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Delta MD-90's  
User currently offlineZmatt1 From United States of America, joined Jul 2002, 53 posts, RR: 0
Posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 4563 times:
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I just completed a two week trip PDX-DAB-PDX all on Delta. Went to Florida to help my uncle with roof repairs. Two things made me scratch my head. 1) every flight segment(5) had nary an empty seat. How are these people losing the money they do? 2) My last leg home was SLC-PDX on a MD-90. My first flight on a 90. N910DA to be exact. What a great plane! Comfortable and quiet. And the power! The thing was full and shot of the runway at SLC like a rocket. Why were these not more popular? Was it the onset of the 737NG that held them back? Just wondering.



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26 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineN6376m From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 4530 times:

Why are they loosing money - simple:

CASM > RASM


User currently offlineWesternA318 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 5652 posts, RR: 24
Reply 2, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 4527 times:

As to why DL is losing money like they are with full loads, just ask the people how much they paid for their ticket. The MD-90's were supposed to be the second part of the domestic backbone of DL's fleet of the 1990's, along with about 130 737-300's. DL had about 120 -90's on order, but converted some of their remaining MD-82's into -88 status (glass cockipt and what not). Delta put a hold on the MD-90 and 737-300 orders when they bought the remnants of Pan Am in 1991, due to giving up such a huge amount of cash to the struggling carrier. I would have loved to see SLC teeming with 733's and MD-90's, the only two aircraft still in DL's fleet that I actually enjoy flying. The others were the beloved L-1011 and 727-200.  Big thumbs up


Next trip: SLC-DEN-SLC-PHX-JFK-LAX-SLC with my wife and oldest daughter. F9 to and from DEN, US to JFK, AA 321 and CR7
User currently offlineRoseFlyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 9588 posts, RR: 52
Reply 3, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 4500 times:

Then MD-90, 752 and BAE 146 are all top performers in their categories. DL likes the MD-90s because they can easily operate out of the hot and high conditions in SLC. However they aren't good as far as maintenance goes. The first few had electrical problems and maintenance workers seem to hate them. The 738s that DL went for have a higher dispatch reliability.

The MD-90s were great performers but along with the MD-11, they still had a lot of small problems. McDonnell Douglas in its later years produced some good planes, but often did some cost cutting and used older designs (the MD-11 using the DC-10s wing for example) that hurt them. If McDonnell Douglas had been in better financial condition and spent more money developing the MD-90 as a new plane, it might have been a better fighter against the 737NGs. The MD-90 is a strong update of the DC-9 series but it was rushed through production and was not perfected before it hit the market in a move to beat Boeing. (Before anyone flames me too bad, I admit this is all speculation on my part from what I have heard.)



If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
User currently offlineWesternA318 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 5652 posts, RR: 24
Reply 4, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 4491 times:

You are very much correct RoseFlyer. I believe McD could have built the MD_90 line (incl. the MD-95) to be a serious contender to the 737NG series, much like the DC-9 family was to the original 737 line.


Next trip: SLC-DEN-SLC-PHX-JFK-LAX-SLC with my wife and oldest daughter. F9 to and from DEN, US to JFK, AA 321 and CR7
User currently offlineATLhomeCMH From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 770 posts, RR: 3
Reply 5, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 4472 times:

WesternA318:

I would have loved to see SLC teeming with 733's and MD-90's, the only two aircraft still in DL's fleet that I actually enjoy flying. The others were the beloved L-1011 and 727-200.

Man, you couldn't have summed it up better for me. Only, for me I would replace your 733s with 752s. I miss the 10-11s and 722s a lot. I hate seeing pics of them rotting out in the desert.  Crying

The MD-90s are an important asset to DL's fleet. Aren't the new config MD90s going to be 2x2, instead of 3x2?



"The most terrifying words in the Engligh language are, 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'"-Ronald Reagan
User currently offlineRockyRacoon From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 966 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 4385 times:

I think it's safe to say, that the only 2x2 seating on DL's MD-90s will be upfront in first.



peace


User currently offlineWesternA318 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 5652 posts, RR: 24
Reply 7, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 4204 times:

I just got off of one of the new-style -90s this afternoon from SNA, MARVELOUS! 2x2 seating. Didn't think DL thought much of their pax, but, I was asleep but I enjoyed this little ride. Had to get the last 500 miles for Platinum Elite somehow, now, right?


Next trip: SLC-DEN-SLC-PHX-JFK-LAX-SLC with my wife and oldest daughter. F9 to and from DEN, US to JFK, AA 321 and CR7
User currently offlineSspontak From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 475 posts, RR: 2
Reply 8, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 4120 times:

What's this about 2x2 seating? Is it a test? I have not heard anything about it.


Go Delta!
User currently offlineB4real From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 2637 posts, RR: 5
Reply 9, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 4045 times:

There is no 2x2 in Y on the MD-90s.


B4REAL, spelled like it sounds
User currently offlineGigneil From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 16347 posts, RR: 85
Reply 10, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 4030 times:

The MD-90's were supposed to be the second part of the domestic backbone of DL's fleet of the 1990's, along with about 130 737-300

What? Delta never had 130 737-300s on order. The MD-90 and the MD-88 were to form the bulk of the domestic network.

Most of DL's 737-300s came from Western. Western may have had a retarded number of 737-300s on order, but I doubt 130.

The MD-90 needed more to be a real competitor, it was rushed into service. It didn't feature the MD-11 cockpit (although I hear Saudia's feature an all-glass cockpit, I've never seen a picture of what they actually look like). It didn't really feature an all-new wing. It did pioneer a whole lot of new things that didn't work right.

Also, it was a little short on range versus the A320 and the proposed 737-800.

Nice aircraft, tho. Very efficient.


