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Why LH A332 With PW Engines And A333 With RR?  
User currently offlineGoMEA From France, joined Jan 2004, 202 posts, RR: 7
Posted (9 years 11 months 1 week 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 4741 times:

I would like to understand why the hell Lufthansa went for the A333-343X with RR engines and ordered the A332 with PW engines? This is screwing everything said about fleet commonality, cost saving , et al...

Do they still operate their A32X family with both CFM and IAE engines...?

Thanks for the insight


MEA raising the Cedar far up in the sky
13 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineTriStar500 From Germany, joined Nov 1999, 4695 posts, RR: 42
Reply 1, posted (9 years 11 months 1 week 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 4715 times:

1. A330
The A332 are only leased as an interim measure until sufficient A333 and A346 have been delivered. These are ex SR and SN birds.

2. A320 family
LH ordered the A321 with IAE engines in order to give LH Technik plenty of expertise on this engine type in order to compete for third party work.

So there are a lot of other factors than superficial fleet commonality in these cases - and like most business decisions LH is taking, it makes a lot of sense.




Homer: Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!
User currently offlineGoMEA From France, joined Jan 2004, 202 posts, RR: 7
Reply 2, posted (9 years 11 months 1 week 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 4701 times:

TriStar500,

thanks for your objective insight. I should have checked those LH A332 from where they came ! What are the route they're using them on? What about the A333? They're here to replace the A300's, right?



MEA raising the Cedar far up in the sky
User currently offlineFraT From Germany, joined Sep 2003, 1107 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (9 years 11 months 1 week 6 days ago) and read 4686 times:

I don't think we will see 333s on flights within Germany. That's where the A300s are mainly used.

User currently offlineTriStar500 From Germany, joined Nov 1999, 4695 posts, RR: 42
Reply 4, posted (9 years 11 months 1 week 6 days ago) and read 4680 times:

The A333 are used on medium- and some shorter long haul routes to high yield destinations - e.g. in Central Asia, the Middle East, West Africa and one or two dailies to JFK.



Homer: Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!
User currently offlineCHRISBA777ER From UK - England, joined Mar 2001, 5964 posts, RR: 62
Reply 5, posted (9 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 4579 times:

Am i right in thinking that the A333s are RR powered, giving commonality with the A346 and A388, and that the A332s that LH has currently are PW powered, former Swiss and Sabena machines?

Does LH have any new A332s on order? Are these RR powered? You can bet that they will be interested in the A350 - to replace the A300s (which are - 605R versions i think and so still quite new and just fine for their roles - LH can wait till 2008 no worries i think) - question is - will the Trent 1000 be offered on the A350 as it is on the 7E7?

THATS impressive fleet commonality!




What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
User currently offlineTriStar500 From Germany, joined Nov 1999, 4695 posts, RR: 42
Reply 6, posted (9 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 4554 times:

A lot of the A306 are -603. Some of them have already reached the originally intended cycle limit, and had to be modified (a.k.a. ageing aircraft program). The A300 just wasn't originally designed for short 45-60 minute hops to TXL, HAM, LHR etc.



Homer: Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!
User currently offlineCHRISBA777ER From UK - England, joined Mar 2001, 5964 posts, RR: 62
Reply 7, posted (9 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 4519 times:

Tristar500 - "The A300 just wasn't originally designed for short 45-60 minute hops to TXL, HAM, LHR etc"

The earlier B2 and B4 types were designed for high density short and medium haul work - AF worked theirs into the ground doing exactly this. Agreed the B6 is a different beast, but the best in the world IMHO for what LH needs them for - they carry A LOT of cargo LHR-FRA and pax loads are high density - id say the A300-B600 is the best and most suitable ac for this type of ops. Ive never understood why AF didnt sell some of their LHR slots and use larger ac types than the A320 CDG-LHR - like LH do.



What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
User currently offlineTriStar500 From Germany, joined Nov 1999, 4695 posts, RR: 42
Reply 8, posted (9 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 4472 times:

I can only repeat what I have heard from LH employees (pilots) regarding the cycles issue - if you have other information, I am happy to get correct information.  Smile




Homer: Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!
User currently offlineCHRISBA777ER From UK - England, joined Mar 2001, 5964 posts, RR: 62
Reply 9, posted (9 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 4450 times:

LOL Tristar500 i wasnt trying to discredit you mate - i dont doubt that LH's A300 fleet is running massive cycles per airframe numbers - the route portfolio they fly means it cant be any other way - i merely meant to infer that the A300 is a fantastic ac for the type of operation LH have. Im sure the A300s are getting tired beyond their years, and if you say some of the airframes are maxed out, well i can imagine that may well be the case.

I didnt really disagree with anything you said, just that IMHO the A300 is the best type of aircraft in existance for the specific ops that LH are running, domestically, RPSK, and to European hubs like LHR. I'd be interested to see how their numbers for fuel burn, MX costs, turnaround time, reliability etc compares against the A332 (hypothetically) on the same route network and schedules - i bet the A332 is not as far ahead as people may think.

The A300 is a fantastic aircraft for what LH use it for - thats all im saying. No offence meant mate.



What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
User currently offlineTriStar500 From Germany, joined Nov 1999, 4695 posts, RR: 42
Reply 10, posted (9 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 4382 times:

No problem... that's why I used the good old  Smile . Just wanted to give you some extra information, which goes beyond the general information, which you have written (and which I agree upon in general). Big grin



Homer: Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!
User currently offlineDABVF From Germany, joined Sep 2004, 184 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (9 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 4155 times:

@ GoMEA: Currently Lufthansa flies the A330-300 from Frankfurt to New York, Chicago, Cairo-Khartoum/Sanaa and Lagos-Abuja/Accra, the A330-200 are used on flights from Frankfurt to Cairo, Jeddah-Addis Abeba, Baku-Ashgabat, Tel Aviv and Almaty.

User currently offlineFlyCaledonian From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2003, 2096 posts, RR: 3
Reply 12, posted (9 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 4089 times:

CHRISBA777ER, AF uses the A320s on CDG-LHR because EuroStar has done a lot to eat away at market share on the Paris-London route. AF used to use the A300s on this route, while BA at one time used TriStars and 767s. AF and BA use smaller aircraft with regular frequencies in order to compete with EuroStar. If they still used bigger aircraft but with less flights then that competitive edge has gone.


Let's Go British Caledonian!
User currently offlineGoMEA From France, joined Jan 2004, 202 posts, RR: 7
Reply 13, posted (9 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 4071 times:

DABVF,

what a shame they don't fly any of their A333's to Beirut - Lebanon. Although yields are not up all year round, they could get a better market share by increasing capacity (usually A320-A321 and occasionally A300). Just try to book a seat on LH flights to BEY in peak time.

Even MEA which is a small airline ventured into sending an A332 to DUS while continuing to serve the A321 to FRA. There is a big Lebanese community living in Germany and LH could make a better use of that.

And with their huge network, they could also capture some the transiting pax to North America. AF has been very successful at that indeed.



MEA raising the Cedar far up in the sky
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