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Imagine: Plane Hijacked And Heading To The USA  
User currently offlineFJWH From Netherlands, joined May 2004, 968 posts, RR: 4
Posted (9 years 11 months 15 hours ago) and read 10842 times:

I was wondering this for a while:

Imagine: A plane flying LHR - JFK(example) is hijacked. It's heading for the USA. Is there a plane of action for these kind of situations?
Can somebody tell me what the authority is going to do? Like for example: shoot down the plane so it can't be used for purposes as 9/11.

Any reply: thanks

FJWH


FlightS in the next 3 months: MSP, PHX, MEM, NCE, TFS, BCN. All round trips from AMS
68 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offline7LBAC111 From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2004, 2566 posts, RR: 35
Reply 1, posted (9 years 11 months 15 hours ago) and read 10682 times:

I think its a cert that if a plan is hijacked and it can be safely shot down, it will be. A small sacrifice - but the pax become unwilling heroes. But only after all other attempts and negotiations have been proved fruitless.




Debate is what you put on de hook when you want to catch de fish.
User currently offlinePilatusguy From Switzerland, joined Jan 2004, 315 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (9 years 11 months 14 hours ago) and read 10666 times:

A wise thing to do is talking to the hijackers and seeing where the plane actually goes. It is not in any way appropriate to shoot down a plane just because it's hijacked and heading to the US.
Looking at the USA's - let's call it: state of alert - they would probably send up some fighters to impress the folks and may even shoot - at the very last minute.

Sidetask: Think about what (i.e.) India would do if a hijacked plane would be heading towards their territory.....


User currently offlineJonathan-l From France, joined Mar 2002, 502 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (9 years 11 months 14 hours ago) and read 10642 times:

The film Executive Decision offered a solution: use a F-117 to fly in US Marines, have them enter the aircraft through a cargo door of some sort and have them take posession of the aircraft.

If the aircraft is flying from London to New York, little chance it would have much fuel at destination. How much impact did the quantity of fuel have on the 9/11 scenario?


User currently offlineGary2880 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (9 years 11 months 14 hours ago) and read 10625 times:

isnt being safley shot down a contradiction in terms

User currently offlineFJWH From Netherlands, joined May 2004, 968 posts, RR: 4
Reply 5, posted (9 years 11 months 14 hours ago) and read 10608 times:

"How much impact did the quantity of fuel have on the 9/11 scenario?"

A lot I guess, both planes had just took off and had some distance to fly to their (original) destinations. So a pretty big quantity of fuel was on board.
But Londen - New York was just an example.

FJWH



FlightS in the next 3 months: MSP, PHX, MEM, NCE, TFS, BCN. All round trips from AMS
User currently offlineIAH777 From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 0 posts, RR: 5
Reply 6, posted (9 years 11 months 14 hours ago) and read 10584 times:

isnt being safley shot down a contradiction in terms

Safely for those below, but yes, it is an oxymoron. More than unwilling heroes, the pax would become martyrs. Shooting it down would be the "best" option, but not one made easily.


User currently offlineEDKA From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 324 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (9 years 11 months 14 hours ago) and read 10555 times:

The film Executive Decision offered a solution: use a F-117 to fly in US Marines, have them enter the aircraft through a cargo door of some sort and have them take posession of the aircraft.

please tell me you are joking, right??


User currently offline7LBAC111 From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2004, 2566 posts, RR: 35
Reply 8, posted (9 years 11 months 14 hours ago) and read 10531 times:

EDKA - They got a load of maribes in through a small opening in the underside of the aircraft - if i remember correctly - but it not possible in real life.




Debate is what you put on de hook when you want to catch de fish.
User currently offlineStarlionblue From Greenland, joined Feb 2004, 16977 posts, RR: 67
Reply 9, posted (9 years 11 months 14 hours ago) and read 10500 times:

Note to pilots: never open cockpit door.


