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Ryanair Staff Help Website Launched  
User currently offlineThomasCook From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 796 posts, RR: 8
Posted (10 years 2 weeks 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 4019 times:

Hi,

The International Transport Workers Federation (ITF) have launched a new staff website (Click here) for Ryanair staff to voice their opinions of the company and its management without the fear of being sacked.

It has been launched as apparently some FR employees are afraid to speak to their bosses about the company and will now be able to talk confidentially on the site.

What do you think?

Regards
ThomasCook


A380 Crew
40 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offline7LBAC111 From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2004, 2566 posts, RR: 35
Reply 1, posted (10 years 2 weeks 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 3941 times:

Well I am no fan of Ryanair, but if they treat their employees in any way similar to the way they treat the hands that feed them (Travel Agents and Customers) then it is no surprise to me that the staff need this site.

How did you come across it?


Mark



Debate is what you put on de hook when you want to catch de fish.
User currently offlineQIguy24 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (10 years 2 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 3916 times:

Personally I think it's a shame that they have to use a webpage to express their opinion towards FR to be sure that they won't get fired.
But on the other side, Many FR employees say they are getting treated well. So who should we trust? I don't know anyone who works for FR. So I don't know the truth.


User currently offlineThomasCook From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 796 posts, RR: 8
Reply 3, posted (10 years 2 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 3842 times:

Hi,

7LBAC111 - It was linked from Sky News

Regards
ThomasCook



A380 Crew
User currently offlinePe@rson From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 19229 posts, RR: 52
Reply 4, posted (10 years 2 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 3748 times:

Do we have any solid evidence that FR's employees are being mistreated or are not free to state their beliefs? No.

Do we have any solid evidence that employees would be fired if they stated their beliefs? No.

We do not have any evidence whatever to back this up, so our discussing it seems a little pointless.

FR only has 2,900 'direct' employees - the rest, like check-in staff, are outsourced.



"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
User currently offlineSkymonster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (10 years 2 weeks 5 days ago) and read 3704 times:

Pearson,

If you read PPRuNe regularly you'll know that a topic on Ryanair has had to be removed, just because Ryanair are threatening legal action as a result of their employees expressing their opinions.

Andy


User currently offlinePe@rson From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 19229 posts, RR: 52
Reply 6, posted (10 years 2 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 3691 times:

Who exactly stated that on PPRUNE? I bet it wasn't an insider or an employee of the airline. So much shite is spoken of FR that it would not surprise me whatever if it was just another person trying to cause a mess and for the airline to look bad. If proper and genuine evidence was submitted, then that would be a different matter.


"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
User currently offlineThomasCook From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 796 posts, RR: 8
Reply 7, posted (10 years 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 3655 times:

Hi,

Pe@son: You have to be a proven employee of FR to be able to post on the Ryanair forum on that site.

Regards
ThomasCook



A380 Crew
User currently offlinePe@rson From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 19229 posts, RR: 52
Reply 8, posted (10 years 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 3646 times:

I am of the opinion that all employees of all firms should have the right to speak openly about their employment - so long as it does not break any confidentality agreement - providing they have discussed their cases with the appropriate people beforehand. If employees break any confidentality agreement, then I believe it just and fair that they should face legal action, if the consequence is serious and damaging.

ThomasCook - could you provide me with an official website or document that expressly says FR would sue any employee for disclosing their views? Could you define the nature of the employees views? So far no evidence has been submitted whatever for all on this website to see - except for the opinions of people certainly not connected to the employees or the airline.



"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
User currently offlineThomasCook From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 796 posts, RR: 8
Reply 9, posted (10 years 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 3636 times:

Hi,

I doubt I can find such a document, but then again why would I? I don't work for Ryanair. But a site such as PPRUNE isn't going to close it's Ryanair specific forum for no reason and the ITF are not going to set a site up for employees unless there is reason to.

Regards
ThomasCook



A380 Crew
User currently offlinePe@rson From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 19229 posts, RR: 52
Reply 10, posted (10 years 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 3623 times:

You are sounding as though no other airline's or business's employees have a problem at work - but of course they do! I bet a HUGE number of employees are scared of disclosing their thoughts or the way they're being treated in fear of the potential consequences from the firm's managerial staff; after all, no-one wants to lose their job. It's just a shame that FR is on the receiving end, when the same could most probably be applied to a large number of firms.


"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
User currently offlineSkymonster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (10 years 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 3613 times:

Pe@rson,

When are you going to stop looking through rose tinted glasses... Go read the topic at the top of the main forum on PPRuNe - its clearly stated why another topic has had to be closed, and it doesn't take a rocket scientist, or even a university student, to work out what's behind that happening... And whilst you're at it...
http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/story/0,,1293920,00.html

Andy


User currently offlineThomasCook From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 796 posts, RR: 8
Reply 12, posted (10 years 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 3612 times:

Hi,

Pe@rson: Of course other companies have there fair share of employee troubles. You only have to turn on the news and see the mess at BA to realise that and there will be hundred and thousands of people who do not share their views on their company for fear of being sacked but it just turns out that Ryanair has been highlighted for this. My intention was to merely bring this new site and its meaning to peoples attention.

