Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
CD Walkmans + Alitalia = Don't Match?  
User currently offlineAeroflot777 From Russia, joined Mar 2004, 3010 posts, RR: 27
Posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 2871 times:

When I was flying Alitalia 2 days ago, I decided to listen to my CD's in the middle of the flight, like I have been doing all my life. When all of a sudden an FA came up to me and asked me what it was. I told him it was a regular CD player run by batteries. After this he told me to put it away immediately and that I shouldn't take it out again since it was prohibited. I asked him why since I have never been in this situation before. He said you can not listen to music on the flight. This was an Airbus 321. The TV that was closest to me popped out of the ceiling and I realized the TV was broken, so I had to look further down the cabin to see the other one. But here came another problem. The FAs didn't distribute the earphones, so none of the passengers could listen to the TVs even though they were showing something. So basically the whole flight went on without ANY entertainment, not even my own personal walkman.
So my final question is, why does Alitalia prohibit walkmans on board? Is it some kind of new airline rule or something? Has anyone been in the same situation?
Thanks in advance. Aeroflot777

P.S. Is it normal for Alitalia to have an all male FA crew? Because thats what happened to me.

35 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineMikedlayer From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2004, 399 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 2814 times:

Its one of those pathetic little rules that some airlines make up as a bit of a play safe method. If you had an A321 full of passengers using cd players, mobile phones, laptop cd players and radios, well yeah you might cause a little confusion to the navigational system the aircraft uses.

But the odd cd player isn't going to make ANY difference at all....we were only the other month having a discussion about ATC radio scannners the a lot of us have, and how some of us use it on board to listen in and follow the flight along the airwaves. If i were you i'd just have the cd player in your bag with an earphone discretly, thats what I did on Iberia - otherwise they would have opened the door and chucked me out!

Mike


User currently offlineAeroflot777 From Russia, joined Mar 2004, 3010 posts, RR: 27
Reply 2, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 2752 times:

But doesn't Alitalia and Iberia see that other airlines allow them and nothing terrible happens. So why don't they just drop their weird rules?
Aeroflot777


User currently offlineShamrock_747 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 2729 times:

I was in a similar situation on an Alitalia A321 ATH-MXP flight in 2002. I got my CD walkman out and started using it and after half an hour one of the crew came up to me saying "it is forbidden". Funnily enough I had been listening to the same CD player a week before, perfectly legally, on a bmi A321. AZ's rule seems nonsensical.

User currently offlineSafetyDude From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3795 posts, RR: 15
Reply 4, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 2722 times:

My friend had the same experience on a 747. He took out his CD player while at cruise altitude, but a FA told him to put it away.

Is there any reason for AZ's "extra-precaution"?

 Smile
-Will



"She Flew For What We Stand For"
User currently offlineAeroflot777 From Russia, joined Mar 2004, 3010 posts, RR: 27
Reply 5, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 2702 times:

Quite stupid situations arise because of their weird rules.

User currently offlineBurnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7547 posts, RR: 8
Reply 6, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 2677 times:

No wonder everyone seems to complain about Alitalia and Iberia, with service and rules like that, who does want to fly them.


"Some People Just Know How To Fly"- Best slogan ever, RIP NW 1926-2009
User currently offlineSolnabo From Sweden, joined Jan 2008, 852 posts, RR: 2
Reply 7, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 2647 times:

AZ is going down the tube..............FAST!!!  Insane

Micke



Airbus SAS - Love them both
User currently offlineTripleDelta From Croatia, joined Jul 2004, 1123 posts, RR: 7
Reply 8, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 2622 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
PHOTO SCREENER

I for one am inseparable from my CD walkman (it's an extension of my body  Big thumbs up ) and always carry it and listen to on flights. I've had no trouble so far (on carriers such as Adria Airways, Croatia Airlines, Air Adriatic, JAT and the like). I've seen passengers using a lot of appliances (laptops, calculators, PDAs, walkmans,...) and nobody ever said anything. The only things that were forbidden are those that...hmmm...transmit radiation for a living, such as mobiles (scanners excluded, if you just listen).
As Mikedlayer said, it's probably some sort of public statement that says "fly with us, we're safer cause we don't fly like cowboys like other companies". The reasons could be numerous, but probably some public image problems. To the layman, who doesn't know how electrical appliances like CD players and navigation instruments interact, this "it's forbidden" statement adds a note of confidence in the carrier and a sense of security - cause the "professionals" say it is safer and I don't want to get involved...



