Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
AA 3Q #'s, Mrtc Gone, Canceling ERJ Order  
User currently offlinePSU.DTW.SCE From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 7542 posts, RR: 28
Posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 12264 times:

3Q results

-MRTC will be a thing of the past. Adding more F on 738's and MD-80's
-More Asia service as announced yesterday
-More DFW ops as previously announced
-Cancelling the remaining 18 ERJ-145 deliveries after July 05
-Removing 15 narrow-body aircraft (not bringing back as many TW MD-80's as previoulsy announced)

Read & Discuss
http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/041020/daw026_1.html

81 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineThe777Man From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 6503 posts, RR: 55
Reply 1, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 12152 times:

Thanks for the info!

How many AA (ex-TW) M80s are currently in storage and if possible, which ones (registration) ?

The777Man




Need a Boeing 777 Firing Order....Further to fly....CI, MU, LX and LH 777s
User currently offlineNYCAAer From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 692 posts, RR: 3
Reply 2, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 12082 times:

28 ex-TWA MD-80s are in storage, but I don't know the reg. nos. There are rumors going around that the 14 762s in Roswell may be brought back to service.

User currently offlineASTROJET707 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 299 posts, RR: 5
Reply 3, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 12046 times:

Looks like MRTC is gone on international flights. A thread about 7-10 days ago stated DL would be increasing seat pitch. Does anyone have info about the DL MRTC?I am shocked AA is adding seats back on international flights.


Regards,

AJ707


User currently onlineSESGDL From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 3466 posts, RR: 10
Reply 4, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 11979 times:

A third quarter loss of $214 million is terrible. So much for all those "AA's is such good shape" people, what a load of crap that was. The third quarter should be the strongest quarter for airlines, just goes to show that the majors are in more trouble than we thought. CO's in MUCH better shape than AA is, something that many would've disagreed with 6 months ago. It's also sad to see MRTC going, but they needed to increase revenue, and this will do it. Very interesting results.

Jeremy


User currently offlineNYCAAer From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 692 posts, RR: 3
Reply 5, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 11934 times:

You and me both, Astrojet! I thought they'd at least keep MRTC on the 763s and 772s. That means 14 seats will be added to the 767-300 and 18 to the 777-200. I know they're decreasing the number of seats in Business Class on the 767-300 once the new lie-flat seats are introduced, from 30 to 22, and one flight attendant will be removed from B/C, staffed with 3 F/As as opposed to the current 4. When this is implemented, I haven't heard.

User currently offlineDtremit From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 28 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 11924 times:

I believe the DL pitch change is just setting a minimum of 32", with a few planes at 33".

User currently offlinePSU.DTW.SCE From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 7542 posts, RR: 28
Reply 7, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 11889 times:

Considering how bad AA got slammed by fuel costs, up over $300 million from the same quarter a years, and the fact that yields have decreased is the reason why. That alone makes the difference right there.

Unfortunetely, they got blind-sided by the whole fuel issue. The fact that most costs have decreased from a year ago is positive, it just seems like none of the airline can catch a break here. Just when they think they are making progress, there's always some other crisis.


User currently offlineErikwilliam From Brazil, joined Mar 2004, 2152 posts, RR: 12
Reply 8, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 11860 times:

And about the F-100´s, any word on replacement?
U think AA could use E-190´s in the fleet?



Dida, Cafu, Lucio, Roque Junior, Roberto Carlo, Emerson, Ze Roberto, Ronaldinho, Kaka, Adriano, Robinho, Ronaldo
User currently offlineJaysit From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 11862 times:

A pity about the loss of the MRTC product.

Well, I will cash in my miles earned on AA and go back to flying carriers that offer superior and more convenient service from my home airports (JetBlue, IAir, and even UA for long haul travel). In the past year, I made nearly 30 business related trips almost exclusively on AA and only because of their MRTC product. At an average of $ 750 per R/T ticket, that was a lot of revenue for the airline.


