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Most Of African Airlines Dying.  
User currently offlineCV990 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 2934 times:


Hi!

I just saw in another topic that Ghana Airways no longer can operate in USA. Now adding to these a bunch of other ones that used to be quite regular in the skies is s very sad scenario.
Airlines like Air Afrique, Air Zaire, Nigeria Airways, Sudan Airways, Somali Airways, Uganda Airlines, Zambia Airways, Air Malawi - all of them used to be great airlines that flew around Europe and USA now you don't see them no more or eventually you'll see them with leased airplanes. I remember seeing regulary in LHR Nigeria Airways flying the DC-10 and the 707, Air Zaire was a common sight in Brussels, Lisboa and Paris. Sudan Airways had regular flights to LHR too, Zambia de same with the nice looking DC-10, Uganda Airlines the same and even Somali at one point flew in Europe. really bad times for Africa!
regards

24 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineUTA_flyingHIGH From Tunisia, joined Oct 2001, 6495 posts, RR: 50
Reply 1, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 2888 times:

Not all of them :

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UTA



Fly to live, live to fly - Air France/KLM Flying Blue Platinum, BMI Diamond Club Gold, Emirates Skywards
User currently offlineSafetyDude From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3795 posts, RR: 15
Reply 2, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 2889 times:

Airlines like Air Afrique, Air Zaire, Nigeria Airways, Sudan Airways, Somali Airways, Uganda Airlines, Zambia Airways, Air Malawi - all of them used to be great airlines that flew around Europe and USA now you don't see them no more or eventually you'll see them with leased airplanes.
Most of these airlines have been long gone. Sadly, the political situation in many of those countries affects the airlines.

I imagine that one day, many African carriers will begin service again.  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

-Will



"She Flew For What We Stand For"
User currently offlineMrniji From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 2882 times:

I think UY (Cameroon Airlines, "CamAir") does not have the permission anymore to fly to the UK

User currently offlineJGPH1A From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 2868 times:

Really pragmatic times for Africa, I'm afraid is more the reality. National carriers were an expensive and largely unnecessary luxury in a continent where such a huge percentage of the population barely has enough to eat, and certainly cannot afford to fly anywhere. Having the national carrier fly to London, Paris or Rome was a matter of national pride rather than economic necessity.

I think a lot of these carriers have died off as a result of IMF/World Bank requirements related to development loans - there is often an insistence that unecessary expediture be reduced in order to qualify for the loan, and a loss-making national airline is often the most visible target for such cuts.

I suspect that the future pattern will unfold as 3 or 4 large African carriers developing 4 or 5 significant long-haul and regional hubs in Africa, possibly taking over smaller local carriers to provide regional feed and bilateral legality to the thing. Look at SA opening hubs in DAR and LOS as well as JNB, and ET opening up its hub in ACC. Sensible hubs in sub-saharan Africa with good O&D as well as transfer traffic would probably be

JNB - SA - l/h to Europe/Asia/Australia/Americas
LOS - SA - l/h to Europe/Americas
DAR - SA - l/h to Europe/Asia
NBO - KQ - l/h to Europe/Asia/Australia
ABJ - KQ - l/h to Europe/Americas
ADD - ET - l/h to Europe/Asia/Americas
ACC - ET - l/h to Europe/Americas

I think ET's route structure of reliable and reasonably frequent multi-stop service all the way across the continent should be examined by other African airlines, since this seems to be the only way of providing economically viable service to many points on the continent. If such service is provided between hubs at opposite ends of the continent, and can be timed to coincide with intercontinental arrivals and departures from those hubs, reasonable service levels could be offered.


[Edited 2004-07-28 14:13:43]

User currently offlineDkny From Ethiopia, joined Mar 2004, 714 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 2864 times:

Sudan air is still flying.

But you also have successful world class carriers such as, Ethiopian, South African Airways, Kenya Airways and Egypt Air flying around with brand new aircraf


User currently offlinePhaeton From Germany, joined Jan 2004, 406 posts, RR: 2
Reply 6, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 2832 times:

Tunisair also seems to be healthy airline with modern planes. I wonder what effect the terrorist attack in Djerba in April 2002 had.


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Air Zimbabwe seemed to doing well, until Mr. Mugabe  Pissed started to mess the country up. They were one of the last operators of the 707 and flew to a couple of cities in Europe (and still do).


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Thomas




"History will be kind to me for I intend to write it.", Winston Churchill
User currently offlineMrniji From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 2800 times:

How is Royal Air Maroc doing?

I am particularly happy about the success of ET


User currently offlineNa From Germany, joined Dec 1999, 10817 posts, RR: 9
Reply 8, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 2778 times:

Looking at Nigeria´s population which almost equals that of the USA its surprising that they don´t have a national carrier with at least a dozen 747s.

