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First NZ 777 Route  
User currently offlineJoFMO From Germany, joined Jul 2004, 2211 posts, RR: 0
Posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 6334 times:

Does anybody know which will we be the fist 777 route for NZ?

I think they bring one 747 out of service next year, so I guess it will be replaced by a 777. Beside that I think NRT, HKG and SIN are High on their list.

Can anybody give me more detailed informations when their 777 will be delivered exactly? I think they star next summer.

49 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineLufthansa From Christmas Island, joined May 1999, 3197 posts, RR: 10
Reply 1, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 6301 times:

NZ are going to start a new service, AKL-DEN-CPH. The service will have UA, LH and SK codeshares.

The second service will be AKL-Munich-ARN via Hong kong and Brisbane.
It will have SIA, SK and LH code shares attached to it.
 Nuts


User currently offlineNZ767 From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 1620 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 6252 times:

A wild guess would be something short like Auckland-Sydney just to settle them (and their crews) into service.  Smile

User currently offlineJoFMO From Germany, joined Jul 2004, 2211 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 6233 times:

@NZ767:

For sure it will first be deployed on some short haul routes due for crew training and waiting for the second plane.
So I mean the first "real" route, based on business requirements and not crew training ones.

P.s.: I forgot an daily SFO in my guess list. Maybe that is even the most likely one.



User currently offlineRoseFlyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 9381 posts, RR: 52
Reply 4, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 6211 times:

I would guess SFO or one of their Japan flights that is not a 747. The AKL and CHC-Japan flights at about 5000miles stretch the legs of the 767 pretty far and I assume the 767s are weight restricted at times, but I may be wrong.


If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
User currently offlineNW7E7 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 532 posts, RR: 5
Reply 5, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 6184 times:

It will probably come down to SFO or NRT.

User currently offlineGardermoen From Australia, joined Jul 1999, 1520 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 6175 times:

Im guessing SIN and HKG will get them early on. The current 767s are an outdated product against the competition on these routes.


User currently offlineN1120a From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26196 posts, RR: 76
Reply 7, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 6146 times:

>Im guessing SIN and HKG will get them early on. The current 767s are an outdated product against the competition on these routes.<

What is wrong with a 763? They are perfectly modern and extremely efficient, especially if NZ does not carry a lot of cargo on the routes. If that is the case, they are probably the ideal plane. It would be the interior that would make a difference

As far as that AKL-DEN-CPH, wow, what a cool route. And with those codeshares, they will probably fill each leg. I am betting they use the entire 16,000 foot brand new runway at DEN to get out on hot days as DEN hits around 30-32 C in the summer and is over a mile high. After all, they built that runway specifically for very long haul 772ERs as DEN cannot really support a 744 to most cities.

>The AKL and CHC-Japan flights at about 5000miles stretch the legs of the 767 pretty far and I assume the 767s are weight restricted at times, but I may be wrong.<

Not at all, AA flew their 763ERs LAX-CDG with no problem, and that is about 6000 miles. The plane is quite capable, the only reason the A330 has done well against it is cargo capacity.



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineAAplatnumflier From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 6132 times:

Was LAX-LHR (flight 1 I believe) the first 777 flight from NZ??

User currently offlineTG992 From New Zealand, joined Jan 2001, 2910 posts, RR: 10
Reply 9, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 6124 times:

Following crew training on the Tasman, SFO first, followed by CHC-LAX, then HKG and SIN, as the new a/c arrive - all these routes should be 777 by Jan 2006. The next 777s to arrive in 2006 will be used for new routes.

NRT will stay as a 747 route but there's no competition on the NZ-Japan route, so it'll be the last to get the refurbished a/c.

[Edited 2004-11-09 05:51:15]


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User currently offlineYanksn4 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1403 posts, RR: 12
Reply 10, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 6115 times:

As far as that AKL-DEN-CPH, wow, what a cool route

I'm sorry if I sound like an idiot on this, but does that mean Air New Zealand or United Airlines will be flying directly to Denver from AKL or is AKL-LAX-DEN-ORD-CPH?