User currently offlineCtbarnes From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 3491 posts, RR: 50
Reply 10, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 11728 times:

One question: What seat pitch does AA plan to use in their LRTC configuration? If it's at least 32 inches in my book that's acceptable.

It's a pity the industry insists on self-emasculation when the sensible thing would be an across the board $10 increase on fares. But then I could be named the next pope.  Laugh out loud

Charles, SJ



The customer isn't a moron, she is your wife -David Ogilvy
User currently offlineOrd From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 1381 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 11702 times:

"MRTC will be a thing of the past. Adding more F on 738's and MD-80's"


The press release says first class will be expanded by two seats on the MD-80s. It says nothing about the 737s.

Also, the release says "American will add back a portion of the coach seats previously removed..." What does a "portion" mean? It further says only one of the two removed rows will be added to 737s and MD-80s. Does that mean 767s and 777s will get all removed seats added back?


User currently onlineSESGDL From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 3466 posts, RR: 10
Reply 12, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 11688 times:

Ord,

Yes, 767s and 777s will have all of their seats put back.

Jeremy


User currently offlineLY4XELD From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 857 posts, RR: 15
Reply 13, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 11635 times:

And about the F-100´s, any word on replacement?
U think AA could use E-190´s in the fleet?


AA's looking for fleet consolidation, not expansion.



That's why we're here.
User currently offlineNYCAAer From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 692 posts, RR: 3
Reply 14, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 11629 times:

I usually work Coach on the 767-300, so with 2 more rows of seats, we'll have 196 or 197 seats, depending on the configuration. Yikes! Maybe I'll have to venture into working Business Class. Time to get out my serving jacket with the strange herringbone pattern.

[Edited 2004-10-20 18:36:07]

User currently offlineJAXpax From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 11547 times:

This makes my knees feel better about my change to US Airways.... they no longer feel deprived.

User currently offlineOerk From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2003, 162 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 11435 times:

The end of MRTC. Well thats a shame.
Now I am going to have to look for alternatives.

I know United has a premium economy service. I have several thousand miles already on a BMI diamond club card (star alliance). Hopefully a couple of LHR-LAX returns will supply enough miles to earn default entry into premium economy on UA for trips to the USA.

These LAX flights would definitely have been with AA on flights AA135 and 137, but I have to show AA where to stick it if they want to give me standard seat pitch for my loyalty.

A sad day indeed.  Sad


User currently offlineAdh214 From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 358 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 11212 times:

The interesting thing about these numbers is how close they are to profitability. With revenue of $14.1 billion they only lost $211 million or 1.5%.

Another interesting point, there revenue per available seat mile was 8.62, while there cost per available seat mile was 9.68 for the quarter. Since they only fill 77.9% of the seats, they need to raise their prices by 1.36 per mile (9.68-8.62)/.779 =1.36 or

$21.25 for DFW - BOS each way
$64.91 for DFW - LGW each way
$33.67 for JFK - LAX each way

I know there has been a number of attempts to raise prices but one carrier typically refuses to go along. It seems that price increase I have detailed are really very modest.

Andrew


User currently offlineConcordeBoy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 11159 times:

The end of MRTC. Well thats a shame

...not to mention widely [not to mention, quite easily] predicted.


User currently offlineJAXpax From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 11160 times:

These LAX flights would definitely have been with AA on flights AA135 and 137, but I have to show AA where to stick it if they want to give me standard seat pitch for my loyalty.

I guess you don't like very many airlines.... standard seat pitch is called standard for a reason.

Obviously your loyalty isn't enough that you are in a position like their most loyal customers where you are either in an exit row/bulkhead or in a premium cabin anyway and legroom isn't a concern.


User currently offlineASTROJET707 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 299 posts, RR: 5
Reply 20, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 11115 times:

International Fleet

DL seat pitch will be 32"-33"
US is 33"
AA will change from 33"-35" to ?
UA is 32", exclusive of E+

Looks like I'll be sending a letter to UA requesting them to change my status to PE....or DL to Gold Medallion.