Regards
ThomasCook



A380 Crew
User currently offlineTeahan From Germany, joined Nov 1999, 5294 posts, RR: 61
Reply 13, posted (10 years 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 3610 times:

Pe@rson:

I can confirm what Skymonster is saying re. the PPRUNE topic being removed.

Jeremiah



Goodbye SR-LX MD-11 / 6th of March 1991 to the 31st of October 2004
User currently offlinePe@rson From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 19229 posts, RR: 52
Reply 14, posted (10 years 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 3599 times:

Yes, I've read the article, but as I've said - a number of businesses come under scrutiny from trade unions, including BA, AZ, OA... ! If there are concerns, they should be sorted out, and IF FR is acting unfairly or illegally, then it should face the consequences, be that being sued, prosecuted (if broken a criminal law) or whatever else. Believe me, I am all for achieving an excellent relationship with all stakeholders - including the all-important employees. WN does it brilliantly, so there's no reason FR can't. Let's wait for the full report - which will hopefully state the true story - before getting our knives out.

Oh, and I wear contact lenses, not "rose-tinted glasses."  Wink/being sarcastic

[Edited 2004-09-01 02:03:42]


"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
User currently offlineZweed From Netherlands, joined Apr 2004, 455 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (10 years 2 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 3547 times:

Big actions at the Airports in Sweden today where Ryanair fly from.
The swedish union were handing out air sickness bags with printed statements on them on how bad ryanair are.


User currently offlineBestWestern From Hong Kong, joined Sep 2000, 7152 posts, RR: 57
Reply 16, posted (10 years 2 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 3524 times:

Pearson

Nobody gets in the way of Michael O'Leary. Anyone who does gets his wrath. He gets very personal against those who do. I'm thinking Barbara Cassani, Mary O'Rourke (former Irish Minister of Transport), Aer Rianta, etc. If I worked in Ryanair I would be afraid to express my opinion in public. He is afraid of the Unions because they can as a group stand up to him.


However....

I personally know people who work in FR, and they are quite happy there.

I also think the Ryan Fair website is rubbish.





The world is really getting smaller these days
User currently offline7LBAC111 From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2004, 2566 posts, RR: 35
Reply 17, posted (10 years 2 weeks 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 3515 times:

In todays Travel Trade Gazette, FR have admitted they are trying to prevent agents (such as myself) comparing their prices to mainline and other LCC carriers on competing routes. We have technology which allows us to check FR, U2, BA, AB etc all on one screen. FR hate this. Why?

They also state they will be investigating those people/agents who attempt to make money from selling Ryanair. The airline remains adamant it will not deal with the trade.

It is therefore no surprise they won;t listen to their staff either. MOL and his cronies are effing nuts!

7LBAC111


[Edited 2004-09-01 12:01:46]


Debate is what you put on de hook when you want to catch de fish.
User currently offlineMrniji From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (10 years 2 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 3470 times:

I had a look at the webpage and signed the appeal at once. I think this is a great idea... this entire low-cost modell - exploiting employees in order to be 'efficient', making high profit which is distributed amongst the managers does not suit me..

By the way, if the allegation that FR employees are not allowed to join trade unions and raise their opinions is true - i.e. if this is a condition to get a job - it is a severe breach of Article 9 of the German Constitution - the right to get organized in Trade Unions etc.. and maybe even a breach of Article 5 of teh German Constitution... (in how far European HR Law is impaired, I will find out the next months) can anyone, who has trustful information on this please contact me via email? I will then check the case and eventually put a PIL in front of the SC of Germany (although I might not be able to do it since the German system only allows PIL under special circumstances.. but I would like to examine the case and will maybe put the results on my webpage)

Thanks for the initiator of teh thread.. this is an interesting case


User currently offlineCaravelle From Norway, joined Aug 2000, 666 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (10 years 2 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 3415 times:

Pearson, I went from TRF to PIK by FR a few weeks back, a 738.

It won't happen again.

According to papers here, cabin staff have to work a 62 hour week at wages that amount to next to nothing.

I'd rather pay more, than have to accept the FR policy of profits rather than people.

And my money is where my mouth is.

- caravelle



Trains and boats and planes....
User currently offlinePelican From Germany, joined Apr 2004, 2531 posts, RR: 7
Reply 20, posted (10 years 2 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 3409 times:

As always we have to differentiate.
The right to join a union should be granted to everybody.
On one hand the German Grundgesetz (~ constitution) does that (as already stated by Mrniji), but who cares? It's a common practice in Germany to threaten employees to prevent them from joining a union. On the other hand there a companies like AB who have a reputation to tread there employees well, although they ban unions.
I don't know whether O'Leary is a slavedriver (I wouldn't be surprised) or not but I've read that the average payment of FR is higher than the industrial average. Therefore this website could be nothing more than an attempt of unions to gain influence on FR.
And Mrniji why do unions work together with 'exploiters' like HLX or EZY?

pelican




User currently offlineMrniji From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (10 years 2 weeks 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 3365 times:

On one hand the German Grundgesetz (~ constitution) does that (as already stated by Mrniji), but who cares?