"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots."
User currently offlineJonathan-l From France, joined Mar 2002, 502 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (9 years 11 months 14 hours ago) and read 10494 times:

EDKA,

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0116253/

Great movie though!
 Wink/being sarcastic


User currently offlineRwylie77 From United Kingdom, joined May 2004, 367 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (9 years 11 months 14 hours ago) and read 10467 times:

I don't think the hijackers would do this because of the risk of being shot down would be too great. They would be more likely to hijack a plane going from New York to London and turn it around quickly before there was a chance of jets being sent up.

I think there is so much focus on aviation and security, i think the next time they will strike it will be on something with low security such as trains (like Madrid recently) or a cruise ship for example.


User currently offlineJCS From Netherlands, joined Jun 2004, 209 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (9 years 11 months 14 hours ago) and read 10464 times:

While wondering either the rescue-plot from Executive Decision is a real possibility (I remembered btw: "Critical Decision"), it is scary how the movie and 9/11 are equal.

Check also: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0116253/board/nest/9412157
"The whole plot of the movie has relevance to 9/11 [ hijaking planes (which was done before in Passanger 57), islam, etc]."


User currently offlineLtbewr From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13010 posts, RR: 12
Reply 13, posted (9 years 11 months 14 hours ago) and read 10456 times:

First, assuming an armed marshall is on the flight, he/she would probably have reduced the chance of this situation going any further than an initial phase of the attempted hijacking. Second, with the new cockpit doors or clear procedures to reduce access to the cockpit, and will not open them would probably fly severe manuvers to throw around the a-holes. Third, the a/c would be in constant radio contact with government authorities in the UK and US to determine the situation if just knifes, guns or a bomb on board and find out what the hijackers wanted. Fourth, probabably all flights within and inbound to the US would be halted and grounded until the situation concluded and later reborded with extreme inspections of passangers, luggage and freight. Probably some inbound flight would be diverted or retuned to airport departed from, depending where in flight. Fifth, the flight would be surrounded by military aircraft to act if necessary. Sixth, the a/c would probably be directed to an airport not in a major city (a diversion or emergency airport) or maybe a military air base. Once the a/c is on the ground then 'negotations' would take place and if they fail, then storming of the a/c at great risk of the death of many pax. If the a/c cannot be diverted, and continues to present a high risk of a crash into a building, then after all else fails it would be shot down.

User currently offlineEDKA From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 324 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (9 years 11 months 14 hours ago) and read 10454 times:

I have seen the film, the reason i was asking if you were joking is that you don't REALLY believe this can happen in real life, do you?

User currently offlineStarlionblue From Greenland, joined Feb 2004, 16977 posts, RR: 67
Reply 15, posted (9 years 11 months 14 hours ago) and read 10442 times:

As Ltbewr says, the situation has to progress rather far for it to get to the point of shooting down the plane.


"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots."
User currently offlineGary2880 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (9 years 11 months 13 hours ago) and read 10440 times:

also about the being shot down bit, wouldnt it be in the hijackers interests to wait till they reached american airspace or something? i would have thought it was silly from their point of view to hijack it too early, just depends on their intentions i guess

User currently offlineJonathan-l From France, joined Mar 2002, 502 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (9 years 11 months 13 hours ago) and read 10440 times:

EDKA,
No, although I liked the creative minds of the guys who wrote the script.


User currently offline7LBAC111 From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2004, 2566 posts, RR: 35
Reply 18, posted (9 years 11 months 13 hours ago) and read 10423 times:

I hope nobody thinks I'm an advocate for shooting down planes which have been hijacked - hence (from my original post!) ? Insane

But only after all other attempts and negotiations have been proved fruitless.

Edited to correct spelling.

[Edited 2004-08-19 14:24:32]


Debate is what you put on de hook when you want to catch de fish.
User currently offlineSoaringadi From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 472 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (9 years 11 months 13 hours ago) and read 10373 times:

"Can somebody tell me what the authority is going to do"

If its VS or BA......