No plane, no gain.
User currently offlineEIRules From Ireland, joined Aug 2007, 781 posts, RR: 10
Reply 9, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 2602 times:

EI does not allow them either, which is a total pain especially since they dont offer PTVs on most of their transatlantic flights


Next Flights: EI DUB-LHR A320, BA LHR-SFO B744, UA SFO-LAS A320, BA LAS-LHR B744, EI LHR-DUB A320
User currently offlineAeroflot777 From Russia, joined Mar 2004, 3010 posts, RR: 27
Reply 10, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 2575 times:

Could we see an improvement to these rules in the near future? Maybe the rules will be eliminated?

User currently offline777236ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 2558 times:

But the odd cd player isn't going to make ANY difference at all....we were only the other month having a discussion about ATC radio scannners the a lot of us have, and how some of us use it on board to listen in and follow the flight along the airwaves. If i were you i'd just have the cd player in your bag with an earphone discretly, thats what I did on Iberia - otherwise they would have opened the door and chucked me out!

Wrong.

Rf interference is a real, and very serious issue.

Curtosy of aviation-safety.net, check out these incidents and causes:

NAV CDI needle swing (off course) - tape players
CDI needle swings - chess player
erroneous nav signal of VOR station - dictaphone
loss of VOR capability - cellphone
HSI's discsrepancies - cellphone
NAV compass & CDI oscillation (off course) - PEDs
off VOR course - cellphone
off course - tape player
music blocked VHF comm's - FM radio
comm's blocked - Nintendo, cellphone, notebooks
off course - tape machine+Nintendo
off course - cellphone
both VORs lost, no VOR audio signal - cellphone
all directional gyros lost - 25 radio's, 1 laptop
compass error; off course - laptop, comp.game
2 missed approaches - PED suspected
loss of all autonav functions - 3 laptops, cdplayer/radio
loc receiver anomaly; missed app. - PED suspected
compass precess 10deg - laptop
Omega NAV unreliable - tv set suspected
HSI errors - cellphone
nav compass sys error; off course - cellphone
temp loss of com freq. - cd player
INS nav errors - electronic games
off course - cellphone
eng fuel ctlr - vhf radio interference cellphone
off course - laptop
EMI interference & radio alt flag - cd-players (2)
erratic cdi indications - 2 gameboys
autopilot erratic - cellphone suspected
off course - gameboy
nav radio interference; off ILS course - computer game
EMI interference causes a split between the compass system in flight - laptop
both LOC and GS 'OFF' flags showed just prior to the Outer Marker - PED suspected
significant LOC rate of deflection - PED possible
loss of Captain EFIS display - 8 laptops
electronic compass erratic - cd player
interfering transmitter - cellphone
NAV and COM radio problems - PED suspected
off approach path - PED suspected
off course due to drifting FM - PED suspected
HSI discrepencies + PED suspected
EICAS interference, airspeed discrep. - PED
loss of COM frequency - cellphone
ILS, radio altimeter, and primary flight display went out - 20 cellphones

Scary stuff.

The rules are clear: no electronic devices are to be used during takeoff or landing. That includes radios, CD players, cameras, phones, anything. If the crew say don't use certain electronic equipment throughout the flight, don't use them. You're putting the lives of everyone on board at risk.


User currently offlineSmcmac32msn From United States of America, joined May 2004, 2211 posts, RR: 4
Reply 12, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 2535 times:

Wrong.

Rf interference is a real, and very serious issue.


