UALPHLCS From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 2, posted (8 years 5 months 3 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 2528 times:
As one of those affected I think, but I'm not sure that it is more than 825. In PHL Full timers with 8 years of senority are being sent to part time. I had thought that I would be one of the more senoir people affected but they have furloughed or partially furloughed (FT to PT) about a third of PHL's CS.
We were warned of this in the middle of October. At that time many began to make plans and the rumor mill started full blast.
I think UA will survive. And I know that this probably has to be done, but that knowlege dosn't make me any less cynical about it. My 5 year plan did not have me working CS for this long. I adjusted plan because of 9-11 and then the Chapter 11 filing. But the opportunities that I thought would eventually return haven't. In fact I seem to be moving backwards. So I made up my mind over a month ago that I was leaving UA. As much as it pains me to do so.
Additionally, lower management in PHL has become inflexible and ridiculous in the past few months. I know it's because of the pressures they are under from above, but they are acting out of desperation and panic and not reason. They show no desire to keep or help employees who will do a good job, instead they are willing to accept mediocrity, so long as they follow the rules to the letter and do thier weekly lessons. Bend a rule for a customer, and keep good customer relations, and your grilled.
Cyberual From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 169 posts, RR: 0 Reply 5, posted (8 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 2331 times:
in addition to the above furlough, i heard that UA wants to get rid of CG at non hubs and turn it to a line-station. Can anyone comment on that. Any other stations you guys know will be affected by this 825 furlough? According to yahoo news, its 18 stations.
Uadc8contrail From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 1782 posts, RR: 10 Reply 6, posted (8 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 2296 times:
was at the union meeting wed night in denver and what we were told was that the stations(ex hubs) that had orig cg...were now going to be merged into cs in those station....ex:oma,slc and msp.....the thing that i dont understand is most line station cg is senior......thus forcing the cs folks with lower senority to either pt or the street in extreme cases...i do not know if this is what happened to UALPHLCS but it would suck if it did happen as not to bash the rampers,,,,i know i will be flamed big time but the rampers(orig cg people)are not exactly cs oriented people...they do a great job with the bags but i do not know how they would do in a oversold or xcld flt situation.....just my 2 cents and my views are not that of any mgmt person but a iam rep cs employee...........
UALPHLCS From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 7, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 2189 times:
I heard that rumor too. That all non-hub stations would be turned into line stations. That wouldn't affect this situation. Ramp guys are pretty senior and would probably hold ramp in a combined bid.
No in PHL they are cutting Full time to part time because we are losing 4 flights in the middle of the day. We are getting increased gauge but losing frequency. Anyway with the middle of the day schedule getting very light they need more parttimers than fulltimers.
With five years I thought I was on the bubble and could have avoided this. But they actually cut all the way to 96 senority. Which is much more than anyone imagined.
UALramperORD From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 8, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 2148 times:
UALPHLCS, Do not feel bad. With almost 5 years at ORD I have been bumped down to part time last summer. Word around the camp fire says no lay-offs at ORD so far. I just gotta keep my fingers crossed. And if it does happen it will be my 3rd lay-off in 5 years. Good luck to us all.
UALPHLCS From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 9, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 2119 times:
This is my second lay-off. I wouldn't count my chickens yet They are offering those of us affected bumping rights into different cities. I'd be willing to bet some people will be bumping into the hubs.
I don't feel the least bit bad about being laid off. I feel bad that UA is losing my talents. After 9-11 I went back to school to get my degree, which I now have, and I had intended to use my knowlege at UA. Well, the opportunies to advance at UA are not coming and I have a mortgage to pay now. In 2001, I was stuck with UA becasue I really didn't have the ability to go anywhere else and get paid what I was being paid.
Now I have a degree and I can command a salary that UA can't offer. I'd be going backwards if I stayed. Tomorrow I have to put in my papaers announcing my decision. I'm taking the severence and the travel benefits and getting a better job in a more stable industry.
Don't think I didn't think about going to WN or even F9. I'm sure I could walk into a low management position there with my degree and my grades and my experience. But I just don;t want to be in this industry any more. The instablity, the Union tensions, the arguments with customers, have sucked the fun right out of it.
Still every time I hear jets I'm going to look up to see who it is.
StevenUhl777 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 10, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 2102 times:
Good luck to all of you! I hope things work out. I worked part time CG in PDX ('95) and SEA ('96) and could have applied for full-time work most likely in DEN if I wanted it. I didn't, and the summer season ended for me, and the rest is history. I for one am glad now that I never pursued career with UA or anyone else in the industry.
UALPHLCS: great job on getting that degree...just from what you said above, I'd say it will be a life-altering event for you and will allow you to reach your career goals, where sadly UA can't (and may not ever) be able to do that for you.
Uadc8contrail From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 1782 posts, RR: 10 Reply 11, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 2072 times:
dont count on ord or den as bumping cities....ordcs went back to year 2000 senority on layoffs(unsure of the month) and dencs is going back to dec 99. i put my trans back in for ord 3 weeks ago and now it looks like it will be years before i get it...
