Fanoftristars From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 1578 posts, RR: 5 Posted (8 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 6437 times:
(Also posted on FlyerTalk)
Maybe I'm preaching to the choir when I say that I feel if you're in Y, you should use the Y bathroom. Tonights first class cabin, EWR to SLC, was overrun by Y passengers not wanting to walk to the back of the plane. Our FA in first did her best to "shoo" the intruders from first, she even attached the rope in effort to keep them at bay.
After about 5 min somebody's kid came crashing through the rope like it was the rope at the finish line, and that action caused the rope to whip the man in 4B in the face as the boy flew by. The boy set a precedent for the rest of the flight, and our FA gave up trying to keep them out. We had people lining up around 4B & C wating for the bathroom, as our FA wouldn't let them wait in the forward galley. As I was seated in 4C, i became even more annoyed as people bumped into my seat as I was trying to eat dinner. So much for a quiet, exclusive first class cabin.
There are two issures at hand here. Issue #1, am I being too picky to not want those in Y camping out in the first class cabin and using the first class bathroom? Issue #2, how does Delta balance the needs of those in first class (by sending the intruders to the rear of the plane) without sounding snooty and pissing people off that are in coach? (I realize they need to be as nice to everyone as possible, as they need every customer they can get.)
ANCFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 2, posted (8 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 6395 times:
F lavs are for F pax. There is no argument.
As for the little rugrat crashing thru the rope and smacking the guy in the face - better be damn glad it wasn't me sitting there in 4B. That little monster and I and his parents would have had a conversation . . . you can bet that.
No excuse, absolutely no excuse for letting a kid run wild like that . . . on a plane, bus, train, where ever.
I can see the nasty letter from the gent in 4B going to DL already. Righteously so.
S12PPL From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 3, posted (8 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 6382 times:
This has been discussed, in very heated terms in the past. I feel you are, but you aren't being too picky. The lav is the lav. People gotta go. If I was a Y pax sitting directly behind first class, I would want to be able to use the closest bathroom possible. I feel it's a right people payed to have. Now. I have been the First Class passenger on a 757 when the front lav was not in use, while the aft one was full with a line. It was right after the movie, and to top it off, a middle school band was on the flight as well. I generally did not mind them using the front lav, but a line by your seat is anoying. Especially if you are trying to work on private materials on your laptop, etc. I personally don't like people reading over my shoulder and such. As a first class pax, I wouldn't mind at all of Y pax used the lav up front, as long as a line didn't form. That is the rule anyways. You aren't allowed to form a line near the cockpit anyways. So not only would it be helping increase comfort of the F pax, it would also be following the law. I know there are others that feel strongly that Y pax not use the "first class" lav, but I mean...come on. Are we getting spoiled now? It's a bathroom folks, not the seat itself. Are you really going to deny someone with an emergancy when the aft lavs are in use? Are you going to tell that 8 year old to just hold it while the 3 or 4 people in front of him go? That's a little harsh...
Jetboyflyhi From France, joined Oct 2004, 179 posts, RR: 0 Reply 4, posted (8 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 6369 times:
Your discussion matter is well received by me.FC is for FC all airlines make PA's stating the forward lav is for FC we as FA's try to enforce this but at times the pax overrun us and I try to avoid conflict (because people will be people)How ever if a line starts I will intervene..I hope this helps your ? Hope you have wonderful FC experience in the future! And we do appreciate you as our passenger! The DL flight I can not speak for. Happy Flying!
ANCFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 5, posted (8 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 6357 times:
S12PPL "Are you going to tell that 8 year old to just hold it while the 3 or 4 people in front of him go? That's a little harsh..."
If the little 8 year old can act like a proper person and not run through the aircraft then it's a different story. The example in the original post does not conform to my definition of proper person, period. Harsh as it may seem, that's just too bad. Adults tend to 'look the other way' or simply excuse the actions of a child because that person is a child. I would not. And before anyone asks, yes, I have children, yes they fly with me in F, yes they know how to act in public places. They know there is a time and place to act like an animal and visa versa.
Jpdx From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 14 posts, RR: 0 Reply 6, posted (8 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 6342 times:
It can be very difficult, as a FA, to manage that forward lav. If I keep Y paxs from coming up, no matter how polite I am, I get scolded. Accused of being a stuck up, no good, snooty, FA. Of course I'm following company policy, but that does not matter.
It's a good choice to limit traffic up front, mainly from a safety point, but also if a pax pays for first (thru $$, or upgraded -- hey -- you've earned it!) they also deserve a quiet cabin.
On international flights it's a different matter, it's US law that paxs cannot move forward AT ALL. On my last flight I had a pax screaming at me in first coming back from Mexico. THAT was fun! When you try to explain why (lav next to flight deck--US law--get arrested) they just don't care. I love my job, and all jobs have their downsides...this is it for me!
Funny thing is...those very same passengers who get upset about being denied usage of the forward lav probably would get irate if they were sitting in first class and had people constantly moving forward to use it. Ahhh...human nature!
ANCFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 9, posted (8 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 6318 times:
jpdx, I do not envy your position. You lose or you lose.