2013 Airports: EWR, JFK, LGA, LIS, AGP, DEN, GIG, RGN, BKK, LHR, FRA, LAX, SYD, PER, MEL, MCO, MIA, PEK, IAH
User currently offlineGardermoen From Australia, joined Jul 1999, 1520 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 6099 times:

SQ and CX have a better aircraft option as opposed to NZ. Newer 777s and A340s (with better interiors and gadgets) as opposed to the 767 means they capture a greater share of the traffic. NZ will definetly do better with the 777s on these routes.
Aren't these aircraft primarily going to replace the 767s anyway? So I guess in the longer term we will see the 777s in all current 767 destinations.


User currently offlineF9Widebody From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 1604 posts, RR: 10
Reply 12, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 6096 times:

As far as that AKL-DEN-CPH, wow, what a cool route. And with those codeshares, they will probably fill each leg. I am betting they use the entire 16,000 foot brand new runway at DEN to get out on hot days as DEN hits around 30-32 C in the summer and is over a mile high. After all, they built that runway specifically for very long haul 772ERs as DEN cannot really support a 744 to most cities.

I'm sorry if I sound like an idiot on this, but does that mean Air New Zealand or United Airlines will be flying directly to Denver from AKL or is AKL-LAX-DEN-ORD-CPH?

I think you guys just bit pretty hard on a bad, bad joke.



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User currently offlineN1120a From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26196 posts, RR: 76
Reply 13, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 6089 times:

>Was LAX-LHR (flight 1 I believe) the first 777 flight from NZ??<

NZ1 is the flight that goes AKL-LAX-LHR and that is, and will be, only operated by a 747. There is a chance, if the loads don't do as well as they hope, that CHC-LAX-CHC will be downgraded to a 777. Same with SFO

>I'm sorry if I sound like an idiot on this, but does that mean Air New Zealand or United Airlines will be flying directly to Denver from AKL or is AKL-LAX-DEN-ORD-CPH?<

You would only sound like an idiot if you did not ask. The planned flight is AKL-DEN-CPH, and it is straight NZ, not UA. UA will codeshare, as will SK. The reason the 772ER will be able to do it with good loads will be because of DEN's new 16,000 foot runway that will enable the 777 to take a long take off roll in hot and high DEN in the summer



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineLufthansa From Christmas Island, joined May 1999, 3197 posts, RR: 10
Reply 14, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 6024 times:

Lol

Actually it was a bad joke...i made it up to amuse myself, but come to think of it, maybe AKL-DEN-CPH isn't such a bad idea after all?

AKL good hub to feed all Australian cities and of course New Zealand, DEN, big population served from that hub, and DEN-CPH would provide a good link to Northern Europe with customers from Germany, Sweden, Denmark, finland the baltic states and even Holland and Russia. It actually could work provided UA, SK and LH all code shared on it. You could fill it!

Edit: CPH-SEA works, so why not DEN?

[Edited 2004-11-09 06:57:49]

User currently offlineTG992 From New Zealand, joined Jan 2001, 2910 posts, RR: 10
Reply 15, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 5988 times:

What is wrong with a 763? They are perfectly modern and extremely efficient, especially if NZ does not carry a lot of cargo on the routes. If that is the case, they are probably the ideal plane. It would be the interior that would make a difference

SIN and HKG are big cargo markets - if the 763s received the cabin upgrade planned for the 744s (PTV, flatbeds, etc) they would no longer be mission capable for those routes.

There is a chance, if the loads don't do as well as they hope, that CHC-LAX-CHC will be downgraded to a 777. Same with SFO.

Did you not read my prior post? To recap.. SFO will be the first 777 route, followed by CHC-LAX, followed by HKG and SIN.



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User currently offlineN1120a From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26196 posts, RR: 76
Reply 16, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 5966 times:

>Did you not read my prior post? To recap.. SFO will be the first 777 route, followed by CHC-LAX, followed by HKG and SIN.<

Since NZ019/020 (CHC-LAX-CHC) is currently a 744, I would assume that they would keep on with the 744 if loads justified it. Why make less money?