What have your experiences been in terms of comfort on US B762ER and A330? Will US keep European flights if they drastically downsize their domestic network?


Regards,


AJ707


User currently offlineDsuairptman From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 892 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 11110 times:

The only thing that doesn't make sense here is canceling the 145 orders.



GEAUX SAINTS!
User currently offlineOrd From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 1381 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 11076 times:

"$21.25 for DFW - BOS each way
$64.91 for DFW - LGW each way
$33.67 for JFK - LAX each way

I know there has been a number of attempts to raise prices but one carrier typically refuses to go along. It seems that price increase I have detailed are really very modest."


The price increases outlined above are very high. I was just at an aviation conference where Northwest presented a study on the impact of a simple $10 price increase. It was determined this would lose money because all it takes is about 2% of people to decide not to fly as a result of the increase and it works out that the increase was not worth it (does not make up for those who declined to fly). It's more complex than that but hopefully you get the point.


User currently offlineAdh214 From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 358 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 11010 times:

ORD,

Thanks for your comments. I was not aware of the study you referred to and I did not realize what a difference even $10 can make. Very interesting.

It is unfortunate that the "Wal Mart" mentality has been so ingrained in us that we change our travel plans over $10. What a pity?

Hypothetical Customer: "Please take me from Dallas to London, feed me two meals, let me watch 3 movies and have 12 channels of TV and give me enough room to move my feed."

Reservations Agent: "That will be $64 more than last time"

Hypothetical Customer: "That is riduculous, I am going to stay home."

Good lord people, life is not free.

Andrew


User currently offlineJacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 60
Reply 24, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 10892 times:

thats scary...to change airlines for a measly $10-$20, but its pefectly justifiable to spend $5 for a shot of liquor at a bar which one can get for 0.30 cents..!  Yeah sure




