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Why Does UA Use 2-5-2 Seating?  
User currently offlineSwisskloten From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 7437 times:

Can someone explain this for me? It seems that, in economy, it might help to keep as few seats abreast in one section as possible but why would United put its seats in a 2-5-2 arrangement on a 777-200? Isn't 3-3-3 safer and more convenient because the people in the middle row wouldn't have to trip over so many seats to get out? I wouldn't be surprised if the poor person in the middle row can't even go to the lavatory because there are too many people to wake up and move in the middle of the night.

62 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineMaitner777 From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 14 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 7316 times:

I was wondering the exact same thing the other day...


[Edited 2005-01-05 19:39:15]

User currently offlineStarlionblue From Greenland, joined Feb 2004, 16991 posts, RR: 67
Reply 2, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 7312 times:

This has been discussed in previous threads.

Your argument about the middle seat is fallacious. With 3-3-3 there are two prisoners per row who have to get past 2 people to get to the aisle (at the windows). With 2-5-2 there is only one (in the middle).

Also with 2-5-2 the prisoner seats don't get filled up until you're at quite high loads, and most will be taken by families where three or more want to sit togehter.


Having flown both variants several times, I say give me 2-5-2 over 3-3-3 any day.



"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots."
User currently offlineFeroze From India, joined Dec 2004, 794 posts, RR: 3
Reply 3, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 7310 times:

Good question! On my first trip to the US in 2000, I was travelling LHR-SFO and guess where I was sitting. Yep, in the middle of 5 seats. Pure torture. At the reservations office in SFO I was told that most airlines configured them like that... BA being an anomoly. However, I have found that UA is the odd one out. Maybe not...

Feroze


User currently offlineNorthStarDC4M From Canada, joined Apr 2000, 2990 posts, RR: 37
Reply 4, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 7298 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
CHAT OPERATOR

actually 3-3-3 would be MORE DANGEROUS to use your example because 2 people per row would have to pass 2 seats to get out rather than 1 on 2-5-2.

And convinience... welll... since when do airlines give a dang there, and same problem anyways...



Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.
User currently offlineNorthStarDC4M From Canada, joined Apr 2000, 2990 posts, RR: 37
Reply 5, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 7286 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
CHAT OPERATOR

ok that was spooky... from 0 replies to 4 in 30 seconds!


Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.
User currently offlineStarlionblue From Greenland, joined Feb 2004, 16991 posts, RR: 67
Reply 6, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 7263 times:

AA: 2-5-2
AF: 3-3-3
CO: 3-3-3
DL: 3-3-3
BA: 3-3-3
UA: 2-5-2
CX: 3-3-3
SQ: 3-3-3
KL: 3-3-3

The likelihood of you ending up a prisoner on a plane with 3-3-3 is twice as high as on a plane with 2-5-2, although granted the 3-3-3 prisoners do get the window, which doesn't help if you really need to go...  Big grin

[Edited 2005-01-05 19:44:02]


"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots."
User currently offlineFeroze From India, joined Dec 2004, 794 posts, RR: 3
Reply 7, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 7229 times:

It wasn't that fact that I had to climb over 2 people, but that I felt really hemmed in with shoulders and legs everywhere. Mind you, the FAs were pretty decent with the booze at 9am LT and sleep did occur. It had been a long night....! (Well, that's my excuse and I'm sticking to it!)

Feroze


User currently offlineStarlionblue From Greenland, joined Feb 2004, 16991 posts, RR: 67
Reply 8, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 7213 times:

I love 2-5-2. I can get my window and still only have to step over one complete stranger. If I'm traveling with someone, we get 2 seats just for us. If you have a larger family/group, then the middle won't be a problem since the people you are stepping over aren't complete strangers...


"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots."
User currently offlineSsides From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 4059 posts, RR: 21
Reply 9, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 7195 times:

I've flown AA's 777s several times, usually with companions, and I LOVE the 2-5-2 layout. When traveling with my wife, we can almost always get two seats by ourselves, and not have to worry about anyone bothering us getting up, or us bothering anyone else. It's definitely more convenient. The middle seat in the "5" section is always the last filled, so there is much less hassle for everyone involved.