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineLufthansa From Christmas Island, joined May 1999, 3197 posts, RR: 10
Reply 17, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 5972 times:

Guys check this out?
Its totally doable! Its easy within 777-200ER range, even going a little bit out of the way for ETOPS (see shaded area...only just encroaches using 180 minute rule) and DEN would be a breeze to clear customs in compared to the dreaded LAX. Connections easily to EVERYWHERE from SLC to Texas.

I think this may be a stroke of genius. Seriously... I think they should think about this one. They've basically given up on Europe, focusing just on LHR, but DEN internationally for star carriers still has a lot of prospect. LH flies to Portland, SK to SEA, i seriously think they could fill this one. maybe start off 3 times a week but i think it could work.

Copy and paste the following into your browser...i couldn't get it to work as a clickable link:

http://gc.kls2.com/cgi-bin/gc?PATH=AKL-DEN-CPH&RANGE=&PATH-COLOR=&PATH-UNITS=km&SPEED-GROUND=&SPEED-UNITS=kts&RANGE-STYLE=best&RANGE-COLOR=&MAP-STYLE=&ETOPS=180


User currently offlineDLKAPA From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 5961 times:

Actually I've heard that a DEN/NZ flight has been thought up by the city of Denver, can't find the article though, it was in the Rocky Mountain News I believe. Said something to the effect that the city has been in talks with several airlines including ANA, ANZ, LH, and KLM for international service.

User currently offlineN1120a From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26196 posts, RR: 76
Reply 19, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 5962 times:

>Guys check this out?
Its totally doable! Its easy within 777-200ER range, even going a little bit out of the way for ETOPS (see shaded area...only just encroaches using 180 minute rule) and DEN would be a breeze to clear customs in compared to the dreaded LAX. Connections easily to EVERYWHERE from SLC to Texas.

I think this may be a stroke of genius. Seriously... I think they should think about this one. They've basically given up on Europe, focusing just on LHR, but DEN internationally for star carriers still has a lot of prospect. LH flies to Portland, SK to SEA, i seriously think they could fill this one. maybe start off 3 times a week but i think it could work.<

I already did that. Look at my early posts. Less than 6400 nm. The only reason you would not have been able to do this before would be the "only" 13,000 foot runways at DEN would not be able to launch the plane with a full payload such a long way. With 3000 more feet, it is much easier



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineTG992 From New Zealand, joined Jan 2001, 2910 posts, RR: 10
Reply 20, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 5938 times:

Since NZ019/020 (CHC-LAX-CHC) is currently a 744, I would assume that they would keep on with the 744 if loads justified it. Why make less money?

Firstly, it's NZ18/19. The reason it's currently a 744 is because there's no alternative.

A 777 wouldn't necessarily make less money - the route is very much a leisure route (ie, not much high-yielding traffic) and there are loads of alternative flights routing LAX-AKL-CHC. The 744 will be better utilised elsewhere.

CHC-LAX WILL be going 777 from November 2005.



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User currently offlineConcordeBoy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 5908 times:

The only reason you would not have been able to do this before would be the "only" 13,000 foot runways at DEN

You mean 12,000.....


User currently offlineN1120a From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26196 posts, RR: 76
Reply 22, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 5902 times:

Yes I do Fred. Right as I was on a roll, I gave you something to correct. Damn it. Big grin


Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineThe777Man From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 6409 posts, RR: 55
Reply 23, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 5863 times:

Thanks for the info, TG992!

I assume that the NZ 777s will be two-class ? Do you what the configuration will be ?

Thanks!

The777Man



Need a Boeing 777 Firing Order....Further to fly...T5, CI, MU, LX and LH 777s
User currently offlineTG992 From New Zealand, joined Jan 2001, 2910 posts, RR: 10
Reply 24, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 5843 times:

Hi 777Man,

Config will be 313 in a "2.5 class" config - 269 Economy, 18 Super Economy, and 26 Premium. As you can see the layout reflects the 777s intended deployment on leisure/economy-heavy routes, while still offering a Premium section of reasonable size (and industry-leading cabin, at the time it's delivered!)



