Ktachiya From Japan, joined Sep 2004, 1765 posts, RR: 2 Posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 7162 times:
When thinking about this, is NW the only airline to fly classic jumbos across the Pacific? And is NW the only airline to fly DC-10's across the Pacific? I just thought about if for a second an all I know is the NRT-LAX run and the NRT-HNL run (well this route is also flew by JO and JL on classics) Since the YVR route got replaced by the -400, I can't really think of any other airline that flies Trans-pacific flights on a classic jumbo. Is their any schedule change to a -400? Even if there is, I don't think an A332 would do right? Because there is higher demand in this competitive route. So if the route is competitive and many airlines introduce new high-tech jumbos, is there any specific tactic for NW surviving on this route?
PSU.DTW.SCE From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 7186 posts, RR: 29 Reply 3, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 6964 times:
This topic comes up over and over again. There will still be a few 742's and DC-10's on Trans-Pac routes. LAX-NRT will still be a 742 since there are not enough 744's to cover all the routes. While NW may not have all the bells and whistles of some of the Asian carriers, they serve their niche, an constantly fill their aircraft. Please don't bring up aircraft age, since that is completely irrelevant to the discussion.
Ktachiya From Japan, joined Sep 2004, 1765 posts, RR: 2 Reply 4, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 6910 times:
Is there a reason to assigning the classic to the LAX route? (high density, etc?) I mean I don't understand why the 744 is used on the MNL route but not the LAX route???? Or is it just me who thinks this is odd?
Also I heard that NW acquired two new 744 recently (at least in the last 2 years) Pretty soon, we might see the retirement of the Classic Jumbo fleet? Some have already flown nearly 30 years. Or converted to Cargo.
PSU.DTW.SCE From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 7186 posts, RR: 29 Reply 5, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 6860 times:
Yes, NW acquired 2 new 744's in 2002. The 742's will be gone from passenger service when there are enough suitable aircraft to replace them. As for right now, this isn't possible. The 742's also do some charter work. NW's remaining pax 742's (there were 7 in service, now will probably drop to 6 when SEA-NRT becomes an A330 in a few days) are all relatively new, for the classics. They are from the 80's for the most part. The oldest classics have been put in cargo service, retired, or put in storage in the desert.
The 742's and DC-10's give NW the ability to match capacity with demand. Should they be awarded new slots to Asia or whatnot, NW can redeploy the classics if needed or have the parked in the desert. Others don't necessarily have this flexibility.
NRT-LAX was a 744, but there are not enough 744's to go around right now, primarily due to the conversion of World Business Class and repainting. It all has to do with aircraft routing and the time of day. Flights to places like MNL, originate in the US, stop in NRT, then continue onward beyond NRT. There are any 744's available at the time of the day to go to LAX. My only question is why is the one NRT-HNL a 744 and not swaping that with the LAX flight.
Redtailmsp From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 206 posts, RR: 2 Reply 7, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 6694 times:
LAX-NRT will be the only -200 transpac as of Nov 1st when SEA-NRT becomes an A330. When flt 8 arrives back in SEA on Nov 2nd, the aircraft is scheduled to go straight to Marana for parking (acft 6631 - which is slated to be converted to a freighter in the not-too-distant future along with 6632.) They need two aircraft for any transpacific rotations and they are planning on keeping one acft in SEA as a spare for the short term. There will be a total of six remaining for now. They would love to get the -200 off LAX-NRT, but they don't have enough -400 capacity to do that this winter due DTW-NRT remaining twice daily. Incidentally, the aircraft that went tech on arrival into LAX on the 27th - 6638 - will be ferried to ORD for an engine change on Oct 30th. Don't know what the plans are for this acft after the engine change.
They are looking at more -400s - they have looked at parked United ones sitting at Victorville, which include two acft that were originally built for NWA but never delivered. I am sure Boeing would offer them very attractive deals on new builds too. They certainly need them for LAX-NRT plus any return to nonstops to China out of DTW.
