JMV From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 241 posts, RR: 1 Posted (9 years 3 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 4340 times:
According to an article in ATWOnline.com, UA flight attendants threaten targeted disruptions to service, otherwise known as CHAOS (creating havoc across our system). The intent, according to union leaders, is to prevent management from destroying UA.
"United Airlines has declared war on us in proposed demands in cuts to wages, benefits and work rules. If management stands by these stipulations they will destroy United Airlines. We are not going to let that happen," union leaders stated.
The article states that the targeted walkouts under CHAOS are supposed to "temporarily disrupt operations and annoy passengers while causing a steady erosion of customer support for the airline."
How do you suppose targeted walkouts by flight attendants that are designed to "annoy passengers while causing a steady erosion of customer support for the airline" will prevent the destruction of UA?
Falcon84 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 3, posted (9 years 3 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 4320 times:
Well, typical short-sightedness on the part of another airline union. As if this is gong to impress anyone. What it will do is drive more customers away from UA and further hurt that struggling airline.
Foolish move, which could have bad results for UA.
Unitedtristar From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 4, posted (9 years 3 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 4291 times:
Well according to the railway labor act (which governs airline employees) any labor actions which result in unapproved work action (any labor disputes resulting in work action must go through a federal mediator and once that mediator declares an impasse there must be a 30 day cooling off period before any work action can happen) will result in termination of the participating employees. The original CHAOS program was waged by AS FA's and it was done only after their cooling off period. So these are just big words for now. Anyone who is foolish enough to participate can look for a new job!
Flybyguy From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 1796 posts, RR: 1 Reply 6, posted (9 years 3 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 4169 times:
The management is destroying UA, eh? It's probably in their best interests to do so, just that way their preferred stock will pay out in real cash when they liquidate. Meanwhile, at the airports, all UA employees get the shaft and a pink-slip while management jump ship with golden parashutes.
GET REAL PEOPLE... MANAGEMENT ALWAYS WINS.
"Are you a pretender... or a thoroughbred?!" - Professor Matt Miller
Ord From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 1371 posts, RR: 1 Reply 7, posted (9 years 3 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 4143 times:
Unitedtristar - These don't seem to be just "big words for now." The article says "According to the union, the legally required 30-day cooling-off period before a strike does not apply when a bankruptcy court agrees to reject a contract."
I am a fan of United but the flight attendants are incredibly stupid. I work in an industry where I have clients. If I didn't like the way my company/job was going, I would never take it out on the product and service I provide my clients. I would get another job.
Goingboeing From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4875 posts, RR: 18 Reply 9, posted (9 years 3 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 4072 times:
The intent, according to union leaders, is to prevent management from destroying UA.
I guess that so that the unoin can destroy it instead. I sympathize with the employees of US and UA, but don't the UA FA's remember all the goodwill and support that was generated during the "summer of hell" when the pilots union held their little slowdown?
While it ain't right...the FA's should ask themselves just how badly they can hurt a group of executives who have their nice little golden parachutes nearby and will have a nice softlanding with millions of $$$ in their pockets whilst the rest of the employees can only hope for a soft spot to thud down into when the airline folds.
Bobnwa From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 6246 posts, RR: 9 Reply 10, posted (9 years 3 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 4060 times:
What percentage of the management employees at UA or any airline do you think have "golden parachutes"? What percentage of the mainline pilots have about a million dollars in their 401K and vested pension plan?
JayDavis From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 2000 posts, RR: 17 Reply 11, posted (9 years 3 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 4035 times:
These Union Hooligans are total idiots. I'm sorry, but I think if you are a member of a union, you pretty much become a member of a cult, along with becoming a mindless robot.
Unions served a purpose in the United States during the Industrial Revolution, but unions are what is wrong with so many of the airlines today. They have such idiotic work rules it is hard to understand them, at times.
I hope that unions continue to lose more of their power as time passes on, it certainly seems that way right now............
Goingboeing From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4875 posts, RR: 18 Reply 13, posted (9 years 3 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 4010 times:
What percentage of the management employees at UA or any airline do you think have "golden parachutes"?
On the other hand....how many "management employees" have real decision making power at UA or any other airline? The target of the union is "upper managment", and most likely each and every member of that group has a golden parachute.
