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DFW Airport Offers Delta's Abandoned Gates For Fre  
User currently offlineJonnyGT From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 242 posts, RR: 1
Posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 5364 times:

And 22 million bucks in incentives to whatever airlines fills the gates that Delta has now left behind at DFW, but there is a catch. It expires in two weeks. Do you guys think any airline will step up to the plate?

36 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineFlyguyclt From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 537 posts, RR: 8
Reply 1, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 5306 times:

Just a guess here. What if ? Southwest gave ATA some money, ATA moved the operation from MDW to DFW and let the code share begin?


Safe Flying  Smile



Florida Express, Braniff II and ......
User currently offlineSHUPirate1 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3670 posts, RR: 17
Reply 2, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 5304 times:

Another catch is that the incoming airline must take at least ten of the gates.


Burma's constitutional referendum options: A. Yes, B. Go to Insein Prison!
User currently offlineFlyguyclt From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 537 posts, RR: 8
Reply 3, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 5296 times:

Paging Braniff Part IV.

HA HA HA

NOT !



Florida Express, Braniff II and ......
User currently offlineBENNETT123 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 7382 posts, RR: 3
Reply 4, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 5218 times:


Sounds like an ideal opening for a new or existing LCC.


User currently offlineEi2ksea From Ireland, joined Jul 2004, 576 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 5219 times:

Could AirTran do it? Maybe link some of the dots on the existing network from DFW with maybe MCI, STL, HOU, MSY, MDW and so on...

It would be a huge and sudden increase but presumably there is some local demand to be shored up after the DL exit...probably too risky i suppose...

Just thinking aloud!...

[Edited 2005-01-07 14:10:18]

[Edited 2005-01-07 14:10:47]

[Edited 2005-01-07 14:11:32]


Next Flight: BOS-SFO (B6), OAK-KOA (AK), KOA-OGG (YV), OGG-HNL (HA), HNL-ATL-BOS (DL)
User currently offlineEjmmsu From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 1692 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 5072 times:

I think that if Airtran did come to DFW, they should go to destinations outside the wright ammendemnt that currently have a high fare monopoly. SEA, MDW, SFO, SAN, PHX, DEN, STL, BOS, LGA, DCA, CLE, CVG, CLT, MEM and espescially BNA.

DFW-BNA is an outragously priced market. It is often near $500 with 21 day advance purchase! Also, I think the walkup fare is $1285.

Airtran needs a powerful add campaign explaining that AA will match their fares, and what will happen if pax continue to use AA with the lower fares. Airtran will be forced to leave, and fares will go back up. They also need a powerful campaign to get fliers into their frequent flyer program. Maybe double or triple miles for the first few months would do the trick. DFW pax are fed up with the wright ammendment, fed up with high fares, and thirsting for someone to come in and take on AA.



"If the facts do not conform to the theory, they will have to be disposed of"
User currently offlineDayflyer From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 3807 posts, RR: 3
Reply 7, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 5034 times:

I think Airtran or Frontier would be good choices.

I would like for Airtran to do it. They have a presence already and with all the new aircraft they are taking, they could make a pretty good sized dent in AA's dominance there. I really think they could have a go of it. They are better established in the East than America West or Frontier.

I do think they would have to slowly develop it though. If they did it too quick AA would cut them off at the knees.



One Nation Under God
User currently offlineStlgph From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 9266 posts, RR: 25
Reply 8, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 4994 times:

It'd be great to see ATA jump on this opportunity with Southwest's backing.


Eternal darkness we all should dread. It's hard to party when you're dead.
User currently offlineFlashmeister From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 2900 posts, RR: 6
Reply 9, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 4953 times:
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No LCC has the excess capacity necessary to jumpstart 10 gates at DFW. That part of DFW's offer is a bit unreasonable, in my view. F9 won't do it because they got bit at LAX. FL might do it, but they're not exactly firing on all cylinders lately, so will they do it well? No one knows.

I think that DFW's dreaming if they expect some LCC to all-of-the-sudden divert 10 gates worth of traffic to Dallas overnight. Just too much!


User currently offlineFlairport From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 4944 times:

Hell, I think that FL should just take up the gates now!
Figure if FL takes 10...CO has like 3, NW probably 3, Delta would have 3 or 4...then AM/Sun Country/Champion with one for all 3. That's 20...Are E22-E30 RJ gates or can any plane use them?