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25 Post contains images The777Man : Will NZ increase the frequency next Oct/Nov to/from SFO to compensate for the lower capacity of the 777 vs 744 and to take advantage of the codeshare
26 ZK-NBT : I'll jump in and say that it has been said that AKL-SFO and CHC-LAX will go daily if they are popular with the 777's. AKL-SFO will definatly be popula
27 TG992 : -NBT: SUH is still planned to be returned to lessor without receiving the upgrade. CHC-LAX is still being evaluated - it'll go to a 777, but whether i
28 Post contains images ZK-NBT : Cheers! It would be nice of course if they were to open or increase frequency on exsiting routes and be able to keep and upgrade her. I noticed for no
29 Post contains images ZKSUJ : Man, you guys nearly had me with the AKL-DEN-CPH route. I was feeling real left out akward because it would have been made headlines over here, but, I
30 Carpethead : First of all 777 is a new type at NZ, so it will first be used on AKL-SYD for crew familiarization. Here are my thoughts: NRT-AKL sees two 763 & five
31 ZK-NBT : Carpethead, read reply 9. KIX will eventually get 777's i'm sure, but since there is no competition as TG992 said above it will be one of the last rou
32 Nz1 : In reply to an earlier post, ZK-SUH is being retired next year, not 2006, and definitely is not getting the upograde. ZK-SUI is the 1st aircraft in Ma
33 ZKOJH : it thought the cph was true as well, when i started to read it, it amazing what gets u going in the formans.. i think most of us are aware that sfo wi
34 Nz1 : ZK-OJI the 9th A320 arrived just over a week ago, and has replaced the schedule of 733 ZK-NGA, which has been transferred to Freedomair. Freedom take
35 ZKSUJ : From what I gather, the 777 is basically a replacement for the 767, so I would not think that too many new routes will be opened with it unless the on
36 ZK-NBT : Remember that 5 763's will be around until 2009-10, with only 2 7E7's on order I would think that they will order more aircraft when the time gets nea
37 SunriseValley : TG992.......... You provided the seating configuration for ANZ's -200ER's. Can you refer me to another carrier who uses the same layout so that I can
38 RoseFlyer : Wasn't NZ's last 763 delivered in 2001. Why are they being replaced so quickly? All of them gone by 2010 doesn't make much financial sense unless they
39 TG992 : Roseflyer - 10 years ago the New Zealand, Pacific, and world aviation scenes were very different from what they are now. NZ has been through 4 CEOs in
40 ZKSUJ : If I am not mistake, aern't NZ's 737s going to freedom? If so then they technically would not be getting rid of them just yet.
41 ZK-NBT : If I am not mistake, aern't NZ's 737s going to freedom? If so then they technically would not be getting rid of them just yet. Nope though ZK-NGA is n
42 ZKSUJ : Sorry, My mistake. Would the 763s be doing trans tasman when the 777s arrive?
43 ZK-NBT : Would the 763s be doing trans tasman when the 777s arrive? Doubt it except for AKL-PER. 4 763's leave the fleet and the remaining 5 will it seems cont
44 ZKSUJ : "AKL-TPE (if they return)" Have NZ quit TPE?
45 ZK-NBT : Have NZ quit TPE? They have dropped it this Southern summer in favour of a code share operated by BR 4x weekly with a 763. Though NZ operated the flig
46 Kiwi dave : Which particular 763s are ending the time with NZ once there leases are up
47 Nz1 : Kiwi_dave, The 5 763's we are keeping are as follows: ZK-NCG - PMC ZK-NCI - PMC ZK-NCJ - PMC ZK-NCK - FADEC ZK-NCL - FADEC For info, ZK-NCH, N and O l
48 ZKSUJ : Will NZ be excersising theit rights to order more A320, 777 or 7E7 at this stage or in the near future?
49 Arkhem : You mean 12,000..... DEN has one 16,000 foot runway, 16R/34L.
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