How come AA, UA, NW, YX, DL, AS have all let me use my CD player in flight without a problem. I take them out when they tell you that you can use these types of devices, and put them away when told to also... I don't see how this stuff happened unless people weren't following the take-off/landing rules.... It should be allowed at altitude. Will AS' DIGePLAYER interfere somehow with the navigation? Thats just a glorified portable DVD player.



Hey Obama, keep the change! I want my dollar back.
User currently offline777236ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 2524 times:

Whether they should be allowed for use at altitude or not isn't up to you. Above are examples of serious RF interference. If airlines and regulatory authorities say you shouldn't you PEDs in cruise, you shouldn't. End of.

User currently offlineAviationwiz From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 962 posts, RR: 4
Reply 14, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 2514 times:

I can understand why you can't use cell phones, scanners, microwaves, all that crap on a plane, and I can understand why you can't use CD players and such during t/o and landing, but not being able to use them during cruise is nuts. *EVERY* airline I have ever flown on allows me to listen to my MP3 Player, I can't imagine being asked to put it away.


Proudly from the Home of the Red Tail.
User currently offlineSmcmac32msn From United States of America, joined May 2004, 2211 posts, RR: 4
Reply 15, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 2485 times:

How come AA, UA, NW, YX, DL, AS have all let me use my CD player in flight without a problem.

If airlines and regulatory authorities say you shouldn't you PEDs in cruise, you shouldn't. End of.

What regulatory authorities say you can't use a CD player at altitude? All those "SERIOUS" RF INTERFERENCE had nothing to do with a CD player, except a couple of TOGA' (Take Off-Go Around). Like I said, if you follow the rules of using it at altitude, you shouldn't have a problem.

My other question, how could a computer game cause "NAV RADIO INTERFERENCE"? Why do they put power-ports on certain seats designed for LAPTOPS if they cause such "SERIOUS" RF INTERFERENCE?



Hey Obama, keep the change! I want my dollar back.
User currently offlineCVGpilot From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 588 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 2484 times:

Well it hasn't been a "real" prob for the last 70 or so years of passenger flights, I doubt it will turn into a big prob' now. I think if American carriers tried to pull a stupid stunt like that, people would gladly choose another airline even if it cost a bit more to avoid such ignorance! Alitalia and TSA must be must get there policys from the same 7ucken genius!


Globally Yours
User currently offline777236ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 2472 times:

All those "SERIOUS" RF INTERFERENCE had nothing to do with a CD player, except a couple of TOGA' (Take Off-Go Around).

Look at all the PED interference incidents relating to CD players.

A temporary loss of comm. freq., erratic compass readings and EMI interference & radio alt flag.

Now, any of those at any stage of flight is serious. Consider how deadly they could be in busy airspace in bad weather.

My other question, how could a computer game cause "NAV RADIO INTERFERENCE"?

Every PED puts out RF. Even 'non-transmitters'.

Why do they put power-ports on certain seats designed for LAPTOPS if they cause such "SERIOUS" RF INTERFERENCE?

Laptops are another story! Laptops are a serious fire-risk. Li-ion batteries tend to heat up quite a lot when charged. Imagine leaving your laptop on charge, with a napkin underneath it, while nodding off in a business class seat. A deadly fire isn't too far away.

As for RF interference, airlines need to make money. It's a calculated risk. You can guarantee that if a plane crashes tomorrow from laptop-induced RF interference, or thanks to a fire caused by a laptop, the power ports would be removed immediatly.

Well it hasn't been a "real" prob for the last 70 or so years of passenger flights, I doubt it will turn into a big prob' now

The same sort of attitude that lead to Swissair 111, and TWA 800. RF interference is a very real and very serious issue. Apparently it only takes a crash for ignorant people such as yourself to realise that.


User currently offlineSmcmac32msn From United States of America, joined May 2004, 2211 posts, RR: 4
Reply 18, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 2457 times:

My other question, how could a computer game cause "NAV RADIO INTERFERENCE"?

Every PED puts out RF. Even 'non-transmitters'.

