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DL Begin Hourly From ATL-IAD On August 1  
User currently offlineScottysAir From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (10 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 2730 times:

Hi Everyone,

I got very good news for DL begin hourly service from ATL-IAD into Aug 1, 2004 and here with the press releases:

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/040611/clf012_1.html

Regards!

19 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineFjnovak1 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 607 posts, RR: 2
Reply 1, posted (10 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 2684 times:

This is of course in respons to Independence Air planning to have something like 20 daily flights between the city pairs. Lets see, between AirTran and Delta flying both ATL-DCA and ATL-BWI (keep in mind DL flies a couple 763s to BWI), FlyI and Delta flying over 40 combined r/t ATL-IAD (does AirTran go into IAD - i cant recall) that is a HUGE amount of capacity and a large increase into the DC area...!!!!


Go Blue!!
User currently offlineCOEWRNJ From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 1064 posts, RR: 19
Reply 2, posted (10 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 2663 times:

Fjnovak1,
Yes, FL does fly into IAD.

It should be interesting to see how this all plays out.


User currently offlineTOLtommy From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3288 posts, RR: 4
Reply 3, posted (10 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 2629 times:

Interesting that high cost Delta is dumping seats into an already competetive LCC market. They must not want to surrender the market at all, because they'll have to be flying at a loss.

User currently offlineSESGDL From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 3471 posts, RR: 10
Reply 4, posted (10 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 2625 times:

Good news, more expansion for DL. I hope that they run that dumb Independence Air out of ATL.

Jeremy


User currently onlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 22863 posts, RR: 20
Reply 5, posted (10 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 2618 times:

When looking at the capacity, don't forget the 6 daily UA CRJs from ATL to IAD.


I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineGreg From United Kingdom, joined May 2005, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (10 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 2516 times:

Strange..becuase some are refering to Flyi as a LCC and Delta as the high cost carrier...

Actually, Independence' seat mile cost is about double of DL...making them the LCC (of course, that's low cost for seat mile cost...not necessarily for ticket price).

However, in this case, the advantage is clearly DL's.
Independence can likely pick a better battle to focus their energy on...


User currently offlineScottysAir From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (10 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 2472 times:

Yes, this is very good news for DL and they make hourly with every of those flights to IAD. It will be good for them. Keep it up, Delta!!  Smile

User currently offlineCaptover From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 87 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (10 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 2425 times:

Don't hate on Independence Air, you have no reason to. They haven't even started flying yet.

User currently offlineGigneil From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 16347 posts, RR: 85
Reply 9, posted (10 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 2347 times:

They are ACA.

I hate ACA.

Therefore, I hate FlyI.

And greg is right. Twice as high a cost is twice as high a cost, whether we like them or not.

N


User currently offlineSrbmod From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (10 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 2279 times:

I smell a complaint on the horizon for predatory practices. Delta is honestly risking legal action on the part of Independence Air. This is nothing more than seat dumping on the route. Even if Independence Air goes to 20 RTs a day on the ATL-IAD route (like that's really going to happen), that's only 1000 seats a day added on the route. It's not like they're throwing 20 RTs a day on the routes with an A320 instead of the CRJ. I've said it before, and I'll say it again, ATL will be the first city Independence Air will drop. The route is already saturated enough between Delta (and Delta Connection), AirTran, and United Express. US Airways tried putting Metrojet on the route back in the late 1990s, and they got smacked around pretty good. If the route warranted additional flights, don't you think United would be putting mainline metal on the route, or that Delta would switch flights that are currently operated by a DCI airline with mainline metal, or AirTran would add flights on the route as well. The only reason why Delta is adding service (a whopping 4 new flights) on the route is because of Independence Air.

User currently offlineSESGDL From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 3471 posts, RR: 10
Reply 11, posted (10 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 2252 times:

Srbmod,

Blah blah blah. Doesn't someone say that every time that a major defends their market share? Is legal action ever taken? No. I don't see what's wrong with an airline doing whatever they can to defend their market, why is it okay for the low-fares to come in and drop fares 50%+? I don't think it should be. People just need to get over it. Business is business. It's all about who can defend themselves the best.

