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EK Routes Down Under  
User currently offlineAsianguy767 From Singapore, joined Oct 2003, 263 posts, RR: 0
Posted (10 years 1 month 1 week 2 hours ago) and read 2858 times:

I wonder why is it besides SYD & PER the other Aussies & Kiwi cities of BNE, MEL & AKL don't get non-stop flights from DXB but go through SIN or BKK? Won't that be a multiple stop trip for pax coming from Europe? That would make SQ, TG & MH to have one up on EK with pax from Europe going to these other cities jus 1 stop in their respective home bases.

20 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineTBA04 From Australia, joined Oct 2004, 39 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (10 years 1 month 1 week 1 hour ago) and read 2807 times:

I have heard the load on EK to AUS-NZ is about 30%. So i'm guessing this will have to rise before any direct routes are introduced. Then again EK do seem to be introducing new routes at quite a rapid rate recently!

Also many people fly EK because of the product that EK provide, rather than on a lowest fare possible basis... my thoughts anyway.


User currently offlineUA744KSFO From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (10 years 1 month 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 2600 times:

The main reason is because the main business traffic to and from Oz goes to SYD and MEL. That is where the passengers willing to pay higher fares go.

The other routes are primarily leisure routes, and therefore, passengers are willing to deal with a stop in SIN or elsewhere if it means a lower price. That's not to say that no business travellers fly to the other destinations, but the nonstops from DXB to Oz are designed to cater to the needs of high yield business travellers.


User currently offlineTBA04 From Australia, joined Oct 2004, 39 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (10 years 1 month 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 2454 times:

Sorry, I was thinking of the SYD/MEL - AKL sector. A load factor of 30% please correct me if ive been misinformed.

cheers


User currently offlineKL911 From Czech Republic, joined Jul 2003, 5259 posts, RR: 15
Reply 4, posted (10 years 1 month 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 2437 times:

Sorry, I was thinking of the SYD/MEL - AKL sector. A load factor of 30% please correct me if ive been misinformed.

Never forget the cargo load factor, it's not only pax that is important. I've heard EK has got some good cargo contracts.

KL911


User currently offline777ER From New Zealand, joined Dec 2003, 12266 posts, RR: 18
Reply 5, posted (10 years 1 month 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 2423 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

EK are considering launching Direct AKL-DXB and AKL-LAX flights, but won't make any commintment till more aircraft join the fleet. AKL-DXB could be an A345 and AKL-LAX a B772ER

User currently offlineTG992 From New Zealand, joined Jan 2001, 2910 posts, RR: 10
Reply 6, posted (10 years 1 month 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 2383 times:

EK's overall load factors for trans-Tasman flights over the last two months have been 17% and 22%. The regional manager has said that they need a load factor of 40% to be profitable, taking into account cargo uplift, so they're still taking a bath, and apparently underestimated the competitive nous of QF and NZ.

I strongly doubt they'll drop any routes though - it's part of their overall plan, voiced by Maurice Flanagan, to "create supply and the demand will follow". If only my employer and other airlines had such a luxury!



-
User currently offline6thfreedom From Bermuda, joined Sep 2004, 3335 posts, RR: 20
Reply 7, posted (10 years 1 month 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 2355 times:

it surprises me that everyone keeps going on about EK's low load factors on the Tasman.

According to BTRE, http://www.btre.gov.au/avstats/deppage.htm#Intann, the other 5th freedom carriers aren't doing that great either.

for year ending Dec 2003...

Emirates New Zealand
Inbound 368 42,897 129,631 33.1%LF
Outbound 368 42,780 129,631 33.0% LF

Garuda Indonesia New Zealand
134 9,710 38,950 24.9% LF
134 9,317 38,950 23.9% LF

Malaysia Airlines New Zealand
212 13,787 81,755 16.9% LF
213 13,317 82,137 16.2% LF

Royal Brunei Airlines New Zealand
37 1,918 7,326 26.2% LF
37 1,919 7,326 26.2% LF

Thai Airways International New Zealand
519 69,868 191,355 36.5% LF
519 62,689 191,355 32.8% LF





User currently offlineTrolley Dolley From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (10 years 1 month 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 2310 times:

MH non longer flies trans-tasman as all NZ to KL flights are direct.

EK has probably set itself up for scrutiny as it has a bold tasman network and specifically laid down a challenge to the established players with an agrressive marketing campaign to increase competition.

What I wonder about these load factor figures is that are they only for pax flying sectors NZ-Australia/v.v. or do they include pax flying sectors like AKL-DXB or AKL-DPS?


User currently offlineAerokiwi From New Zealand, joined Jul 2000, 2743 posts, RR: 4
Reply 9, posted (10 years 1 month 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 2303 times:

Ummm, those figures are surely wrong. Having worked at Auckland Airport and flown Thai several times, I can assure you that their flights are usually packed. Meanwhile, Malaysia's were usually 70-80% full and Garuda's were brimming too. That's why the airport's terminal is so packed when the 'Asian Rush' of airlines arrives at around midday each day.

