American762 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 175 posts, RR: 0 Posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 4238 times:
I'm sure it's been discussed but I can't find a forum and I've searched... But I've been curious...Sadly, I know AA is looking to retire their 762/762-ER's after their A300's in 2008, however, what will AA replace their 762's with? American makes tons of money on their lucrative 3-Class Transcontinental service...probably more profits than several intercontinental flights to Zurich and such on the 763. The 7E7 is certainly not in the immediate future for AA, so does AA have plans to replace the 762's with 757's, 767-300's, or one or two 777-200's per day? Perhaps they will do what UA is doing with 13 757's and make their own version of UA's 3-class "Premium Service"?
I sure hope they keep the 3 classes instead of going with the 767-300's which only fly Business and Coach.
Thanks in advance for any answers.
Pan Am has a place of its' own. You call it the world, we call it home.
Dutchjet From Netherlands, joined Oct 2000, 7864 posts, RR: 57
Reply 1, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 4098 times:
Yes, this has been discussed several times. AA is likely to keep a number of 762s operational for their JFK-LAX/SFO transcons......I dont see AA following UA's approach with low density 757s, at least not in the near-term future. While UA's transcons out of JFK are highly oriented to business travellers and the bi-coastal crowd and UA's 762s often flew the transcons with lots of empty seats in coach, AA does tend to fill up the 762s in all classes on its JFK-LAX and JFK-SFO flights and is not looking to cut seating capacity. It will be interesting to see how the premium pax reacts to UA's 757 transcon service - it certainly looks nice, but it will take several months after UA's new product is introduced to determine if there are objections to the switch from widebody 767 service to narrowbody 757 service on UA. Thus, AA will wait and see.
As for 762 replacements, there are a couple of scenarios:
1. AA retires the 762s and re-assigns 763s to the transcon routes - I would think that AA would arrange for a dedicated fleet of 763s to fly the transcons that would have a first class cabin. F class on the transcon flights is too lucrative to pass up. With adjsutments to the system wide schedules, AA probably can come up with enough 763s to take over the transcon routes.
2. AA in the long-run does go to the 757 from transcon services with a special configuration - a la United.
3. The financial picture for US legacy carriers, and specifically for AA improves, and AA places an order for the 7e7 (in one or more versions) to replace the 762s, then the A300s and finally, over time, the 763 fleet.
There is no immediate pressure for AA to do anything at the moment, many of the 762ERs are still rather young (delivered in the late 1980s) and the A300s also on average are only about 15 years old, so there is lots of time. If everything goes well, AA would not be looking to accept new aircraft until about 2009 or 2010, which is just when 7e7 delivery slots will be available. As Boeing and AA have a close working relationship, if AA signs up for the 7e7, Boeing will work hard to accommodate AA's delivery needs.
SevenHeavy From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2004, 1156 posts, RR: 10
Reply 2, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 4093 times:
The B762's are ideally suited for transcon runs. Customers like to fly widebodies and they are increasingly being sacrificed for higher frequency and point to point narrowbody services. They are also well suited because of their ability to accomodate a 3 class cabin and of their relatively high cargo capacity.
For these reasons they will be difficult to directly replace. Their operating costs are reasonably low as they are mostly paid off, therefore replacing with equivalent airbus aircraft, say an A332 would be expensive and higher load factors would be required to make them economically viable. The B762's are not yet troublesome or expensive from a MX perspective so this is not a significant factor.
My best guess would be to go for a mixture of 3 class B757's (as UA has recently announced) along with some 3 class B763's. These would potentially be made available by putting B777's on maturing B763 transatlantic routes. In time we may see B777's on some of the most lucrative runs but I would imagine no more than 3 or four would be used for this. UA uses 777's to hawaii successfully as well as on certain domestic runs (as does AA) so this could be a possibility if the demand existed for higher capacity at certain times i.e. JFK-LAX early evening services.
Even when the 7E7 is introduced (and I don't believe AA has ordered any yet anyway) they would likely be put on longer range international point to point service first. This is after all what they were designed for and where they would be best suited.
SafetyDude From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3795 posts, RR: 15
Reply 3, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 4027 times:
I have always been under the impression that the 762s will not be leaving the fleet, despite the monthly announcement during that they will leaving in a few months.
As it stands, there are about 10 762s out in the desert that might return to the fleet soon, although the information is a bit weak. I imagine that the 762s will stay with AA beyond 2008, although probably not a few more years after that. For replacement, the obvious answer is the 7E7 and I too would imagine that Boeing will work very hard to get the 7E7 into AA's fleet whenever they need it. Once the A300s are done with, I would be highly surprised to see any Airbus ever join the AA fleet. That being said, I do not think that AA has that many options for their fleet until they (presumably) get a few 7E7s which would replace the 762s and A300s, and eventually 763s.
AA's 777 deliveries/options have been pushed back a few years, but I would not be surprised to see a few new 777s take over some 763 routes which would then create a few extra 763s, although I think it is unlikely that they will go on trans-con flights, but rather replace A300 routes.
FlagshipAZ From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 3419 posts, RR: 14
Reply 8, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 3774 times:
AA had 17 762ERs and 13 basic 762. It's my understanding that the basic 762s are grounded, and are unlikely to return to service. These birds are among the first 767s ever built. The 16 remaining ERs (one was lost on 9/11/01) will still be in service for the foreseeable future. Also, IMO, AA is unlikely to order any more 767s, whether the -223s or 323s series. AA does have 40+ 738s & 9 more 772s on order but deferred until 2006. Regards.
"Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy." --Ben Franklin
American762 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 175 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 3737 times:
Thank you. I would really hate to loose the 762 on the transcons that I fly 10-15 times per year. I spend so much time in the air in AA's row 2 and 8 of their 762's. They are to me, by far, the most comfortable way to travel transcontinentally. For me, theres nothing more gorgeous in the sky than a 767-200ER in a polished-chrome look. Seeing that beautiful big bird at the gate...knowing that that is the bird that will take me across the country covering 2247 miles of citys, deserts, mountains, and lakes in a mere 5 hours...the transcontinental 3-class service with AA really lets me live the days of the 3 day overnight flights on DC-3's so long ago...some how their Transcon just does that in a way I can't understand....
May the 762 fly forever.
Pan Am has a place of its' own. You call it the world, we call it home.
NYCAAer From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 692 posts, RR: 3
Reply 11, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 3563 times:
AA received all of its latest 763 deliveries last year, from January '03 through September '03, albeit reluctantly. AA actually released a press statement that they did not want the extra capacity of the 9 new 763s, but their agreement with Boeing forced them into taking the new planes. The 9 new 763s are the only ones in the fleet to have the 777-like interior.
Aa777flyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (10 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 3308 times:
I doubt AA will dedicate a handful of 767-300's or 757's with a three class cabin to fly trans cons. This gets away from AA's whole plan for fleet simplification. The 762's will be around for a while, or the three class service will go away (this is not a rumour...just a possible scenario IMO). If the 7E7 were to be a possibility my guess is at least 10 years away....