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AA ORD MD-80 Long Hauls  
User currently offlineTan flyr From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 1920 posts, RR: 0
Posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 8117 times:

While checking AA.com for some new reservations I noticed a number of ORD-LAX round trip (and I understand to SFO also) flights scheduled with MD-80's later this winter and spring. What is the thinking on this? Taking a more modern 738 with IFE and better seats off a 4 hour flight and putting a MD-80 seems to be a bit of backward thinking and movement.

Can someone that works at AA enlighten us a bit on the reasoning for this?
I am AAdvantage Platinum and a Shareholder, and am not happy about this from either viewpoint unless there is some compelling reason I am not fathoming!

Any insights?


Thanks!

39 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineStarlionblue From Greenland, joined Feb 2004, 17172 posts, RR: 66
Reply 1, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 8022 times:

They don't have even close to as many 738s as M80s. It might simply be a question of aircraft availability. Besides the M80 has the range for it.

I've flown plenty of transcons with a stop in the AA M80s. It's really not that bad.



"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots."
User currently offlineQuickmover From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 2500 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 7989 times:

I thought I read somewhere that all of the 737-800s would be based out of MIA and ORD is all md80, 757 and wide bodys. I don't know about IFE, but without that, I'd much rather take the md80. Nothing special interior wise about a 737 except more middle seats.

User currently offlineTUGMASTER From Northern Mariana Islands, joined Jul 2004, 723 posts, RR: 9
Reply 3, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 7972 times:

Hi all,

As i understand it, ORD has been made into a Mad Dog hub as such, with all the B737-823's being moved south and based at MIA.
This i'm led to believe makes the operation run smoother and more efficient and as a shareholder (Tan flyr) you should be congratulating AA on trying to make your shares worth just a little bit more.

RGDS

Tugmaster


User currently offlineFlyingbronco05 From United States of America, joined May 2002, 3840 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 7971 times:

I thought I read somewhere that all of the 737-800s would be based out of MIA and ORD is all md80, 757 and wide bodys.

Nope. I flew a 737 from LAX-ORD on the way back from HNL.



Never Trust Your Fuel Gauge
User currently offlineSsides From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 4059 posts, RR: 21
Reply 5, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 7958 times:

I flew a 737 from LAX-ORD on the way back from HNL.

The point is that AA is preparing to remove all 738s from ORD routes. Arpey confirmed this in a recent WSJ article. Likewise, it is removing MD-80s from MIA.

This really is a good move by AA. Most business travelers prefer the MD-80 because (1) it's quieter, and (2) it has fewer middle seats. They could give a rat's ass about IFE. Hence, the MD-80s will be flying more business routes from ORD, while the 738 will be flying more leisure routes from MIA.

As a shareholder, this move looks good, because it will help streamline operations at ORD and MIA.



"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
User currently offlineJeffb From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 98 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 7921 times:

Ok, so MD 80's to ORD and 73H to MIA.. in the name of efficency. what about the big fish that is DFW? Just a mix of the two?

User currently offlineAAplatnumflier From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 7835 times:

Go to a share holders meeting and complain...I personally just avoid those flights

User currently offlineDrerx7 From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5209 posts, RR: 8
Reply 8, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 7810 times:

Well--AA is going to test renting DigiPlayers similar to Alaska on those MD80s flights. I personally avoid AA for those reasons--long ass flight on an MD80 w/o IFE vs. IFE on a 737NG/320/757/widebody for the same price. No contest.


Third Coast born, means I'm Texas raised
User currently offlineKbmiflyer From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 134 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 7783 times:

Ok, so MD 80's to ORD and 73H to MIA.. in the name of efficency. what about the big fish that is DFW? Just a mix of the two?

For the most part you are right. Looking at AA's schedule for May, ORD gets no 738's at all. MIA gets no MD-80's at all (if you are wondering, all ORD - MIA flights are 757's).

DFW will have fewer 738's, but still use them on flights to LGA and LAX and a few other places.


User currently offlineSsides From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 4059 posts, RR: 21
Reply 10, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 7745 times:

Given DFW's size, there isn't a feasible way to completely eliminate an aircraft type from its flight banks.

I'm surprised at how many people avoid MD-80s simply because it has no IFE. Given the plane's range, it can't make a flight of much more than 3-4 hours. You can't last that long without a movie?



"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
User currently offlineJacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 59
Reply 11, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 7729 times:

from ORD-SFO route, if I can recall, they will add an extra MD-80 flight (would need to check up on it though), I was talking to an AA pilot yesterday at ORD, and there will be no more 738's out of ORD, they will be moved to MIA,DFW, or LAX...I remember this because she stated she would either have to retrain or move and she did not want to move to either cities, or LAX..