Ltbewr From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 12677 posts, RR: 13 Reply 14, posted (9 years 3 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 3970 times:
This threat of 'CHAOS' may push UA to the brink of Ch. 7. While I understand the frustration of the f/a's at UA, to take it out on the passangers would be very foolish. From a lot of people being out sick, to our comming to a peak travel period, to doing miminal services to pax in flight, there could be a backlash upon them and UA. Worse, there is little support from our current Republican controlled government to recognize the serious crises many working people are in today. Perhaps a better way to protest would be to have 'informational pickets' at airport terminals, noting the perdictiment they are in under bankruptcy.
TOLtommy From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3246 posts, RR: 4 Reply 15, posted (9 years 3 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 3929 times:
"Unitedtristar - These don't seem to be just "big words for now." The article says "According to the union, the legally required 30-day cooling-off period before a strike does not apply when a bankruptcy court agrees to reject a contract."
ORD - That might be true for US and UA. Problem is, the AFA is trying to make it look like there will be a nationwide strike across all AFA repersented airlines. I know AirTran and Mesaba are both AFA carriers as well. The RLA, as spelled out by TriStar applies to those airlines. AirTran is in negotiations but hasn't been released into the 30 day cooling off period, and I don't believe Mesaba FA's are in negotitations at all. So for either of those groups to join in a nationwide strike would be a violation of their contracts, and probably the end of their careers. AFA knows this, but is conveniently ignoring it in order to spin a little propaganda. The union has to be scared to death about the loss of dues paying members at US, UA, and ATA.
Azjubilee From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 3631 posts, RR: 29 Reply 16, posted (9 years 3 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 3909 times:
You guys are missing the point... of course this is going to hurt UAL! That's the inention... or at least the spirit of the threat of CHAOS. It is the hope for UAL to get scared and to submit to the unions demands. I'm sure it is not the FAs intent to shut their company down, though some radicals would probably rather the company shut down than work for rediculous pay.
Everyone seems to remember the "summer of hell" that the pilots caused. But nobody seems to remember what they got out of it. THE BEST CONTRACT. Granted, these are different times and the company wasn't in BK. However, the intent is still the same.
Ual777contrail From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 17, posted (9 years 3 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 3893 times:
This is all the F/A's have, they are glorified drink servers. Most will lose their jobs for this. If I made a guess, UAL will do away with their contract first, and anybody causing CHAOS will be causing CHAOS in the unemployment line.
Biggest job group at UAL, and the dumbest job group at UAL.
KITH From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 371 posts, RR: 1 Reply 20, posted (9 years 3 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 3773 times:
I hope flybyguy isnt at the Labor relations school at Cornell! Haha, all kidding aside I would think the UA Managment would make more money saving the compnay and jumping ship when the stock is worth more then pennies. This labor action will anger the pax, "if gramma can't be seen on xmass." It will win them no sympathy, mine included, and I feel its shamefull how little they are paid. That's the game. -Matt in KITH
Cofaninbos From United States of America, joined May 2004, 287 posts, RR: 0 Reply 21, posted (9 years 3 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 3743 times:
I am sorry, but if we didn't have unions, we'd still have child labor, no minimum wage laws (and the one we have SUCKS enough already), no weekends, and generally no say whatsoever on everyday workplace issues. Take a HISTORY class and learn some facts.
This whole anti-union, "right to work" mantra that exists in America is scary. It represents the overall move to the right of center in this country which is simply amazing when you consider that the rich keep getting richer while the rest of us keep getting worse off!
UA has been run into the ground by the management. They are the ones who get paid to make decisions regarding the overall health of the airline and yet, we are supposed to believe that flight attendants, who have seen slashed paychecks, decreased benefits, and changes in their original contracts, will be the ones to blame?
TOLtommy From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3246 posts, RR: 4 Reply 22, posted (9 years 3 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 3716 times:
"It represents the overall move to the right of center in this country which is simply amazing when you consider that the rich keep getting richer while the rest of us keep getting worse off!"
That's simply not true. A rising tide carries all ships. Personal wealth in this country has never been higher. Home ownership is at an all time high. Perhaps you need a history class as well. What we consider "poor" in this country is envied by the rest of the world.
Don't forget, UA went into bankruptcy while owned by the employees. They had a say in the management of the airline. In fact, they controlled it. The FA's chose not to participate in the ESOP, they didn't want to pay for their share of the company through pay cuts. The other union groups took turns raiding the cupboard, and drove the company into the state it is today.