It's a common practice in Germany to threaten employees to prevent them from joining a union

The problem is that people are either afraid on insisting on this Basic Right (=Grundrecht) - i.e. the motion would probably cause a job loss in the end - or 'just don't do it; very often, older laws and proceduredare only declared void after having existed for ages. It is a matter of fact that everyone has the right to join a union. This 'Grundrecht' is probably the only one (maybe Art 5, too) which draws a relation private-private instead of state-private.

but I've read that the average payment of FR is higher than the industrial average

This does not say much.. wage is one indicator of labor standards inter alia (working conditions, hrs et al...)

And Mrniji why do unions work together with 'exploiters' like HLX or EZY?

Sorry, I know too less about the two to give a profound statement. The only thing which interests me to find out whether there is profound evidence about the claims which could justify a motion to the Supreme Court (Bundesverfassungsgericht). It is really an interesting case.

[Edited 2004-09-01 16:41:57]

User currently offlineBabybus From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (10 years 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 3285 times:

In the UK it is not illegal to join a union and in fact there are strict penalties on employers who try to stop or discourage staff from joining a union.

This website for FR employees must have been set up (or encouraged) by a cartel of EZY,BA and other LCC's to try and make trouble for FR. Such websites where staff can air their sorrows should apply to all industrial sectors. Unless we see this model being applied to other companies in the very near future we should presume it is no more than a stitch up. It must cause the UK great embarrassment to have their biggest and most profitable airline owned by foreigners. This could be one way to boot them out.

There are employment laws, there are tax laws, there are health and safety laws. Companies cannot work outside the law. If FR employees feel they are being victimized there are plenty of avenues to make redress within the courts. It looks a bit vulgar for staff to air their dirty washing on the internet.



User currently offlinePe@rson From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 19229 posts, RR: 52
Reply 23, posted (10 years 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 3281 times:

Hear, hear, Baby! About time someone besides me read between the lines and deduced that it need not be completely as it seems.

What I find particularly absurd is how Skymonster seems to only appear when someone is moaning about FR. This, to me, is sufficient evidence that people just want to get their claws into FR - even if it's not warranted.

Time will tell.



"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
User currently offlineSolnabo From Sweden, joined Jan 2008, 852 posts, RR: 2
Reply 24, posted (10 years 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 3275 times:

Here (at Skavsta Airport) the union was giving out sickbags to pax. that was to board RyanAir, it was written on them about the cabincrew´s conditions, for ex. if you´re sick more than 4 (four) days a year you are fired......*u-hum*

It went on about workinghours and payment for RyanAir-staff etc. etc.

Micke//SE




Airbus SAS - Love them both
25 Pe@rson : BA was in a pickle the other week for it could not reach agreement regarding the number of days taken off by its staff. It took a lot of time and disc
26 Skymonster : Pe@rson, Thanks for that... Being involved in the industry on a daily basis, I'm well aware of some of the tricks some airlines get up to - maybe stri
27 Post contains images Mrniji : I am with you, Andy... Sonalbo, could you give me some more details about 'the content of the air-sickness-bags..'..? And people, as I said in reply #
28 7LBAC111 : This website for FR employees must have been set up (or encouraged) by a cartel of EZY,BA and other LCC's I really don't think BA would involve themse
29 Post contains links EIrob : The 'sickbags' referred to were distributed by HTF - a union representing cabin crew amongst others. They describe Ryanairs' relationship to their emp
30 Post contains images QIguy24 : Pe@rson, I have been very nice to FR the last couple of months. Even you have to admit that. But there must be a reason why so many unions around Euro
31 Lj : Hardly little! Based on this alone, I bet its cabin crew staff and its non-flying employees receive a good deal too. @Pearson Thus basically you say t
32 Planespotterx : I think personally we should all stop flying Ryanair (and encourage others to do so too.) Ive just been reading a few of the posts on the website, and
33 BENNETT123 : Without supporting evidence it is hard to know if the complaints are true or not. However, MOL's reaction to anyone else who does not agree with him,
34 Starlionblue : As I said in the other thread, if flight attendants want to quit, nobody is stopping them. EDIT: This is my post in the other thread in it's entirety:
35 GlobeTrekker : Look frankly I am not a big fan of FR, but at the prices they are offering there is no way in hell, you'll get people to stop flying them. People like
36 N1120a : If the F/As are making that little, that is unreasonable. It sounds like flight crew pay is quite decent, and that might be a problem in leverage. The
37 Starlionblue : As I said, what is stopping the F/As from getting another job? Are they slave labor or something?` They wanted the job. They applied for it. They got
38 Babybus : I don't know if anybody knows this but FR staff are : 1) Locked into the cabin at the end of each flt to stop them escaping, 2) Are physically beaten
39 Lj : They wanted the job. They applied for it. They got the job If they are being treated like manure, they can apply for and get another job. It's not roc
40 Donder10 : I had a look at the webpage and signed the appeal at once. I think this is a great idea... this entire low-cost modell - exploiting employees in order
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