PSU.DTW.SCE From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 7186 posts, RR: 29 Reply 11, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 4943 times:
Hey, United Airlines, please read what I posted above in post #3
Those the only 742 routes left.
NRT-HKG is a 744
The 742 has not been in scheduled servive to Europe in a few years. It has occasionally shown up as operational spare, example last spring it subbed in on one of the DTW-AMS routes. Europe is all A330/DC-10 only.
Ktachiya From Japan, joined Sep 2004, 1765 posts, RR: 2 Reply 13, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 4293 times:
If I did not point it out clearly, I apologize. They fly the JO 742's to HNL. So you can see many classics on that route.
NRT-YVR is now a 744 so JL has the complete network of the Americas flown by 744's. It just changed on Oct 1. I don't think they will downgrade the service ever to a classic jumbo. Which is sad for spotters and for me but for me (who has flown that route 9times on a classic, I just hate it!!!!) As long as the classics are away from the planes that I fly, its all good.
Jetjack74 From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 7366 posts, RR: 51 Reply 15, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 4140 times:
Heard that NW had plans to fly Hong Kong- Detroit nonstop a few years back. What happened to that plan? Will this become a reality one day?
We were planning on serving DTW-HKG and DTW-ICN back before 9/11, but due to economic effects from that, the plans were shelved. I doubt we will serve HKG n/s now that we're in the SkyTeam. Non-stops to ICN are growing increasingly likely, with the slots in NRT drying up. The new airport in Nagoya is also being looked at for additional service fro alternate markets once in opens in Febuary
Ktachiya From Japan, joined Sep 2004, 1765 posts, RR: 2 Reply 16, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 3932 times:
I just have a feeling that many of JL's classics are going to NRT. If NW inagurates the NRT routes to 744, they should still have a lot of KIX routes left on the classics. The longest route that I ever took on a KIX flight classic was a few years back MSP-KIX on NW. The cabin smelled horrible I wanted to jump off the plane!!!
Carpethead From Japan, joined Aug 2004, 2879 posts, RR: 4 Reply 17, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 3893 times:
DTW-ICN can be done by the highest gross-weight 742s but I doubt that's the way NW wants to take.
For the xx-th number of times, NW will need more long-haul aircraft that it currently has for expansion out of DTW to Asia.
Supa7E7 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 18, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 3816 times:
In reply to above, Yes NWA did recently use the DC-10 on Trans-Pacific flights SFO-NRT and PDX-NRT, as recently as 1 or 2 months ago. They will certainly go down as the last regularly scheduled Trans-Pacific DC-10 routings, so yes, it and the 742 are both symbols of NWA's trademark use of insanely old designs, as if to prove to the world how useful old planes can be in the year 2004.
Jafa From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 782 posts, RR: 4 Reply 19, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 3724 times:
In reply to above: NWA has always been financially responsible and conservative, as a business major I have come to admire and appreciate their strategy. They aren't trying to prove anything to anyone. Just doing what is best for the bottom line. DC10's and 747-200's are not "insanely old".
Ktachiya From Japan, joined Sep 2004, 1765 posts, RR: 2 Reply 20, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 3620 times:
Jafa, how do you read it? I was just curious because NWA has many A330-200's on order on some of their routes like NRT-SEA was replaced by that aircraft from the 742. That was quite a downsizing. Is this for "profit maximization?"
Jafa From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 782 posts, RR: 4 Reply 23, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 6 days ago) and read 3508 times:
I think the fact that PDX has been started has something to do with it. These cities are relatively close together and can pull traffic from the surrounding NW area. Both Horizon and Alaska feed traffic at PDX and SEA.
NW never originally planned to use A330 on tranpac routes. However with current economics, economic savings of the new aircraft , opening of PDX, and conversion of the origianl A330-300 order it makes sense at this time.
