYC-GLA year-round.



The sky is the limit as long as you can stay there
User currently offlineScf158 From Switzerland, joined Dec 2003, 413 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 2189 times:

Im surprised you think EWR-GVA is such an oddball route. It seems perfectly logical to me, it links both cities where UN headquarters are located. Im sure CO does very well on this route even with LX as the competition.

User currently offlineScottishLaddie From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2004, 2385 posts, RR: 8
Reply 14, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 2122 times:

I don't see how EDI is an oddball?! It's the capital of Scotland and the most important business and tourist centre in the UK, behind London obviously. It's crying out for more transatlantic services and bookings are already looking very good, business class being virtually full or full on all flights. Which is where CO makes the money.

User currently offlineDutchjet From Netherlands, joined Oct 2000, 7864 posts, RR: 57
Reply 15, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 2065 times:

Routes like EWR-EDI and EWR-GVA are not oddball, they are just unusual in that those European cities are not currently served by other US carriers - GVA has seen service with Pan Am, TWA and others in the past, and I believe this is the first time a US carrier is going to EDI, so I think CO is being innovative by offering these services. Its good business - with hubs and alliances dominating the airline world, direct long-range services to anything but the largest of cities is becoming harder and harder to find.

As to the original question, as discussed before, CO is seriously looking at starting service out of EWR to Copenhagen, Stockholm and/or Helsinki (Helsinki as a continuation of a flight to another Scandanavian city) with winglet equipped 752s, CO is also looking at additional service out of EWR to UK regional airports (Bristol, Newcastle, Belfast have all been studied - still no word on which city or cities will be selected) with 752s, the long awaited Houston to Frankfurt and Houston to Madrid flights with 767 aircraft are still planned for the near-term future, and other European cities such as Barcelona are being looked for service in a few years time. Dont look for Dusseldorf, Munich or Stansted to come back in the near-term future. Across the Pacific, Seoul could be added depending on the SkyTeam possibilities from either EWR or IAH, nothing very definite and no one talks about the Newark-Osaka flight anymore so I guess thats not happening. To Latin America, CO would like to go back to Santiago de Chile and continues to have interest in Buenos Aires (CO missed its opportunity to start service to BA - just when it got the authority, the Argentine economy was is crisis, CO did not start service and the authority was re-assigned to other airlines) but nothing more than rumors. Colombia could see new service depending on the aviation situation in that nation and who ends up owning Avianca. Do look for more caribbean destinations out of both Houston and Newark to be added as CO fills out its schedules to the islands. Finally, there is that mystery destination rumored to be a city in Africa, but we will have to wait and see.



User currently offlineMischadee From Sweden, joined Apr 2004, 271 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 2013 times:

I think it is great with CO serving many European destinations. If they can only start serving ARN also, that would be even greater.

Mischa.



ARNiboy
User currently offlineLtbewr From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13169 posts, RR: 15
Reply 17, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 1929 times:

I think there are other reasons in addition to those noted above as to the International business success of CO. Many companies, and some individuals, prefer to do business with as few airlines they can, so as to get business volume discounts (and for the individual, FF miles!) You have many companies with major operations or their headquarters based in the NYC area and since CO offers the largest range of flight destinations domestic and internationally, it leads many to put most of their business with CO. With CO they find good service in flight. In turn, this means that CO expands the range of cities it will serve internationally to serve this growing needs by groups of client companies and indiduals. As pointed out above, that with the possible exception of LAX, ORD and Atlanta airports, how many other airports have as much O&D as EWR? How many airlines serve BUF and HKG, or Guam and Miami? The range of routes adds to their attracting many companies and individuals.

User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16892 posts, RR: 51
Reply 18, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 1894 times:

EWR - Geneva is a very profitable route for CO, it caters to the tremendous amount of business traffic between New Jersey's and Swiss Pharmeceutical companies. The Pharmeceutical industry is huge in New Jersey, New Jersey is home to such companies as Johnson and Johnson, Bristol Myers Squib etc..
Also Merck, Phizer etc employ tens of thousands in New Jersey. New Jersey is a Center for Bio-Medical research in the World, and has strong ties to other such regions such as Geneva.

It also as mentioned picks up UN Traffic, which is also tied in with Bio-medical and Pharmeceutical with regards to World Health issues.



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineCba From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 4531 posts, RR: 3
Reply 19, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 1844 times:

These routes are not oddballs, they are routes that Continental has little competition on. While a New York - London or New York - Paris flight is risky due to competition, a nonstop 767 to GVA suffers from very little direct competition.

Continental has an advantage most don't with their domestic fleet, with the exception of the MD-80's that will be gone soon, the fleet is all-737. Unlike AA, UA, DL, and NW, who all operate various forms of multiple aircraft.


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