"Up the Irons!"
25 Ctbarnes : Hypothetical Customer: "Please take me from Dallas to London, feed me two meals, let me watch 3 movies and have 12 channels of TV and give me enough r
26 Aa717driver : Absent high fuel costs, there would have been a sufficient profit to trigger profit sharing. The airplanes still in the desert will remain there on sh
27 Post contains images Jacobin777 : Not good, as I'm a gold member, I would rather pay $10-$15 more for a flight (per segment) than have the MRTC removed.......i travel a lot, and I even
28 Ken777 : MRTC: If they only add seats that are aft of the mid plane exit window (putting back a portion) they may be looking at Economy Plus as a way to keep e
29 AA-SAN : any time frame on when they will start replacing the seats?
30 Planemaker : Absent high fuel costs, there would have been a sufficient profit to trigger profit sharing. Absent high fuel cost, I can't help but think that instea
31 Ckfred : Adh214: I agree with you about the Wal-Mart mentality. If you look at the hotel industry, we have Red Roof and Motel 6 at the low end of the spectrum,
32 Ctbarnes : So why do people expect MRTC and IFE for a Southwest price? Because they've gotten it in the past. The majors have been digging their own graves for y
33 Trident2e : Introducing MRTC was a crazy thing to do in the first place, removing it now just reinforces that AA management has lost the plot. There are many peop
34 Aa717driver : Planemaker--Excellent reply to my post! My point was that there would have been a profit absent the extra cost of gas--if only on paper. Ckfred--Re: t
35 AA777 : ACK! This sucks! I am flying 12 hours down to EZE in January. If there is any love left for me in the aviation community, They wont implement this unt
36 Boeing767mech : First of all of the 767's in Roswell 7 of them are being cut up. And the 15 narrowbodies are most likely going to be ExTWA 757's since they where goin
37 Jmsintexas : Maybe someone can help me with this, but I am having a hard time understanding how this helps American. Are they going to actually reduce frequency on
38 Moman : It seemed like AA's plan to get back to profitability last year was mainily labor cost cuts and cutting TWA out of the route structure. Now this has p
39 Aa767400 : Well it is about time they bring LRTC back, since it was not a good move in the first place to take seats out. Less seats, equals less money folks! It
40 AAplatnumflier : Assuming that everything goes welll I think those seats will get taken off again in a few years. I think that they should only change it back on the 7
41 Atrude777 : moman- last I heard STL was AA's more money maker for AA, I dont knwo what they meant by that!!! Alex
42 Post contains images Kanebear : STL????? MIA maybe, if STL were a money maker it wouldnt've been gutted the way it was. MRTC? Coach? Y class? What's that?????? More like why class as
43 JMSintexas : Less seats, equals less money folks! It is very logical, to see how it works. Actually, it's not that easy or logical. Adding capacity means you can s
44 Byrdluvs747 : If AA's load factor right now is less than 100%, then all they are doing is adding empty seats. Only if the frequencies remain the same.
45 JMSintexas : If AA's load factor right now is less than 100%, then all they are doing is adding empty seats. Only if the frequencies remain the same. This is a ver
46 Post contains images TOLtommy : The end of MRTC. Well thats a shame. No, it's not really the end. It's just that the meaning has changed.... MRTC now means More ROWS Throughout Coach
47 RogerThat : This sucks green donkey d.cks. AA's management and some AA employees on here have really got their heads up their asses. Less seat pitch puts AA at a
48 Ckfred : First of all, I haven't encountered any AA staff with an attitude. On the other hand, I flew UA in 1996 when the F/As were negotiating a contract. Sin
49 Jacobin777 : I'll see how it is..since i'm not too tall anyway.........5'10, I hope it won't pose a problem........ but the MRTC IS one of the reasons as to why I'
50 Ckfred : Jacobin77: Increasing fares because of the price of oil is a no-brainer. But the LCCs won't do it. I saw in the WSJ that AirTran, America West, and AT
51 Post contains images Scbriml : Damn! I hope they don't get started on this too soon. I'm flying AA to Florida for Christmas, and at 6'4", I need all the MRTC I can get
52 Jaysit : "So why do people expect MRTC and IFE for a Southwest price?" We don't. When you fly AA (or any other airline) on short notice - as most biz traveller
53 FlewGSW : Guess were most of the extra seats to place into the planes are coming from. Yep, from parked planes. Watch for news on a reduction in flights in the
54 Ckfred : Jaysit: I'll be the first to agree that legacy carriers charge too much for walk-up fares. But I know people who have flown WN, F9 and other LCCs that
55 LambertMan : Atrude, You are misundesrtood, it is best in operations for American, not financially. It does make money however..