Then blow the bloody plane off



If it ain't Boeing, I'm not going !
User currently offlineBENNETT123 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 7383 posts, RR: 3
Reply 20, posted (9 years 11 months 13 hours ago) and read 10337 times:


Soaringadi

Given that last time that it was AA and UA...


User currently offlineSoaringadi From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 472 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (9 years 11 months 13 hours ago) and read 10314 times:

Bennett...

It's nothing personal.... as if I am against any British airline or something.....

Infact I have flown on Bmi a couple of times since it's a member of star allianc, whenever I went to Europe.



If it ain't Boeing, I'm not going !
User currently offlineNIKV69 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (9 years 11 months 13 hours ago) and read 10248 times:

The only course of action is sending two fighters to intercept it, if the hijackers don't change course then it must be shot out of the sky, in this day and age with Terrorism we don't have many choices. If the pilots get overpowered and there is no air marshal we must let our Army, Navy, Air Force and Marines defend us. With force.

User currently offlineRichierich From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 4233 posts, RR: 6
Reply 23, posted (9 years 11 months 12 hours ago) and read 10195 times:

I agree with Rwylie77. A hijacking attempt in the vain of 9/11 is unlikely, at best. It may have worked pre-9/11 but it sure wouldn't after.

Unfortunately terrorists are more creative than this and there are other means I am sure they will explore first. Is it possible there are al-Qaeda pilots out there, flying for non-US airlines? Absolutely.



None shall pass!!!!
User currently offlineStarlionblue From Greenland, joined Feb 2004, 16977 posts, RR: 67
Reply 24, posted (9 years 11 months 12 hours ago) and read 10147 times:

Let's also not forget that there are other means of terrorizing, though I would argue that airplane terror is more frightening to many people because of the whole claustrophobia/fear of flying thing.