SHUPirate1, if there is an FAA rule, I've never heard of it. Airline policy I'm sure. I recall, pre 9/11 when the F/A would pull a curtain between F and Y there was a polite but obvious sign (on CO or US, I forget) that read simply: Premium Cabin Passengers Only . . .something like that. Between the sign and the drawn curtain, it eliminated the issue nearly completely.
Not any more . . . no curtain, no sign . . . I believe the smaller, single aisle aircraft suffer this problem more prevelently then a wide body with the F and J/Y cabins separated by a couple of lavs, galley, doors, etc.
Jacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 61 Reply 12, posted (8 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 6306 times:
On my flights, the Captain always mentions F lavs for F passengers and Y lavs for Y passengers....and too bad for the Y passenger needing to go to the restroom up front (I tend to travel cattle class most of the time, so i'm in that Y group).............
if a passenger wants to be treated as an "equal", fly an LCC like WN....that way there will be no "classes" present.....
an emergency, i can understand, but premium passengers deserve premium service....end of story....
S12PPL From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 14, posted (8 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 6276 times:
People...we're losing something in the translation. It's a toilet. It's not exactly a first class meal or anything. It's a toilet. People relieve themselves in there....That's all. It is a toilet. I don't quite understand how it's a big deal. Now, if it was some exlusive service provided to first class passengers, then I could understand. On most domestic US flights, they don't put anything special in the lav to make it a special "First Class S**tter". If we can't get past the fact that it's just a damn toilet, I think we are getting a wee bit stuck up here. If I'm "paying" lots of money to use the toilet, I might as well stick to coach. Hell, at least that way I'm only paying about $140 to use the crapper. Let's also not forget that most people don't "pay" for first class. They use miles, or executive privilages to bump up from a cheap fare. So before we get all snooty, and yes...if you care who uses the damn toilet, we are being snooty, let's also remember some people payed the same price as you for that seat you are in, you may have only used your miles to upgrade. So, if I found out you used miles to upgrade from that same $140 internet special fare, and you're whining at me for using "your" lav, we'd be having a discussion.
C'mon guys...let's get beyond this...Remember, we use the thing maybe once on an hour and a half flight...4-5 times max on a JFK-SFO/LAX flight. Am I right?
Aa777jr From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 15, posted (8 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 6214 times:
Every flight I've been on with AA, they have clearly stated that F and Y class passengers should use their respected lavatories. I have never had a problem using the restroom in F class when I'm seated there. no one ever barges past the galleys to come up front.
Lufthansa747 From Philippines, joined May 1999, 3180 posts, RR: 46 Reply 18, posted (8 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 6095 times:
Yes, it's a toilet. But C/F passengers also respect the quieter cabin etc. F/C class facilities are for F/C passengers no matter if you paid with miles or money. Try using the premium class lav on an Asian airline... First there is a curtain that has a big "FIRST CLASS PASSENGERS ONLY" sign, if that doesn't work the F/A will be escorting you back in no time. The way it should work.
Jacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 61 Reply 19, posted (8 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 6038 times:
"The captian??? or the cabin crew / flight attendants ??>"....nopes, the captain!! I might even have the captain mentioning it somewhere on my camcorder (AA738 SFO-ORD), I would have to look for it.....I'm flying again on Friday, so I will pay attention to it..
7LBAC111 From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2004, 2566 posts, RR: 43 Reply 20, posted (8 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 6020 times:
If I was a full fare paying pax sitting in F (and I assume you mean on US domestic services?) and people were disturbing me persistently, I too would be pissed off. When you pay for an F class seat you expect some exclusivity, privacy even.
Pe@rson's comment that it is just a toilet. Does that mean he would offer his bathroom at home to any passing tramp should they need a number 2?
Debate is what you put on de hook when you want to catch de fish.
Chilledflyer From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2004, 114 posts, RR: 0 Reply 21, posted (8 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 6001 times:
I don't agree with some the people here because you should only use what you have paid for. Simple as that. If anyone have ever noticed, F/C class toilets are ever so slightly different to Y class toilets. Having such difference already suggests that people in first/business have paid for the privileges in having such luxury, no matter how small the difference is.
Fanoftristars From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 1578 posts, RR: 5 Reply 23, posted (8 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 5743 times:
You're right, it is just a toilet. The thing that bothers me was the congregation around first class. The constant disruption of people walking past and bumping into me or waiting next to my seat.
I may have not paid a first class fare but I did originally pay a mid-level fare on DL (as did my travel companion who was also upgraded), I was changed from an ealier connecting flight to the later non-stop flight getting in much later than I had wanted, and you may not understand the value of a frequent flyer to an airline, but DL does when they award their medallion flyers with those seats. It's a nice way of saying thanks for the $$Thousands I pay DL each year.
I agree the 757 is much better because it has two forward lavs, one behind first and one in front of first. This keeps the intrusions to a minimum.
One other thing that is annoying, medallion members that don't get the upgrade will often use the first class facilities like they are their own. If I don't get my upgrade, I respect the status/fare paid of those that did get an upagrade, and I use the toilets in the back like the rest of Y. Besides, it's often fun to wait at the back and talk with the FAs on their frustrations.