Jeremy


User currently offlineFjnovak1 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 607 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (10 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 2220 times:

SRBMOD, initially starting june 16th Independence will offer 10 daily r/t CRJ flights ATL-IAD...however, in July that will increase to 13, and in by August it will be hourly flights (16 daily)....so no, it isn't 20 per day, but 16 is a fair amount...Here is a capacity comparison between June 14th (pre Independence Air) and August 2nd (when the full schedule for FlyI and Delta are in effect)

ATL-IAD flights on Monday, June 14th...
6 daily on United Express-Air Wisconsin (6 CRJ x 50 seats) = 300 seats
5 daily on AirTran (5 B717 x 105 coach seats) = 525 seats
11 daily on Delta (7 MD88, 3 B757, 1 CRJ) = 1420 seats


Searching ATL-IAD flights on August 2nd.....lets count coach seats only since the premium seats (only on Airtran and Delta) remain mostly constant...
16 daily on Independence Air (16 CRJ x 50 seats) = 800 seats
6 daily on United Express-Air Wisconsin (6 CRJ x 50 seats) = 300 seats
5 daily on AirTran (5 B717 x 105 coach seats) = 525 seats
15 daily on Delta (7 MD88, 3 B757, 5 CRJ) = 1620 seats (assuming they are 50-seat RJs)

Unlike the example with Northwest bringing in 4 of their 44 seat CRJs into the LAN-IAD market, I really don't think that any predatory case would hold up here....Delta is matching the hourly service of Independence Air with their smallest capacity plane in order to preserve what is already THEIR market clearly in terms of seats offered daily...obviously the biggest net increase of seats offered is the seats offered by Independence.... basically even once FlyI operates full schedule, Delta will offer 50% of the seats in the (coach class) market, and 75-80% of the premium seats. Total seat capacity will be 3245. That's still, like I said before, a lot of seat capacity. I'd say thats about 75 or 80% of the seat capacity from the SFO-LAX corridor, and I think that is one of the nations busiest routes. Will be interesting to see how this plays out.



Go Blue!!
User currently offlineEddieDude From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 7568 posts, RR: 43
Reply 13, posted (10 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 2202 times:

Please be gentle if I am asking a stupid question, but wouldn't it be better for DL to add more flights to DCA rather than to IAD? I ask because I have the impression that while ATL is clearly more of a connecting hub, Washington, D.C. is more of an 0&D city for DL.


Next flights: MEX-GRU (AM 77E), GRU-GIG (JJ A320), SDU-CGH (G3 73H), GRU-MEX (JJ A332).
User currently offlineGreg From United Kingdom, joined May 2005, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (10 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 2200 times:

I think there is a lot of bad feelings on here for FlyI for a couple of reasons:

1. they are/used to be ACA which I guess has a bad rep. I don't have an opinion on that one way or the other.

2. It would 'appear'--and I use the term lightly--that their biz plan is a bit ill conceived based on what's going on in the industry, circa 2004.

I don't think anyone has any personal delight in seeing them fail. I actually am more interested in seeing the established LCC's and legacy carriers slowly erode their market share.

Sometimes the 'reaction' is far more interesting than the 'action'


User currently offlineWmupilot From United States of America, joined Jan 2003, 1473 posts, RR: 12
Reply 15, posted (10 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 2131 times:

EddieDude

It is my understanding that there are no more slots available into DCA. Therefore any new additions to the DC area are going to have to go to IAD or BWI.

NW is doing the same thing to Indy and LAN. On average there are 70 pax a day going to IAD. NW just about owns every airport in Michigan and they aren't going to give that up without a fight. IAir is picking a fight that they cannot win. Going head to head with NW, in Michigan non-the-less, is going to cost the dearly. I don't forsee Iair staying in LAN for very long.



JetBlue - Bringing humanity back to air travel
User currently offlineTango-Bravo From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 3805 posts, RR: 29
Reply 16, posted (10 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 2120 times:

Greg writes: I don't think anyone has any personal delight in seeing them fail. I actually am more interested in seeing the established LCC's and legacy carriers slowly erode their market share.

Nor do I wish to see Independence Air fail. The legacies are however, IMO, playing the fool (nothing new) in their costly retaliatory schemes aimed at an airline that will probably put itself out of business before year's end -- if not considerably sooner. IMHO FlyI needs no help from DL or NW or anyone else in effecting their own demise; their business plan is virtually certain to take care of that outcome quite efficiently and quickly all by itself.


User currently offlineWidgetBoi From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 1432 posts, RR: 19
Reply 17, posted (10 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 2072 times:

Hopefully they'll knock IndyAir out Big grin

jeremy


User currently offlineNy-jfk-lga From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 374 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (10 years 2 months 1 week 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 1999 times:

You know what, you guys can hate aca as much as you want. ACA is gonna be gone. Independence Air is what's here now. So like us or hate us, we're hoping to be around so you can just keep on hating us as long as you like.


Bring back McDonnell Douglas & T W A!!
User currently offlineGreg From United Kingdom, joined May 2005, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (10 years 2 months 1 week 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 1993 times:

TangoB...that is exatly what I'm getting at. It's likely that if DL had 747's they would put them on the route just to rid themselves of FlyI quicker.

I am in agreement that they need no help in their demise...the business plan very likely is only 7 Chapters long..if you get my drift.


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