Cragley From Australia, joined Jul 2004, 426 posts, RR: 0 Reply 24, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 3405 times:
I think its a disgrace that NW are still flying classics on competitive routes.
Take a look at UA to SYD versus the QF product. Who wants to spend 15 hours of their life in a squashed tin can with peeling interiors, exteriors and seats?
The more competition on any pacific route the better. I think US carriers lack glamour, comfort, entertainment in their product. Airlines are no longer about flying from A to B. It's about getting their in style, being entertained, feeling welcome and of course getting there in time. NW knows how to operate a US airline, but unfortunately their international product is a little grim.
NW 747 classic = fat lady in a 70's frock. Sure she's friendly, but would you want to spend time with her? Say a 12 hour flight
SQ, JL, NH are all fantastic products with their management on the pulse of the industry.
Do you want to drive a ferrari or a pinto?
25 Ktachiya: Jafa, Wait!!! Somethings wrong. Didn't NW order the 332 with the intention of using them on Trans-Pacific flights? If not, they could have kept on ord
26 Jetjack74: Didn't NW order the 332 with the intention of using them on Trans-Pacific flights? If not, they could have kept on ordering the 333 instead The origin
27 Ktachiya: What is the attractiveness of NW then? For instance in Japan, NW is regarded as a cheap way of getting to destinations. I know that some pax rather ta
28 United Airline: Cragley, As an aviation enthusiast, I hope the classics stay as long as they can. The old interior reminds me of my younger days of travelling. UA's B
29 Cessna172RG: Northwest...well, I do have lots of stories that I can say about them, but... As for flying out of Narita and to the states or Canada, I find that fly
30 Ktachiya: United Airline, when is UA ever going to get out of chpt 11? I have yet to see the new color schemes that they have. Cessna 172RG, that's incredible!!
31 Avek00: 1. All of the 742s received new interiors over the past few years, and are in as good a condition as the 744 fleet in this regard. 2. Asian carriers a
32 Carfield: Well I don't mind flying NW's Boeing 747-200s across the ocean, but if NW will keep them for a while and there are only six of them in the fleet, will
33 N1120a: >Wonder if HKG will ever recieve a B 742 again. HKG was always being served by a mixture of 200 and 400.An A332 can probably make 75-80% of the revenu
34 United Airline: SQ and CX's First and Business Class are far superior than UA's and NW's. When will UA get out of Chapter 11? Maybe early next year?
35 Avek00: "SQ and CX's First and Business Class are far superior than UA's and NW's. " There's no question that SQ and CX's FIRST class cabins are better than t
36 Azjubilee: LAX is stuck with a 742 because there just aren't enough planes. The only routes with a 742 right now are NRT-LAX/SPN/GUM. THe beach markets are the h
37 United Airline: NW's food is better SQ and CX's???? You serious? Umm...... what do you get on NW's WBC? Haven't been on it so I can't tell.
38 N1120a: >LAX is stuck with a 742 because there just aren't enough planes. The only routes with a 742 right now are NRT-LAX/SPN/GUM. THe beach markets are the
39 Nwaclc: Why is it NW keeps a 747-200 on LAX-NRT and has a 747-400 on HNL-NRT?? It seems like the 744 would offer a more uniform product (wbc) from the west co
40 Azjubilee: It only takes 1 744 to do NRT-HNL and would take 2 to do the LAX flights. They can use the HNL 744 as an "operational" spare in case things go wrong t
41 Nwafflyer: Hey, NWA first class on the 330 is truely world class -- no question at all there -- right up there with Singapore, Japan -- and, don't forget, Northw
42 Ktachiya: So actually does this LAX run manage to get filled? Well if not, I think NW would take another aircraft from the desert and start flying it. I mean th
43 N1120a: Great explanation AZJ. >Hey, NWA first class on the 330 is truely world class -- no question at all there -- right up there with Singapore, Japan -- a