If E22-E30 can't be used by regular jets, it's 20/28! So, B6 and F9 could come in there maybe...maybe they could split the 10 gates...B6 using 2 sattelite gates for their E190s.
So, actually adding E22-E30 back in...we have
10 for FL
3 for CO
3 for NW
4 for DL
1 for others
5 for F9
5 for B6
-------
31 total/38...not too bad...AA could snatch up the other 7


User currently offlineCkfred From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 5155 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 4927 times:

I don't see WN doing this. They seem more interested in getting the Wright Amendment repealed and expanding at DAL.

User currently offlineAs739x From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6079 posts, RR: 24
Reply 12, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 4923 times:

AirTran,Frontier, heck no one has the a/c to take up something like this. This is a strech for a big boys. Not that these LCC these days are not big boys. I don't think anyone is going to bite in my opinion.


ASSFO



"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
User currently offlineFlashmeister From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 2900 posts, RR: 6
Reply 13, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 4862 times:
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You and I are exactly on the same page, As739x...

10 gates is way too big of a commitment for just about anyone. For comparison:

- F9 has 16 gates in DEN
- FL has 22 gates at ATL
- AS/QX has 20 gates at PDX and 38 gates at SEA
- B6 has 13 (I think?) gates at JFK
- WN has 11 gates at OAK, 14 at DAL, 12 at LAX, and 10 at BNA

If DFW has the expectation that anyone can just 'drop-in' an operation that even comes close to half of F9 at DEN or all of WN at BNA, at the drop of a hat, they're on some serious dope. In most cases, that's something like 70+ flights a day, right out of the chute.

That just doesn't happen.


User currently offlineStirling From Italy, joined Jun 2004, 3943 posts, RR: 22
Reply 14, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 4794 times:

I like the idea of WN giving TZ a blank check to shift their operations to DFW, unfortunately it will never happen. The airport can sure use the competition. But I can't help to think that when the day comes that AA and WN meet head to head in battle, (it will ultimately have to happen one day) it will be with WN's own metal.

I am confused,
I think that if Airtran did come to DFW, they should go to destinations outside the wright ammendemnt that currently have a high fare monopoly. SEA, MDW, SFO, SAN, PHX, DEN, STL, BOS, LGA, DCA, CLE, CVG, CLT, MEM and espescially BNA.
I thought airTran already served DFW? to Atlanta and Orlando. No?

What about VirginAmerica?
DFW seems to me better geographically positioned than SFO, don't cha think?
I know Virgin's heart seems to be stuck on San Francisco, (no pun intended) but how much really do we know about this unseen entrant?

The imminent vacancies at DFW were a "made in heaven" gift for airTran. Whether or not they are able to respond to the opportunity is another question. OK, so they're aren't a lot of 717s and 73Gs out there on the open market, there's gotta be some other 737 variants and MDs out there, enough available on short-term lease, until the assembly line can start cranking out what they want.
DFW is screaming for airTran. Will they hear? Will they be able to get the lenders to agree? It'll be darn interesting to watch unfold.






Delete this User
User currently offlineN757kw From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 435 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 4707 times:

Forget free, just pay for the gates you need. Plus DFW could at least make some money on the empty gates. Not a bad idea though, but the takers may be few and far between.

Off course AA could just snap those 10 free gates up in a heart beat.

N757KW



"What we've got here, is failure to communicate." from Cool Hand Luke
User currently offlineJcs17 From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 8065 posts, RR: 39
Reply 16, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 4662 times:

DFW would probably have a better chance of earning back the money if they tied that obnoxious c%#% Laura Miller (Dallas mayor), to a out-of-service DL ticket kiosk and allowed airport patrons one punch for a dollar.


America's chickens are coming home to rooooost!
User currently offlineNomorerjs From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 439 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 4612 times:

Sign me up for the first 10 punches on that b----!

User currently offlineEjmmsu From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 1692 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 4573 times:

I thought airTran already served DFW? to Atlanta and Orlando. No?


I was loosly meaning airtran should significantly increase thier presence. They also fly to LAX from DFW.



"If the facts do not conform to the theory, they will have to be disposed of"
User currently offlineOPNLguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 4527 times:

>>>DFW-BNA is an outragously priced market. It is often near $500 with 21 day advance purchase! Also, I think the walkup fare is $1285.

With American announcing that they're adopting Delta's fare philosophy, that may shortly no longer be the case...


User currently offlineOB1504 From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 3292 posts, RR: 9
Reply 20, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 4510 times:

OK, so they're aren't a lot of 717s and 73Gs out there on the open market, there's gotta be some other 737 variants and MDs out there, enough available on short-term lease, until the assembly line can start cranking out what they want.

Maybe they'll get Ryan International to fly some routes out of DFW until AirTran can get the A/C necessary for the additional services?