I was told it was for "simplicity".....

personally, though the MD-80's dont have IFE, I use my laptop to watch my movies, and I like the way the MD-80's fly anyway....

if they keep the same amount of flights with the MD-80's as they do with the 738's, then there will be a small dropoff in the amount of available seats.

they will still keep the 763 for the afternoon flight



"Up the Irons!"
User currently offlineSllevin From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 3376 posts, RR: 6
Reply 12, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 7704 times:

As others have said, as a business traveler, the last thing I worry about is IFE. Even if it's satellite feed...heck, I have digital TV at home, and it's really 500 channels of nothing -- it's only the Tivo that makes it useful.

The upside of the MD-80 is that there are fewer middle seats. As much as I like the 737 and A320's for wider seats up front, if I flew an airline where I expected to fly most domestic legs in coach, I'd rather be on an MD-80.

Steve


User currently offlineBa319-131 From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 8588 posts, RR: 54
Reply 13, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 7712 times:
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Ssides said:-

I'm surprised at how many people avoid MD-80s simply because it has no IFE. Given the plane's range, it can't make a flight of much more than 3-4 hours. You can't last that long without a movie?

Totally right,what is it with IFE? Don't people know how to read anymore?

I've flown AA ORD>LAX on an MD-80 before,nice flight.

On my last 4 longhaul flights, HEL>PEK,PEK>HEL,LGW>PHL & PHL>LGW I never even switched on the PTV's,my laptop and a good book all the way.






111,732,3,4,5,7,8,BBJ,741,742,743,744,752,762,763,764,772,77L,773,77W,L15,D10,30,40,AB3,AB6,A312.313,319,320,321,332,333
User currently offlineD950 From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 493 posts, RR: 2
Reply 14, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 7702 times:

Seems like these would have been perfect routes for the MD90's (which had excellent IFE) that AA gave back and are sitting in the desert. Maybe they could lease them back cheap!!


Resting on your laurels is a synonym for flirting with disaster
User currently offlineSsides From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 4059 posts, RR: 21
Reply 15, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 7693 times:

On my last 4 longhaul flights, HEL>PEK,PEK>HEL,LGW>PHL & PHL>LGW I never even switched on the PTV's,my laptop and a good book all the way.

Right on! What is it with kids these days? Granted, when I'm flying DFW-LGW or DFW-FRA, I like having a movie to watch in my seat. But when I'm making a short hop to DCA or ORD, I could care less -- give me a magazine or a little work to do, or I'll just take a nap!

IFE is great on long-haul flights, but judging an airline based on its domestic entertainment options is a bit infantile, if you ask me.



"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
User currently offlineStarlionblue From Greenland, joined Feb 2004, 17172 posts, RR: 66
Reply 16, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 7670 times:

IFE for me = My laptop. 6-7 hours of battery life while watching the movies I want to watch, not the ones chose by the airline, on a 14.1" monitor with better sound.


"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots."
User currently offlineDrerx7 From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5209 posts, RR: 8
Reply 17, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 7643 times:

Like I said before--if for the SAME COST IFE vs. no IFE MD80s the choice is made. Its not like AA has an exceptional product anyway. Either way its a moot point--given my location there are other carriers that service me better anyway (carriers with which I'm a frequent flyer). If I lived in Dallas or Chicago then I probably would fly on AA MD80s regardless of IFE--but change planes at DFW or ORD for no IFE and mediocre service--I'll leave that to you guys.

[Edited 2005-01-03 23:01:39]


Third Coast born, means I'm Texas raised
User currently offlineDeltAirlines From United States of America, joined May 1999, 8913 posts, RR: 12
Reply 18, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 7616 times:

Put me in the "I don't care about IFE" camp. I can't honestly remember the last time I used an airline's IFE...it had to be sometime in the 1990s though. I've got a DVD player on my laptop, plus a few games, that can keep me occupied for much time. And I also love to read the newspaper and magazines on flights (if you consider reading the inflight magazine IFE provided by the airline, then I do read that, but that's it). Plus, quite frequently, I have work to do on planes, and the plane is a quite convinient place to do it.

Jeff


User currently offlineMoman From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 1054 posts, RR: 4
Reply 19, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 7556 times:

People don't know how to entertain themselves anymore. I prefer the MD80 because it is quiet (as noted above), is comfortable (as noted above), and I don't have any IFE distracting me. I also believe that IFE caters to the crowd that I want to avoid (kids, families).

I'd prefer to fly a MD80 and sit in 9A cross country as any other jet. Sounds like AA is doing a very smart thing here. Now if they would only buy some new 717s....(how about a 717-300!  Smile)

Moman

[Edited 2005-01-03 23:32:39]


AA Platinum Member - American Airlines Forever
User currently offlineTan flyr From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 1920 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 7544 times:

OK Guys..thanks for the insight. Simplicity for the sake of being more efficient makes great sense to me as a shareholder. Concentrate spare parts, crews, etc of almost all one type at one major hub if possible.