So I seriously doubt those LF figures. Perhaps they are for passengers only travelling the Tasman and not onwards to Asia/Europe??


User currently offlineFXMD11 From Thailand, joined Aug 2004, 184 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (10 years 1 month 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 2290 times:

flights from DXB but go through SIN or BKK?

sorry, none of the flights towards OZ are coming through BKK. Only the flights to/from HKG ( as EK382/383) and to/from CGK (as EK 344/345).
However, I understand there will be a flight, starting March 2005, DXB-BKK-SYD. This will actually give some competition back in to market, since OA,AZ
and others ( LH long time ago) left this sector.


User currently offlineKEno From Malaysia, joined Feb 2004, 1842 posts, RR: 27
Reply 11, posted (10 years 1 month 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 2238 times:

Didn't they plan to serve ADL via BKK? Or is it just a rumour?

User currently offlineAAplatnumflier From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (10 years 1 month 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 2201 times:

AKL-LAX?? What is your source for this? And why wouldnt they fly DXB-LAX first? I understand that the governemnt may not allow it but it is over my head.


Thanks in AAdvance!!


User currently offline6thfreedom From Bermuda, joined Sep 2004, 3335 posts, RR: 20
Reply 13, posted (10 years 1 month 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 2196 times:

Yes, that's correct.

EK will probably not launch DXB-LAX until it has the rights to operate AKL-DXB.
EK is a global carrier, and even in it's early days of operating to Australia, it was widely known that the ultimate ambition is to offer counter-rotating global services.

DXB-LAX-AKL-MEL/SYD/BNE-[BKK/SIN]-DXB vv



User currently offlineZK-NBT From New Zealand, joined Oct 2000, 5359 posts, RR: 11
Reply 14, posted (10 years 1 month 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 2072 times:

EK loads out of AKL are generally low! I think though that is partly because of the 2-3 stops to Europe, when they start AKL-DXB non stop I think it will do quite well with quite a few pax mainly going to Europe.

As for the stats on other airlines flying the Tasman of the ones you have mentioned Thai certainly have alot higher load factor than that though I am unsure of how many of those pax are going through to BKK and Europe. Even Royal Brunei I thought had higher loads than that.


User currently offlineBill142 From Australia, joined Aug 2004, 8463 posts, RR: 8
Reply 15, posted (10 years 1 month 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 2067 times:

Didn't EK start DXB-MEL non-stop back in June? or were meant to but couldn't due to an A345 being delivered late.

User currently offlineZK-NBT From New Zealand, joined Oct 2000, 5359 posts, RR: 11
Reply 16, posted (10 years 1 month 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 2039 times:

Didn't EK start DXB-MEL non-stop back in June? or were meant to but couldn't due to an A345 being delivered late.

Service started in August I think, with 3x weekly flights now 6 weekly and daily from December 04.


User currently offlineZKSUJ From New Zealand, joined May 2004, 7110 posts, RR: 12
Reply 17, posted (10 years 1 month 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 2026 times:

The reason why AKL does not get daily flights to DXB is basically because they have 3x daily flights here. There would never be a market for that much direct flights

User currently offline777ER From New Zealand, joined Dec 2003, 12266 posts, RR: 18
Reply 18, posted (10 years 1 month 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 2017 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

AAplatnumflier

My source is from the CEO of EK in an interview with the New Zealand Herald. EKs CEO also says that his airline is seriously considering making AKL its 'down under' Hub, with even more EK flights from AKL to other places. Looks like AKL has a good future with EK


User currently offlineZK-NBT From New Zealand, joined Oct 2000, 5359 posts, RR: 11
Reply 19, posted (10 years 1 month 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 2017 times:

The reason why AKL does not get daily flights to DXB is basically because they have 3x daily flights here. There would never be a market for that much direct flights

Well considering they already have 3x daily flights to DXB, albeit 1 or 2 stops.

As for there not being a market, the only way they are going to get more European traffic is by flying AKL-DXB non stop which they will!

EK also plan to fly to NAN, EZE, NYC, SFO ex AKL, or should I say they would like to fly to these places ex AKL. While they want to be A RTW carrier I do question the point as to weather they should be allowed to fly to all those cities ex AKL. Mind you they may as well try and use NZ, with Goverment we have they won't say no.


User currently offlineUA744KSFO From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (10 years 1 month 6 days ago) and read 1777 times:

I know that EK has previously stated that it does not want to join an alliance, but with the presence that they have in Oceania, and with their desire to build up more in this region, I could see Skyteam trying to do whatever is necessary to try and woo them since Skyteam has a huge gap to fill in this area, and could also use another Asian airline in addition to KE.

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