"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots."
25 Lnglive1011yyz : In my opinion, I believe you'd have the same scenario as 9/11. I don't believe the hijackers would hijack the plane too early in the flight, therefore
26 Indio66 : If the plane gets too close to the US it will absolutely be shot down. Depending upon timing, fighter pilots now have the authority to do so.
27 Post contains images Bruno : FJWH My best advice, just don't do it.
28 Robsawatsky : Firstly, I wouldn't use China or Russia as good examples of how airspace should be protected with due consideration for human life. Secondly, if the h
29 Acidradio : In this day and age, the passengers need to get mad, get even and mob the hijackers. Make everyday non-restricted items on the airplane into weapons a
30 Robsawatsky : Firstly, I wouldn't use China or Russia as good examples of how airspace should be protected with due consideration for human life. Secondly, if the h
31 AeroFan : It better had not be a VS plane. What what I hear. The Air Force will ask it to land. If it doesn't well - that will be all she wrote folks!
32 Aviationwiz : Second, with the new cockpit doors or clear procedures to reduce access to the cockpit, and will not open them would probably fly severe maneuvers to
33 Sunnyb : QUOTE Reply: 2:      Sidetask: Think about what (i.e.) India would do if a hijacked plane would be heading towards their territory..... What woul
34 GuyBetsy1 : Americans are just too paranoid these days. Paranoia fuels fear. Fear fuels ignorance. Ignorance fuels arrogance. Arrogance fuels suspicion. Suspicion
35 Aa717driver : This is what would happen: Some F-15 pilot from the Mass. ANG would get to stencil a little 747 silhouette under the canopy of his jet.TC
36 Mikester540 : Right when the plane enters US Airspace, blow it up. Then send president bush on vacation in crawford,TX and leave him there... Mike
37 MCIrunway : "Americans are just too paranoid these days. Paranoia fuels fear. Fear fuels ignorance. Ignorance fuels arrogance. Arrogance fuels suspicion. Suspicio
38 David T : Acidradio: You have hit it on the nail... Yes, the U.S. Government (Homeland Security, etc) will have numerous scenarios worked out... But at the end
39 ORDflyer : "Sad reality, but this is the time when passengers won't need flight attendent safety instructions." I couldn't agree more. I am convinced that a 9/11
40 Logan22L : Acidradio: Enjoyed your post; I agree with the concept - find whatever you can to defend freedom from terrorism. I think you left out "rip their head
41 Nosedive : Most American, or even most pilots in general, are not trained to do 0G maneuvers in a commercial aircraft, I assume you got that idea from what the E
42 IndianFlyboy : Sidetask: Think about what (i.e.) India would do if a hijacked plane would be heading towards their territory..... Pilatusguy , Dont get your point .
43 UA744KSFO : I don't think the terrorists will ever be able to successfully pull off another hijacking again. If they even tried to get more than 5 of them on the
44 Wdleiser : Yes, yell at them, if they don't respond send out fighters and try and make them turn back, then if they don't and get to close they will be shot down
45 DC10Heavy : This may offend some politically correct people however, if we (the U.S. and Europe) properly profile passengers (Terrorist Profiling) like the Masad
46 MattCLE : If I were a passenger on a hijacked plane I would sure hope I could gather up the strength to fight back. Of course it is one thing to say it and then
47 AeroFan : Soaringadi bite your tongue, no I mean it bite it in two!
48 N766UA : If an airplane were over the ocean and we knew it was hijacked, we'd shoot it down in a heartbeat. NORAD is jumpy enough as it is.
49 FSPilot747 : Don't know if I'd have the sack to do it, but if the military was gonna inevitably shoot us down, I'd just make a mad rush at the hijacker(s). Might a
50 707lvr : Don't be so sure. About any of the above. Would passengers on an inbound foreign carrier try and overpower the hijackers? Would there be enough time t
51 Aroundtheworld : We already saw one case where passengers were aware of Sept 11th and they took care of the hijackers in no time at all (unfortunately they ended up i
52 BCAL : Is it my imagination or have some replies on this topic been deleted? There was an interesting long reply that I did not have time to read last night
53 Gary2880 : i agree with robs and 707s points, if the hijacker wants to be a martyr which 99% are now they`ll be happy being shot down by the americans, they died
54 A3204eva : First the Government would try to talk to the pilots or hijackers and they would send up fighter jets, and if negotiations failed the fighters would d
55 FJWH : IF the situation occurs that a plane must be shot down: who will give this order? And what are the consequences for this person? FJWH
56 7LBAC111 : I imagine it is the call of the President if the plane is on its way to the US, and the leader of the country whose airspace the aircraft is in.
57 Acidradio : but i really doubt its as easy as you say it would be. No, it's not as easy as it seems. But if you are mad enough, your life is at stake and you hav
58 Gary2880 : to be honest with that last paragraph of acids i dont see how you can think your better than the terrorists if thats the kind of people you breed
59 Aa777jr : We already saw one case where passengers were aware of Sept 11th and they took care of the hijackers in no time at all (unfortunately they ended up in
60 NIKV69 : I believe another 9/11 hijacking is definitely possible. It would have to be a very detailed, thought out plan but I believe that if Al Qaida wanted t
61 FJWH : Maybe to much fantasy for me BUT Al Qaida has got a lot of money I believe (?) Can't they just buy two planes or more, train people to fly the plane's
62 AeroFan : Gary2880 Don't agree with you. Terrorists want to cause as much mayhem as possible. To deny them this is to cause them to fail
63 C172heavy : Personally, I think anything is possible. Pre-9/11, did many people think that it could happen? I never gave it a thought. Hijacking, sure, but not th
64 Jhooper : Everyone remember that thread we had shortly before 9/11/01 about whether or not the World Trade Center could survive an airliner crash?
65 L-188 : So who is flying the airplane? Chicken Little?
66 Mtyfreak : Plane hijacked and heading to the US of A?????????? Amazing! Sounds like big trouble in little china (again) to me.
67 Aviationwiz : I thought the US Gov figured out that plane was headed for the White House and Dick Cheney ordered it shot down? Is that why wreckage was 4 miles apa
68 Post contains images Lauda777 : Im sure terrorists are getting smarter too, don't you think they would hijack the aircraft only when it's about to land at JFK so no one could do a th
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