User currently offlineJetjeanes From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 1430 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 3999 times:

Hmm Then is it the md 88s, or anything below md90 in the md line not allowed in slc,because of possible loss of an engine...anyone recall what that was all about


i can see for 80 miles
User currently offlineWesternA318 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 5652 posts, RR: 24
Reply 12, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 3971 times:

I dont see why DL didnt place -88s here, other operators bring in tons of them (AA, TW, CO, NW, to name most of them).

At one time, DL had on order for 130 737-300's but in 1991, traqnsferred the type of aircraft to the 767-300 and more 757-200's. Western only had 11 737-300's at the time of the takeover, but had 25 on order. The number of the order was also reduced to about 80-90 airframes, although I'm not sure of exactly how much (braces for flaming).

The DL -90 I was on today had 2x2 in coach and 1x2 in first. Maybe it's something new that the a.nuts haven't seen yet?  Big thumbs up



Next trip: SLC-DEN-SLC-PHX-JFK-LAX-SLC with my wife and oldest daughter. F9 to and from DEN, US to JFK, AA 321 and CR7
User currently offlineGigneil From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 16347 posts, RR: 85
Reply 13, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 3941 times:


The DL -90 I was on today had 2x2 in coach and 1x2 in first. Maybe it's something new that the a.nuts haven't seen yet?


I just spoke with a friend at DL that has never heard of it either, but he double checked with several other people before saying he's sure it doesn't exist.

What was the reg. number? What flight number was it?

N


User currently offlineWesternA318 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 5652 posts, RR: 24
Reply 14, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 3909 times:

It was flight 723 SNA-SLC. I didn't get the reg.


Next trip: SLC-DEN-SLC-PHX-JFK-LAX-SLC with my wife and oldest daughter. F9 to and from DEN, US to JFK, AA 321 and CR7
User currently offlineCODC10 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 2403 posts, RR: 6
Reply 15, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 3896 times:

Are the new strech CRJs equipped with a first class cabin?

If so, 1x2 First and 2x2 coach seems realistic.

There is no way you flew on an MD-90 in that configuration...sorry...it just doesn't work like that. There is no doubt in my mind that either you were mixed up with another aircraft type or your eyes were playing tricks on you.


User currently offlineWesternA318 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 5652 posts, RR: 24
Reply 16, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 3879 times:

I KNOW it's nutz! I got the safety card off the plane, its a -90.


Next trip: SLC-DEN-SLC-PHX-JFK-LAX-SLC with my wife and oldest daughter. F9 to and from DEN, US to JFK, AA 321 and CR7
User currently offlineB4real From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 2637 posts, RR: 5
Reply 17, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 3854 times:

1x2 F on an RJ would be nice, unfortunately I don't think it will happen. DL has invested too much in the CRJ to have (yet another) mixed product in the Delta Connection brand.

It would be nice, however.



B4REAL, spelled like it sounds
User currently offlineWesternA318 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 5652 posts, RR: 24
Reply 18, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 3834 times:

I agree B4real, 1x2 on an RJ would be the cookie's crumble, but I know Mesa has it on their CRJ9's. Or at least they had it while the 9's were with HP Express, now theyre at UA?? I dunno, I['ll have to fly out on HP again to find out.


Next trip: SLC-DEN-SLC-PHX-JFK-LAX-SLC with my wife and oldest daughter. F9 to and from DEN, US to JFK, AA 321 and CR7
User currently offlineJetjeanes From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 1430 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 3825 times:

I found where dl had an rj prior to this flyt but it doesnt show up as a scheduled flyt, before 723,,so i dont know what it could have been..


i can see for 80 miles
User currently offlineB4real From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 2637 posts, RR: 5
Reply 20, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 3818 times:

A CRJ-9 may be a different story for DL. I believe the current scope stops flights operating as DL connection from 71 or more seats, and at that only a specified/limited number of aircraft at 70 seats. If DL had the CRJ-9, I bet it would have to be flown by DL pilots.

I like the NW Avro, as they have the FC product. I don't like, however, how NW regional aircraft are a mixed product. And as a premium customer, this is important. If all NW regional flights had FC, I would make NW my airline of choice from where I live.




B4REAL, spelled like it sounds
User currently offlineB4real From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 2637 posts, RR: 5
Reply 21, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 3810 times:

One observation from the passenger seat, I like the way DL equipped the MD-90. Specifically, the IFE and if you are travelling with someone, to have the side with 2 seats for a comfortable ride in coach. I think the MD-88 has a better FC experience. Now, I know there are only .2 inches difference in seat width, but I think I can feel it. Coach seats are a little roomier on the MD-88 as DL equips them as well.

The IFE is the best thing. If I had it my way, all DL a/c would have the IFE like the MD-90.



B4REAL, spelled like it sounds
User currently offlineSESGDL From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 3471 posts, RR: 10
Reply 22, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 3715 times:

WesternA318,

I'm sorry, but you're wrong. DL doesn't have any MD-90's with 2x2 seating unless you sat in first. And there are certainly none with 1x2 seating in first. You were just mistaken.

Jeremy


User currently offlineWesternA318 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 5652 posts, RR: 24
Reply 23, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 3632 times:

I just got my pictures back from the trip. You're right, the First Class is 2x2, my bad...sorry.... Sad


Next trip: SLC-DEN-SLC-PHX-JFK-LAX-SLC with my wife and oldest daughter. F9 to and from DEN, US to JFK, AA 321 and CR7
User currently offlineGigneil From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 16347 posts, RR: 85
Reply 24, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 3625 times:

What class were you in?

N


25 WesternA318 : I was in First Class, 2C.
26 Post contains images SESGDL : It's okay. We all make mistakes. Jeremy
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