User currently offlineMmcdow From United States of America, joined Oct 1999, 43 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (9 years 6 months 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 3478 times:

I typed this up to start a new thread but I decided to tag onto this one. Forgive me for repeating what has already been stated.

With last week’s announcement of DFW’s incentives to get a LLC to move into Terminal E, there is a lot of speculation as to who will take the bait. Everyone in the media seems to think it is a last ditch effort on the part of DFW to get Southwest over here (or ammo against WN in the fight to uphold the Wright Amendment according to a commentary in yesterday’s Ft. Worth Star Telegram). In any case the restrictions placed by the airport to receive the incentives limit who can provide service just because of the size of the operation required, a minimum of 10 gates and 70% of seats to new destinations. Whoever it is, Marketing seems to think they won’t have any problems with the January 21st deadline for airlines to express interest, which makes me think they’ve already got someone on the hook.

One point that I overlooked in the announcement is that American will be adding 4 new gates in Terminal B. So which gates will they be using? Unless they take back some of their Eagle gates the obvious choice is the 4 Air Tran gates next to Eagle. This puts Air Tran back in E? Air Tran also lost the bid for the Midway gates, which frees up a lot of capital to expand elsewhere. My personal thought is they are an outside candidate but they don’t have the clout in this area to compete with AA. I could be wrong though.

Last night I was talking to a guy that works for ASA who is staying to the very end and he stated there has been a lot of activity going on in Terminal E. He said he saw representatives from Jet Blue out there last week just before the announcement and a lot contractors carrying around drawings. If my memory is correct, just last week Jet Blue stated they were not interested in coming to DFW any time soon. Where they just seeing what they were passing up?

Frankly Southwest is the best candidate to take it to AA but I will believe it when I see it. They’ve got a lot other expansions going on and DFW may have burned that bridge when they accused WN of sabotaging other LLC’s in coming out here. Who knows what they are really thinking though.

In any case DFW needs another large carrier out here and they know it. Right now American and Eagle have close to 75% of the market share and Delta hasn’t left yet. I assume that is the reason for large incentive package proposed by the airport instead of going after 10 niche airlines to fill E.

Matt McDowell


User currently offlineQuickmover From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 2490 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (9 years 6 months 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 3454 times:

When does Delta pull down at DFW or have they already?

User currently offlineKkfla737 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 1033 posts, RR: 1
Reply 23, posted (9 years 6 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 3426 times:

When does Delta pull down at DFW or have they already?

January 31st







User currently offlineAirStatDFW From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 374 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (9 years 6 months 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 3315 times:

I thought airTran already served DFW? to Atlanta and Orlando. No?

AirTran flies to ATL, MCO, BWI, LAS, LAX, FLL.

If E22-E30 can't be used by regular jets, it's 20/28!

The satellite gates can be used by aircraft other than RJ's. They have to re-attach Jet bridges to the building. You can see the gates numbers on the doors but no jet bridges attached.

AirStatDFW




25 Post contains images ATLhomeCMH : Forget WN, and look out...FL is movin on in!
26 Quickmover : Have you heard something or is this a guess?
27 Post contains links RogueTrader : DFW-BNA is an outrageously priced market. It is often near $500 with 21 day advance purchase! Also, I think the walkup fare is $1285. With American an
28 ChrisNH : I agree that DFW's main emphasis is to keep the incumbent happy, and that's AA. There's no secret in that. The thinly-veiled intimacy between Ft. Wort
29 N839mh : Rogue Trader, you are absolutely correct, DFW could have kept Delta here in DFW, but that would have made it a manege a trois with AA and DFW. Look fo
30 Nisson : Anyone know whats to become of the Delta maintance building, according to early reports, they suppose to also close it by feb05, any incentives by dfw
31 Mmcdow : Before you say DFW is protecting AA and does not want another major carrier, consider this… The financial impact of Delta’s reduced schedule on th
32 WesternDC1010 : I was just there earlier in the month and boy, what a ghost town Terminal E is! How many and what gates will Delta keep? Will the satellite commuter g
33 Ord : Delta will be keeping four gates in the main terminal, although I can't recall which ones. They will also be keeping one Crown Room Club (the other tw
34 Mmcdow : Delta is keeping gates E-12 thru E-15. The gates left vacant will be E-10 / E-11 and anything south of E-15 (including the satellite terminal). Matt
35 Quickmover : What's the satellite teminal? Is that RJ only or does it have gates and how many?
36 N839mh : The satellite terminal is a group of 9 gates (22-30) which were built in the early 90's I believe, not sure exactly when it was opened. At one time, D
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