Why do they put power-ports on certain seats designed for LAPTOPS if they cause such "SERIOUS" RF INTERFERENCE?

Laptops are another story! Laptops are a serious fire-risk. Li-ion batteries tend to heat up quite a lot when charged. Imagine leaving your laptop on charge, with a napkin underneath it, while nodding off in a business class seat. A deadly fire isn't too far away.

As for RF interference, airlines need to make money. It's a calculated risk. You can guarantee that if a plane crashes tomorrow from laptop-induced RF interference, or thanks to a fire caused by a laptop, the power ports would be removed immediatly.


LOL... SO I CAN BRING MY DESKTOP COMPUTER ON THE PLANE TO PLAY "COMPUTER GAMES" and cause interference, but then you tell me that Laptops are another story? LOL. I know all about LITHIUM-ION BATTERIES. Yes they do heat up, no more so than the hot meal they put on the doilies. Those haven't caused fires lately, have they? No plane has been put at risk by laptops yet... nor will they be. The whole last paragraph that you wrote is laughable. They need to make money, so they put them in, but as soon as something happens, they are gone??? If they wanna make money, CD players shouldn't be on AZ or IB banned lists... Cuz then the money will go other places like, say, Olympic Air, Air France, British Air, BMI, BMIbaby, etc. And pretty soon, AZ and IB planes will have a nice fresh coat of paint or be in such places as GYR and MHV.



Hey Obama, keep the change! I want my dollar back.
User currently offline777236ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 2457 times:

LOL... SO I CAN BRING MY DESKTOP COMPUTER ON THE PLANE TO PLAY "COMPUTER GAMES" and cause interference, but then you tell me that Laptops are another story?

Laptops put out RF, so does your PC.

Yes they do heat up, no more so than the hot meal they put on the doilies.

And the hot meal cools down in minutes. A hot laptop battery stays hot throughout the flight.

They need to make money, so they put them in, but as soon as something happens, they are gone???

Just how many Swiss MD-11s have PTVs?

If they wanna make money, CD players shouldn't be on AZ or IB banned lists... Cuz then the money will go other places like, say, Olympic Air, Air France, British Air, BMI, BMIbaby, etc. And pretty soon, AZ and IB planes will have a nice fresh coat of paint or be in such places as GYR and MHV.

Really? How many passengers have done that? People don't switch airlines because they can't use CD players. They do because they can't use laptops.

Both are dangerous.


User currently offlineSmcmac32msn From United States of America, joined May 2004, 2211 posts, RR: 4
Reply 20, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 2440 times:

Just how many Swiss MD-11s have PTVs?

Hmmm... how many have seen the light of day in the last 4 years? NONE! They, along with TW no longer exist!

Really? How many passengers have done that? People don't switch airlines because they can't use CD players. They do because they can't use laptops.

People switch airlines because of many factors, just not because their laptops. Some switch because of things like laptop use, CD player use, PTV's, etc. I'll ask again, do AS DigEplayers cause a threat? They are a glorified portable DVD player... why do they allow that???



Hey Obama, keep the change! I want my dollar back.
User currently offlineCVGpilot From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 588 posts, RR: 1
Reply 21, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 2438 times:

Easy killer im not saying your full of shit, but 10's of thousands of flight take place daily, and 10's of thousands of flights land while pax on board used a wide range of eletronics, and you named 2 that you THINK crashed due to RF interference. Yes it truly sucks that planes crash, but 2 for a Million is'ent bad. Bad things just happen man. It's like saying eating cheeros is "VARY REAL AND SERIOUS" every person that eat cereal could choke and die on an O.

111, and 800 RIP

p.s Show me where it says what happened to 800 happened cause a kid was playing his gameboy???



Globally Yours
User currently offline777236ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 2429 times:

I'll ask again, do AS DigEplayers cause a threat? They are a glorified portable DVD player... why do they allow that???

They're onboard equipment, so they're electrically tested.