Cyberual From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 169 posts, RR: 0 Reply 13, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 1977 times:
I'm glad that you got your degree because you can really make the big move and of course, the big bucks. As much as I love UA and working with people at the airport, I likewise, feel that I cannot survive in this industry as a csr. We keep getting pay cuts every now and then. With this new cut coming in January, my pay would be back to 99 -00 level. Anyhow, I'm in the same boat as you are. Good luck with your interview.
btw, UALPHLCS and fellow UA, can you contact me using the contact link in my profile. Just want to keep in touch with the UA family.
UALPHLCS From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 14, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 1915 times:
Really the handwritting was on the wall for anyone to see back in 1999. With the introduction of Fastair, which lowers the training time for agents and makes it an easier job.
CSR's as a skill group is fast coming to an end. Replaced by unskilled, high turnover, low-wage, bag taggers.
The airlines want, and are moving to, dumbing down the CSR job until anybody can get placed in the positioin with minimal training and perform. this allows them to hire for demand in peak seasons and lay off right away. It makes the job like a mall clerk, UPS loader, McDonalds hamburger flipper. Young college students, and mom's looking to pick up some extra cash will fill these slots. They will be expendable. They will not be looking to retire from the CSR position.
Not that retireing as a CSR with 35 years was MY goal. I had only wanted to do this for 2 or 3 years before moving to management, but 9-11 effectively changed those plans. So I decided to put th eplan on hold until the company recovered and the opportunities came back. Well, those opportunities have not come back, and I'm not willing to put my plans on hold any longer.
ATWZW170 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 904 posts, RR: 3 Reply 15, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 1888 times:
Not to jump in, but the degree isn't a guarantee that a better job and higher pay is waiting for you. I have mine and I had to move from CA to WI in order to find a job that was better than 23k a year. I have found that it's very hard to still find a job with the degree...it either makes you over qualified or under qualified. Now, if you had an MBA, that will get you in the door. I'm actually thinking about going back and getting mine. Good luck though...lord knows we are in the same boat, if UA replaces ZW, they won't have a need for me.
Success is getting what you want...happiness is liking what you get
UALGSO From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 16, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 1838 times:
Any word from the union on any more station closings. Last I had heard was five more to go in Oct, but we see that didn't happen. UALPHLCS, how far have the cuts went as far as seniority in PHL. Here in GSO the folks on the relief lines have been ANP to 16 hours a week. I'm headed back to school myself and am going to try and finish up my pilot licenses. Anyways Good Luck to all fellow UA coworkers over the upcoming months ahead.
ClipperNo1 From Germany, joined May 1999, 671 posts, RR: 2 Reply 18, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 1797 times:
I know that felling a bit. I've just been sort of laid off at an airline (working besides my studies). I'm taking this as a lesson to further diversify myself and maybe (finally) move away from commercial aviation, although I'm so in love with it. But the truth is that there isn't much money to be made nowadays. I'm getting kinda bitter towards this industry. Only people pulling money out of the airline biz by now are the software providers IMO.
Best of luck to you!
As for UAL: What a nice way to 'celebrate' the upcoming 2nd anniversary of being in Chapter 11 (12/09/04)
"I really don't know one plane from the other. To me they are just marginal costs with wings."Ã¯Â¿Â½ Alfred Kahn, 1977
UALPHLCS From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 19, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 1783 times:
UALGSO, the cuts from full time to part time affected agents up to 1996 senority. Our IAM committee person is now the lowest senority full time agent.
Which leads me to another subject:
What have my Union dues paid for? Why do I need to continue paying those dues in December and January?
Not that I was ever a Union guy in the first place. But the money the agents like me have pissed down the drain to the IAM just further cements my opposition to unions. All they do is take my money and give it to politicians.
UALGSO From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 20, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 1754 times:
I have to agree with you on the IAM, especially that with all the pay cuts and cuts in hours they have not reduced monthly dues. All they seem to do is agree that what the company is doing is wrong but being in Ch. 11 can't do anything about it. I never saw myself doing anything outside the airline industry but now face this prospect. At least it hasn't gotten to USAir levels yet, in Feb. here in GSO they are becoming a mainline express station with top out wages at 12/hr.
UALramperORD From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 23, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 1602 times:
I agree with all of you when I say that the IAM has not done anything for us in the last, well......ever. Our dues keep going up and the company is making it easier for you to get let go. if you ask me we need a new union before they ruin ANOTHER airline.
LegendDC9 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 24, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 1581 times:
Airline unions in general are the problem and replacing the IAM with someone else is not going to solve anything. This is a new era, where unions have very little to say about the direction of the airline as they are more often than not guided by BK courts, ATSB loans etc'. The union is a business that has only one winner, the union itself. It collects dues off of the members and is unable to change any airline agenda. The question is, why have it at all?
UALPHLCS From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 25, posted (8 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 1480 times:
LegendDC9, I couldn't agree with you more. Just a point of clarification, the only winners in a Union are the Union leaders. By definition, and of course the way the Leadership looking at it when you say "the Union" is a winner, you are speaking of the members, they are the Union.
But I understood what you were saying and agree with you. But by clarifing what you said just points our the hypocricy of Union leadership. They walk around in 3 peice suits, sit on the Board of Directors, rake in salaries far and above the people they are representing, and claim they are one of them. It like John Kerry or GW claiming they are middle class, we all know how much money they ahve. We don't have Brooks Brothers suits.
But again I excpected nothing from the IAM and they did not disappoint nothing is exactly what I got from them.