An added bonus: with Gold status, we can request the exit/bulkhead seats at the front of the rear coach section, which means virtually unlimited legroom. No wonder I love AA!



"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
User currently offlineOrd From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 1381 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 7193 times:

Delta only has a few 777s outfitted 3-3-3. Most of their 777s are 2-5-2. They were all supposed to go 3-3-3 but I don't know when that will happen.

User currently offlineFeroze From India, joined Dec 2004, 794 posts, RR: 3
Reply 11, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 7171 times:

It must have been my lucky day then! I remember checking in 2.5 hrs before departure as well. There were a lot of connecting pax though. The only saving grace was that my bags were coming round the carousel as I got there.

Feroze


User currently offlineDrerx7 From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5153 posts, RR: 8
Reply 12, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 7171 times:

3-3-3 gives a more spacious look to the cabin. Either or is fine for me--I don't have a problem with the 3-3-3 layout or 2-5-2. Didn't BA or another 777 carrier habve 3-4-2?


Third Coast born, means I'm Texas raised
User currently offlineBananaboy From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2004, 1573 posts, RR: 23
Reply 13, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 7049 times:

Someone from UA once told me it also had to do with travelling families....
Mum, Dad and 2 kids could sit together.


Mark



All my life, I've been kissing, your top lip 'cause your bottom one's missing
User currently offlineSenorbob From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2003, 25 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 6982 times:

It's Egyptair that uses 2-4-3 on their 777's. In my view that's the best layout for passengers, as it seems to be the best of all worlds.

This used to be a common configuration - standard in the early 747's.


User currently offlineStarlionblue From Greenland, joined Feb 2004, 16991 posts, RR: 67
Reply 15, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 6968 times:

It's Egyptair that uses 2-4-3 on their 777's. In my view that's the best layout for passengers, as it seems to be the best of all worlds.

This used to be a common configuration - standard in the early 747's.


Before they figured out that one more seat per row meant a lot of $$$  Big grin



"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots."
User currently offlineSNATH From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 3238 posts, RR: 22
Reply 16, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 6913 times:

I violently agree with what Starlionblue said.

I will take 2-5-2 over 3-3-3 any day (in the same way I will take any 2-X-2 config over a 3-X-3
config any day; and I hope that noone actually goes for that stupid 3-2-3 config in the 7E7 that
Boeing suggested). I like having a window seat with only one person between me and
the aisle, not two.

In fact, I've always wondered the exact opposite. Why any airline bothers with a 3-3-3
config on the B777. I'm sure it's due to marketing (no "middle seat", aren't we great?).
Instead, they introduce two "prisoner" seats...

Tony



Nikon: we don't want more pixels, we want better pixels.
User currently offlineGigneil From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 16347 posts, RR: 85
Reply 17, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 6866 times:

I absolutely hate 3-3-3. I am very pleased United has decided to stick with it.

N


User currently offlineDca727fan From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 3 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 6841 times:

Indeed.

http://www.egyptair.com.eg/docs/inside/insideaircraft.htm


User currently offlineMlsrar From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 1417 posts, RR: 8
Reply 19, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 6831 times:

At least I don't feel entirely in the minority about enjoying the 2-5-2 layout.

I wish more carriers would adopt the standard, as I feel the opposite of most in that the 2-5-2 seems to feel more spacious and segregated from other groups of passengers.



I mean, for the right price I’ll fight a lion. - Mike Tyson
User currently offlineEmiratesA345 From Canada, joined Jun 2003, 2123 posts, RR: 9
Reply 20, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 6792 times:

I would think it's definately Emirates Airlines 3-4-3 configuration!


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In all seriousness, although I've never flown on a 777, I would imagine that 2-5-2 would be the most comfortable and safe configuration. This way, not only does only one person have to climb over two seats to get out, but he or she has the option of climbing over the two seats to the left, or two seats to the right.