Easy killer im not saying your full of shit, but 10's of thousands of flight take place daily, and 10's of thousands of flights land while pax on board used a wide range of eletronics, and you named 2 that you THINK crashed due to RF interference. Yes it truly sucks that planes crash, but 2 for a Million is'ent bad. Bad things just happen man. It's like saying eating cheeros is "VARY REAL AND SERIOUS" every person that eat cereal could choke and die on an O.

I never said TWA800 or Swissair 111 crashed because of RF interference. Read what I write.


User currently offlineCVGpilot From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 588 posts, RR: 1
Reply 23, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 2420 times:

Its all good man, I see what your getting at, I just could not imagine being told all I could do on a flight is sit there. Im vary happy that the main carriers of the world have not done anything like that!


Globally Yours
User currently offlineFlyboyOz From Australia, joined Nov 2000, 1986 posts, RR: 25
Reply 24, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 2342 times:

BTW Aerofolt777 said:

"Is it normal for Alitalia to have an all male FA crew? Because thats what happened to me."

Yes..it's normal but very WEIRD to see all male cabin crew...lol...Qantas also have all male cabin crews in economy class as well.

[Edited 2004-08-15 03:05:06]


The Spirit of AustraliAN - Longreach
25 Post contains images Msl747 : So if laptops cause interference and pose a fire danger then why are airlines supplying power-points for them? -Msl747
26 Aeroflot777 : FlyboyOz, Thanks for answering my second question. Kinda weird from my point of view. I mean flying is a little more graceful with a female FA, at le
27 777236ER : So if laptops cause interference and pose a fire danger then why are airlines supplying power-points for them? Because there is no industry-wide conse
28 UN_B732 : I guess we are PEDophiles. Sorry, couldn't resist. AeroSvit bars CD Players, as far as I remember, but I don't think the rule is strictly enforced. I'
29 Post contains images SafetyDude : Above are examples of serious RF interference. Just for clarification, did those incidents happen when electronic devices were not supposed to be used
30 Greasespot : Everyone is missing the biggest point. You do not own the airline therefore they make the rules. IF They say every passenger has to wear a green shirt
31 777236ER : Just for clarification, did those incidents happen when electronic devices were not supposed to be used or when they could be used? It doesn't say. Pr
32 Post contains images Starlionblue : If they don't like CD players, buy an MP3 player. Ironically the hard drive models (like the iPod) have a much more powerful spinning disc than CD pla
33 MDL412 : When I flew Aerolineas Argentina in South America back in July of 2002, I tried to listen to my Nomad Muvo MP3 player, but the F/A told me very sternl
34 Schoenorama : As Iberia has been mentioned a couple of times in this thread, I've looked up an article published in 1996 on this subject, in the Spanish magazine, "
35 OV735 : Agreed with Greasespot. Unless own the airline, you have to comply with the rules, or fly another airline. Besides, I really hate it when my life is p
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
No CD Players On Alitalia? posted Wed Apr 13 2005 18:35:00 by JetboyTWA
Airplanes And Movies-They Don't Match posted Thu Jan 18 2001 00:10:37 by Airbus380
Pictures That Don't Match News Reports posted Fri Sep 8 2000 16:50:05 by AT
Bangkok's Don Muang To Reopen? posted Tue Dec 12 2006 07:03:39 by Chulalongkorn
Alitalia May Dump Skyteam: EUR200m Penalty Is Fine posted Mon Dec 11 2006 18:18:53 by Jimyvr
Why Don't BA Operate GB Airways Flights? posted Fri Dec 8 2006 19:43:45 by 8herveg
When Airport Employees Just Don't Get It... posted Wed Dec 6 2006 20:22:18 by Planenutz
Aeroflot To Lease 15 735 To Nord And Don Division posted Tue Dec 5 2006 18:13:22 by Jimyvr
Alitalia New Potential Buyer: Cathay+Air China posted Tue Dec 5 2006 04:54:27 by Jimyvr
China Southern: Don't Use The Lavatories posted Thu Nov 30 2006 19:55:42 by Mortyman