Particularly if you see how many Nigerians are spread all over the world, how many of them travel regularly and pay the high fares of international top carriers.
On the other hand all Nigerians I know (and I know quite a lot) prefer to fly Lufthansa, BA or another major European carrier. And these carriers ask a premium to fly there, and the flight are packed! Frankfurt-Lagos costs more than Frankfurt-Hongkong or Singapore which is almost three times the mileage!
Quite interesting if you think about who travels these routes. I bet the average Hongkong-flyer has a lot more money in his pockets than the Lagos-traveller!
Lagos flights must be one of the last goldmines for airlines.


User currently offlineDkny From Ethiopia, joined Mar 2004, 714 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 2761 times:

ET has 10 round trip flights to Lagos a week. All of these flights carry Nigerians going to Asia and the middle east. I think KQ has the same number of flights to Lagos.
ET has been successful throught it's 57 years of service. After all their solgan is "Africa's Link to the World"



User currently offlineDonder10 From Canada, joined Oct 2001, 6660 posts, RR: 21
Reply 10, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 2759 times:

Lagos flights must be one of the last goldmines for airlines

All the major EU airlines make a killing in southern Nigeria.Probably the highest yielding VFR traffic in the world as well as the mass of oil-related traffic and cargo.


User currently offlineMrniji From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 2737 times:

AI will soon restart flights to LOS, after the fiasco in the end-80s.. the proposed route BOM-NBO-LOS could be a money-machine (business). Already today, airlines like ET, Egypyair, KQ etc. carry pax from India to Nigeria (LOS has a considerable Indian population, 200.000??)

User currently offlineCV990 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 2708 times:


Hi!

Of course we have sone good examples of sucess, I'm particulary happy with TAAG/Angola Airlines, they don't a big network but they do have some good international flights to Europe and also to Brazil.
My sadness goes of course to some countries that by their size and economy could have pretty good airlines, Nigeria is one of them, they have oil they should be quite healthy, well at least they were until 2000!
Air Afrique is another sad example, they were over the edge so many years, I remember seeing them since the 60's in JFK!!!!! They had a nice fleet with DC-10's that I saw in GVA many years ago, the countries that they worked with looked quite calm and even they stopped flying.
I also agree that Ethiopian is a great example of reliability and great sense of air service, I congratulate them!
Finally just a stimulating word to one of the most poor countries in the world, Mozambique that even like that they have a small fleet of airplanes but they keep going!
regards


User currently offlineMrniji From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 2689 times:

Even Air Madagascar had (has?) a good reputation for their service. They came (come?) to FRa some time ago (still?)

User currently offlineBeachthing From United States of America, joined May 2004, 71 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 2511 times:

Considering the horrendous economic/political/social/humanitarian status of many African nations, should we be surprised that they can't/don't operate successful airlines...?

User currently offlineKamboi From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 145 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 2468 times:

you think Nigeria has it bad? Try flying into Freetown, Sierra Leone. Let alone find good airlines that fly there.

User currently offlineVarig md-11 From France, joined Jul 2000, 1605 posts, RR: 7
Reply 16, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 2421 times:

if it's true lots of people can't afford basic needs in many parts of Africa, it's also true that lots of them CAN afford to fly.

AF flights to Africa are money makers and often full.
Air Afrique flights were nearly always full but with 1/3 of pax flying for free

African airlines that are surviving are the ones which adopted this modern craze called accountancy



AF TW AA NW DL UA CO BA U2 TP UX LH SK AZ MP KL SN VY HV LS SS TK SQ PC RG IW SE
User currently offlineHorus From Egypt, joined Feb 2004, 5230 posts, RR: 59
Reply 17, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 2368 times:

Well the North African ones are all doing well:

Egyptair

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TunisAir

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Air Algeria

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Royal Air Maroc

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As well as

South African Airways

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Kenya Airways

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Horus




EGYPT: A 7,000 Year Old Civilisation
User currently offlineETStar From Canada, joined Jan 2004, 2103 posts, RR: 7
Reply 18, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 2326 times:

Hey Horous,
Are we being a little biased there? How about Ethiopian Airlines?


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User currently offlineLtbewr From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13195 posts, RR: 15
Reply 19, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 2277 times:

Most national government subsided airlines throughout the world are disappearing or are being privitized. As noted above, World Bank/INF loans requirements, as well as trade treaties are making unacceptable the government subsidised airline. There is also the economy of scale necessary for an airline, those whom are too small for the demand or don't run services they can maintain, are the ones dying. The survivors are probably those airlines who's governments don't interfere with their operations, have professional management and where the government's leaders don't use the airline as their personal place for patronage or their private fleet. The survivors are also those who have priority or advantages in their significant home markets and thus a pratical monopoly. What is also unfortunate is the total lack of any US based major or minor airlines operating anywhere to/from Africa, due to limited demands and security fears.