Mark



You and I were meant to fly, Air Canada!
User currently offlineFinnWings From Finland, joined Oct 2003, 640 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 6760 times:

I personally hate 3-3-3 seating configuration as well... If you are traveling with someone there is always one stranger just next to you no matter where you are seated. 2-5-2 is very comfortable, but this will cause a little bit problems as in the middle overhead bins are farther away from the aisle. I have witnessed sometimes quite an interesting acrobatic maneuvers from passengers as they have tried to reach those bins better.

The best seating configuration is no doubt 3-4-2... It will give more different seating arrangement options for everyone!

Best Regards,
FinnWings


User currently offlineCarpethead From Japan, joined Aug 2004, 2940 posts, RR: 3
Reply 22, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 6649 times:

I prefer the 2-5-2 over the 3-3-3.
Ex-JAS 772s are also 2-5-2 but are being converted to JL's standard 3-3-3.
When sitting in a 3-seat window seat, I have to climb over or request two people to get up, therefore I never sit in the window seat for long-haul travel anymore, if an aircraft has this configuration.
I have had the pleasure of sitting in the middle of the 2-5-2, but that was for a less than one hour flight from HND-ITM. It wasn't too bad, but I wouldn't want to do it over 10 hours.


User currently offlineSsides From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 4059 posts, RR: 21
Reply 23, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 6625 times:

It's Egyptair that uses 2-4-3 on their 777's. In my view that's the best layout for passengers, as it seems to be the best of all worlds.

This used to be a common configuration - standard in the early 747's.


Before they figured out that one more seat per row meant a lot of $$$


2-4-3 won't result in lost revenue ... it would be no different from 2-5-2 or 3-3-3. There would still be 9 seats in a standard row.



"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
User currently offlinePA110 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1995 posts, RR: 24
Reply 24, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 6615 times:
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KLM operates their MD11 with a 3-4-2 configuration. Does anyone know why they didn't keep the same for the 777?