My remarks about IFE stemmed more from comments made here by many of the other members over time the last few years.."Oh, I avoid MD-80's (or whatever aircraft or airline)because they have no IFE". My thought was that AA might be driving customers to the competition. AA needs every pax it can put into a seat.

As for myself, as I have stated on this forum in the past, I visit the used bookstore near me and have a few used paperbacks to read stashed in my briefcase. I enjoy the time w/o TV.
I agree with many of you, on a 3-4 hr flight I could care less about IFE.

I use the DFW-FAT nonstops as often as I can, however on several of these trips schedule requirements ( and destinations) at both ends look to require me to use a connection via ORD & LAX to & from FAT.

Thanks tho on the insight about simplicity..guess the New Years wine has not totally worn off!LOL!

Best to all in 2005 ..and hopefully all carries return to profitability!


User currently offlineAASTEW From Dominican Republic, joined Oct 2001, 447 posts, RR: 1
Reply 21, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 7446 times:

Tan Flyer,

Your basically saying carriers with no IFE lose out compared to those with IFE. Why is FL and WN so successful against the carriers with IFE on the same route? People in this country just care about price! They don't care about food, movies, or airplane.

Yes passengers enjoy IFE, but trust me that's not the deciding factor when choosing a flight for the US traveller. Price is!

Also, don't get on NWA domestically, IFE is non existent. But good ole NWA is holding it's own.


User currently offlineAa61hvy From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 13977 posts, RR: 57
Reply 22, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 7435 times:

For a side reference I'm on AA to Cabo in March from ORD. 1,807mi 4hrs 45 mins. I'm not looking forward to that.. in an MD80


Go big or go home
User currently offlineANCFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 7391 times:

Could care less about IFE . . . Toshiba laptop is my IFE. And/or a decent novel. Only 'real' downtime is in the air. Less middle seats (none in "F"  Smile/happy/getting dizzy) and very quiet up front.

Hey, as an aside . . . remember the thread about removing the nasty drooled on pillows form AAs MD80s . . . because, what the hell, they're all short/medium haul right!?

Haa - saw that one coming . . .


User currently offlineJacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 59
Reply 24, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 7331 times:

Aa61hvy.....the ORD-SFO flight is 1896nm, and ORD-SJC is 1829nm (which is the plane AA uses right now) and those are not a problem at all for the MD-80's, so I wouldn't be too concerned about your flight


"Up the Irons!"
25 Scott4AA : It is interesting to note the large percentage of M80 flights AA will have out of ORD. Here is a rough breakdown of mainline departures for Apr 4 2005
26 September11 : M80 is like a business jet, for the most part
27 Ckfred : First, I don't have a laptop, and I don't want one. I still like to write on legal pads. Second, I like having audio to drown out the engines. I do br
28 RoseFlyer : While I don't mind shorter flights without IFE, I am the type of person that cannot just read for 4+ hours. It is nice to have multiple distractions o
29 Post contains images DfwRevolution : I'm an AMR shareholder, and I'm getting fed up with all of these cost cuts., What they streamline their opperations and that's something to object to
30 Aa777jr : touche DFWRevolution, all points well made. AA is reorganizing its hardware rightly so. They save a ton of money using majority of 738 at MIA and S80
31 AAR90 : I thought I read somewhere that all of the 737-800s would be based out of MIA... Uh...nope. SFO and ORD 738 crew bases are being closed and 738 flight
32 Aa777jr : Current estimates are running about $200 MILLION PER YEAR there's your $$$ for that 7E7 order! AA777jr
33 Qqflyboy : The 738 galley in first class is not bigger, in fact, it is smaller then the MD-80 galley. Each galley holds two half carts and three full carts, but
34 Ssides : In other words, make the product more appealing, so that AA can get more traffic and revenue. They've tried this, and the flying public has repeatedly
35 Drerx7 : Well use of the digiplayers will provide a cost effective way to add IFE to MD80s--it also shows that corporate brass at AA recognize that there is po
36 Gigneil : The reality is that AA is not a strong competitor to UA on those routes out of ORD. UA hands AA their ass on the SFO, LAX routes and a lot of the othe
37 RoseFlyer : Ssides, I fully agree that AA will not be able to charge a premium for offering IFE, but when the fares are the same price, it will help bring more pa
38 Jsnww81 : The MD80 really doesn't deserve all the vilification it's getting on this thread. Although a lot of passengers may be turned off by the "long thin tub
39 Planespotting : for $300 you can purchase an iPod, and put all of your music on that. put it in your pocket and the F/A will never know it's on from push back to roll
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