User currently offlineCptGirmayTesfa From Peru, joined Oct 2003, 406 posts, RR: 3
Reply 20, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 2248 times:

Try to be positive!!

Air Gabon is alive and kicking.

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Eritrean Airlines is a newcomer.

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Air Tanzania is getting itself in terms again.

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But the BEST of all: I am not biased at all  Smile

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User currently offlineEurostarVA From Bahrain, joined May 2002, 1296 posts, RR: 7
Reply 21, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 1995 times:

I think North Africa belongs to another political and cultural world (that of the Middle East and Europe to some extent).

Since many of you are discussing Nigeria and its lack of a strong carrier... I dont think SAA will slip its chance to successfully buy into the new proposed Nigerian Eagle Airlines (NEA). There are still many delays in getting this new airline off the ground but this is not new in Nigeria, as the government has been shamelessly going in circles since years ago in getting a new airline started.

In any case, if NEA ever takes off, it will probably develop into the largest airline between Egypt (North) and South Africa (South). You all said why, the market is 120 million people with a sizable wealthy class, business travelers, VFR traffic, etc , etc. If the political will exists in Nigeria, NEA may grow to operate 10 aircraft within 1 year and 50 aircraft in 10 years.

At the moment, I have a lot of respect for Ethiopian Airlines, a truely pioneering and successful airline which has defied all odds and became a world-class airline in my opinion. Their fleet plans will eventually pay off and they can expand further (on the continent) if they focus on the 737NG and increase frequencies and reduce tiresome multileg flights (sometimes up to 3 legs).

Kenya Airways is also a good example of a well-thought and planned turn-around exercise. They are on track now in joining the SkyTeam Alliance throught their partner KLM. They have also increased frequencies and destinations and became a truely attractive way to fly into East our South Africa. I am now considering redeeming my Flying Dutchman (KLM) FF points to travel from Saudi Arabia to Kenya (what a wonderful world of air travel we live in!)

There are some other airlines that are flying on the edge right now such as Air Gabon and Cameroon Airlines. Both have been reported to be struggling recently and sadly, I do expect their demise in the next few years, along with other airlines such as Air Zimbabwe, Sudan Air (if privatization fails), TAAG and Air Madagascar. At least if they dont die they will become satellite carriers providing air links to their operating bases from regional, larger hubs such as the ones listed in the above message (Nairobi, Addis, Lagos and Johannesburg).




[Edited 2004-07-29 14:57:52]


If there is a will, there is a way
User currently offlineNa From Germany, joined Dec 1999, 10817 posts, RR: 9
Reply 22, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 1984 times:

"Since many of you are discussing Nigeria and its lack of a strong carrier... I dont think SAA will slip its chance to successfully buy into the new proposed Nigerian Eagle Airlines (NEA). There are still many delays in getting this new airline off the ground but this is not new in Nigeria, as the government has been shamelessly going in circles since years ago in getting a new airline started."

SAA would be clever in two ways: For one its about lucrative routes, and second, this is a way of placing the handful of venerable 747-300s they have parked just a few months ago! (one of them was already operated together with Nigeria Aw. 2 or 3 years ago).
But they have to use cleverness and sharp machetes to get through the infamous Nigerian corruption which is a major source of income for many people there - and the major reason for the notoriously endless delays over there.


User currently offlineCV990 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 1977 times:


Hi!

I forgot to mention but TACV ( Cape Verde Islands Airlines ) is also doing nice even knowing that the major income they have is from tourism, they fly regulary to LIS with the 757 and I also think they fly to ORY and AMS. is that right?
Regards


User currently offlineTs-ior From Tunisia, joined Oct 2001, 3492 posts, RR: 6
Reply 24, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 1927 times:


Phaeton,

Tunisair is doing well and the terrorist attack of 2002 in Djerba didn't have dramatic aftermaths for the airline. It is now undergoing commercial and social "refreshment" and i guess it would "recover" by 2006 with new orders...long-hauliers this time !!! Not confirmed yet !!!

In Tunisia we have also two other airlines that are expanding in a regular and fast pace; Nouvelair (LBT/BJ) and Karthago (KAJ/5R). Tuninter, the domestic and regional commuter airline is also making good efforts for a place in the market.

Egyptair, Lybian Arab Airlines, Afriqyiah, Air Algerie, RAM, Air Senegal, Ethiopian, Eretrian, Kenya Airways, Air Mauritius and Air Seychelles seem also to be in a good health.

The problem in Africa is only in the western and central countries that suffer wars, bad management,...


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