It's been swell, but the swelling has gone down.
25 Nrt1011 : Please add ANA and Thai to the airlines that use the horrid 3-3-3 configuration. I fly the ANA 777 pretty much every week NRT-PVG-NRT as well as NRT-H
26 MakeMinesLax : Someone from UA once told me it also had to do with travelling families.... Mum, Dad and 2 kids could sit together. That was certainly the case for us
27 Starlionblue : It's Egyptair that uses 2-4-3 on their 777's. In my view that's the best layout for passengers, as it seems to be the best of all worlds. This used to
28 Sfo212 : Keep the 2-5-2 seating alive!!!!! That is why I hate the 747 seating. 3-4-3. Yuck! As someone who loves to look out the window, I hate crawling over t
29 Trex8 : this topic has been covered in the Tech section not that long ago and 1 point brought up is that with the 2-5-2, if you are standing in the aisle, it
30 N867bx : Yes, 2-5-2 looks yucky at first until you think about it. I do agree 2-4-3 or 3-4-2 is best. Speaking of the 747, has anyone ever put 11 abreast in on
31 Starlionblue : this topic has been covered in the Tech section not that long ago and 1 point brought up is that with the 2-5-2, if you are standing in the aisle, it
32 Annoyedfa : 3x3x3 is so much better then 2x5x2... Also makes the cabin feel wider.
33 KDTWFlyer : 2-5-2 is not a problem if you aren't in the middle of 5 section... I was once in a NW D10 from DTW-LGW and it was managable believe it or not. 2-5-2 i
34 ScandinA340 : Spare a thought for Lauda Air/Austrian Airlines... Their Y class features both 3-3-3 and 3-4-3 on their 777s. Just got back from a SYD-KUL-SYD flight,
35 Sllevin : I much prefer 2-5-2. The number of cases where 3-3-3 works out better is very, very small. Steve
36 6thfreedom : MH has a 2-5-2 config on it's B772's. as for EK, i think the 3-4-3 config is only on the B773's, while the B772's have a 3-3-3 config. TG's MD11's als
37 StevenUhl777 : IIRC, UA had this same config. on the DC10s as well, and the 742's. I think maybe even the 767's as well. Since the 772 is the replacement for the -10
38 BIGBlack : Seems it would be great for families
39 Swisskloten : Thanks for the input but please try to not get overexcited. I asked because, remember, you can't always get a seat on the sides where there will be on
40 Mtkinf : I fly the Untied 777's often, typically on short flights between DEN and ORD. I must say that if I'm traveling with my wife or even traveling alone, t
41 Kurt : I sat in the "middle-middle" a few years ago on a UA 777 FRA-ORD - and liked it! It was great since my friend was in the aisle, then there was an empt
42 Ratypus : 2-5-2 is actually better - not on the very rare occasions where the lone traveller gets the middle of the 5 seats, but great otherwise - if you're tra
43 Post contains images NumberTwelve : Let's turn the question around: why do so many airlines use 3-3-3 in the T7? I remember LH's DC 10, they also had 2-5-2 in Eco and it was really great
44 Ariis : Hi there, I agree that for people who travel in small groups (say 2 to 5 persons) it can be good to have 2-5-2. For people who travel alone (like myse
45 Frontiers4ever : Wont somebody just think of the children! -Frontiers4ever my 5 cents
46 Geo772 : I think I might be able to somewhat explain the use of 3-3-3 on the 777. Most IFE systems have seat boxes which serve either 2 or 3 seats. On a 3-3-3
47 NumberTwelve : @Geo - ok, every kilo counts . But if there is no PVT and TV is needed, why not thinking about LH's solution of a big beamer in the center of each cab
48 Post contains links and images AirGabon : What about Air Austral (UU) B772, are they with a 3-3-3 arrangement or 2-5-2 configuration? (I will fly with them next month from CDG to RUN). View La
49 Jamotcx : I have to say give me 2-5-2 any day over 3-3-3. Being stuck in the middle of the 5 is just the same as being against a window. you have the same numbe
50 Post contains links Flykal : AirGabon... A quick flick through the Air Austral website indicates that their 777 config is actually 3-4-3 (same as EK).. This is except for the last
51 AirGabon : Thanks a lot Flykal! It helps me a lot. Happy new year !!
52 Goomba : 2-5-2 is the only way to go. Bar none. The 3-3-3 config stinks...on any airline. PS - If you want the best flight to Europe - book on AA. Their 777's
53 RJ111 : 2-4-3 gives you the best of both worlds. But it looks awkward.
54 VS045 : I once flew on a Sabena (Birdy Airlines operated) MD-11 to JNB from BRU and was assigned the middle seat in a section of 5. Luckily there was only one
55 The777Man : For everyone that prefers 2-5-2, when you have sat in the center seat in the 5 section for 10+ hours, let's have another discussion............ Of cou
56 NumberTwelve : 777Man: how many seats in a row have 2 seats between themselves and the aisle a) in a 2-5-2 configuration b) in a 3-3-3 configuration? And by the way:
57 The777Man : I was discussing the middle seat and not other seats. Most people who sit in the window seat prefer that seat; most people who sit in a center seat do
58 Post contains images NumberTwelve : 777Man: if you have to sit in the middle, it's not nice (1 seat), if you sit at the window or at the aisle seat close to it, it's great (4 seats). It'
59 Rj111 : Getting the middle seat is underrated, you dont have to get out of your seat when somebody else wants to go to the toilet, unlike the person at the ai
60 Post contains images Starlionblue : However, if you are not lucky and do not manage to get the seat you want, I guess ending up in the middle seat of 5 people bench can be a real pain (
61 JetBlue : I have a question regarding the different configurations, especially airlines like Delta who have changed some of their planes. How does that work in
62 Post contains images Scbriml : I believe Boeing actually recommends the 3-3-3 config (no, I don't have a link). The argument being, the flight can be 66% full before you have to sea
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