56 Jacobin777 : Ckfred...great response to my post...its simple economics, and I agree with you (or father-in-law, since your quoting him) said.... I've stated in oth
57 Post contains images Ctbarnes : Ckfred, To tell you the truth I'm of two minds on the seat-as-commodity argument. On the one hand people will chase down the most rediculously low far
58 ScottB : Ckfred says, "The only reason I can think for the likes of B6, WN, and the like not to raise fares (WN still buys 20% of its fuel needs at market pric
59 Aa767400 : JMSintexas, If you look at TW, they did the same thing in the early 90s, and of course it did not work. Granted another time, it still did not work. W
60 Triscl : Has anyone done the math? Does parking 15 planes while eliminating MRTC mean (roughly) not much of a capacity reduction? If not, then you have the sam
61 Aa767400 : UA's E+, came first. Then came MRTC.
62 JGPH1A : Bang goes the last reason to fly AA at all. Nowadays, with US carriers cutting service to the bone and frankly without any real product appeal to star
63 Aa717driver : I'm not a genius(as regular A.netters know!). But this was explained to me by someone who really knows the revenue picture at airlines. MRTC won't wor
64 Moman : I don't understand how the airlines practice yield mgmt, but I would think that selling a seat at $20 is preferable to selling no seat at all. Isn't t
65 Jmsintexas : From Aa767400 JMSintexas, If you look at TW, they did the same thing in the early 90s, and of course it did not work. Granted another time, it still d
66 PSU.DTW.SCE : About MRTC, many of the people who really enjoyed it the most, end up getting upgraded or take the exit rows. I'm refering to the road warriors. Joe T
67 Aa777flyer : Ok. A friend of mine was on a confrence call today with the CFO of AA. The elimination of MRTC, should really be defined as a reduction. When AA imple
68 AAplatnumflier : So thats not that bad of new after all. I dont feel that bad. It is only ONE row. Sow they MRTC will still be there Wouldnt it? Thanks in AAdvance!!
69 RogerThat : Well thank god its not going to be the sardine can it used to be. For those of you who think its sooo easy to upgrade, think again. I just booked a fu
70 AAgent : Well thank god its not going to be the sardine can it used to be. For those of you who think its sooo easy to upgrade, think again. I just booked a fu
71 TOLtommy : Aagent - Will these seats be available at online check in? I appreciate you trying to help us out, but why should your most profitable customer be the
72 Ord : "The elimination of MRTC, should really be defined as a reduction. When AA implemented MRTC they took out TWO rows of seats. AA is only adding back ON
73 DAYGS : RogerThat: You are incredibly rude and vulgar. Let's show some professionalism here. If you don't like AA, there are other airlines to fly. Respectful
74 FlewGSW : More information sent to employees Friday. On newswires now. As part of its new round of cost-cutting efforts announced earlier this week, American Ai
75 Post contains images Kanebear : RogerThat, do you hold elite status with AA? If not, you won't see at least half the available seats as they're blocked off for elites. Get there earl
76 RogerThat : AAgent, Thanks for the info. Your post made me stop whineing for a moment...I called the AAdvantage line and your very efficent co-worker assinged an
77 DAYGS : RogerTHAT: Saying something "SUCKS GREEN DONKEY DICKS" and "AA SUCKS LIST" is the most un-professional thing I have EVER heard on this site. Clean up
78 Astrojet707 : Am I correct in assuming AA will move all of it's inbound/outbound international flights to Terminal D in 2005 and all domestic will remain at A, B, C
79 Kanebear : AJ707... the primary reason to stick with AA is upgrading to their J cabin. AA is the most liberal in this regard and while their J product ain't the
80 AAplatnumflier : I dont understand why all of you guys are being negative. Have you tried or seen what the new seat pitches are going to be like? They are also suppose
81 Astrojet707 : Thanks KaneBear! I am platinum on AA. I requested AA change my status from general to Platinum based on my Platinum(2003) and Gold status(2004) on CO.
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Midwest And The ERJ Order posted Mon Dec 12 2005 16:27:45 by BAW2198
Question: Seat Pitch For SWA And AA(non-mrtc)? posted Mon Oct 25 2004 22:56:14 by JeffB
AA LGA-BOS/DCA All ERJ! posted Fri Oct 8 2004 23:10:03 by ORBITJFK
AA First Class Gone? posted Sun Jul 11 2004 20:43:41 by JJMNGR
AA International Mrtc posted Wed May 5 2004 17:45:42 by GSPSPOT
AA'a "mrtc" Makes $$$ For AA! posted Sat Jul 20 2002 06:36:55 by Jzucker
Is AA Reconsidering Mrtc? posted Sun May 12 2002 11:02:34 by Marco
The Cot F Canceling An Order? posted Mon Mar 18 2002 20:08:39 by SAA-SAL
Skyway Airlines Moves ERJ Order To July04 posted Wed Mar 13 2002 00:40:11 by CO777-200ER
AA To Cancel DAL-AUS In Order To Start DAL-ORD/LAX posted Wed Apr 19 2000 20:10:17 by ORD