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Palm Springs Shut Down?  
User currently offlineAgnusBymaster From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 652 posts, RR: 0
Posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 2887 times:

I noticed that from Friday afternoon through Sunday, many flights into PSP have either been diverted or cancelled. Anyone know what has been going on? Did they shut down the airport due to flooding or other weather-related issues?

21 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineMaiznblu_757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2002, 5112 posts, RR: 50
Reply 1, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 2826 times:

I was out at PSP yesterday and it was very slow. Nothing parked at the terminal. Although it was rainy, low clouds and foggy conditions, it wasnt the worst I have seen.

In the hour I was there I saw one Citation 550 depart and a King Air arrive.



User currently offlineAs739x From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6161 posts, RR: 24
Reply 2, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 2809 times:

Angus....it was not closed. The wx was just below landing min's. The ceiling most of the day was 1,200 to 1,200 feet. Due to terrain they only have a VOR approach with mins of 2,300 feet. The planes that were there were able to depart. We got our first bird in (SFO-PSP AS 412), but they had to shoot 3 approaches. The weather went down later in the day. When I left at 3:30p we had 2 planes holding. I know 574 Captain made an announcement to pax that the plane could possibly end up in ONT and no more bus's were available. Its been a bad year for PSP.

ASSFO



"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
User currently offlineERAU pilot From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 29 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 2793 times:

Palm Springs has only 1 instrument approach, a VOR-GPS Approach. The minimums on that approach are really high due to the mountainous terrain. The weather has been at or below those for the last couple of days. Hopefully soon the weather will break and allow flights to start operating again. Hope this helps!



User currently offlineAs739x From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6161 posts, RR: 24
Reply 4, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 2632 times:

The ironic part is Alaska planes have an RNP approach in the computer that would have allowed all but our MD80's to land. But the Fed's are dragging thier feet on publishing the charts for it. We could have got almost every flight in there. Very frustrating!

ASSFO



"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
User currently offlineSeptember11 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 3623 posts, RR: 21
Reply 5, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 2575 times:

Photos of PSP


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Photo © Gabriel Savit
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Photo © Jonathan Simmons



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Photo © Matt Willmott-Sharp
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Photo © Nate Portinga



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Photo © Craig Jarmuz
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Photo © AirNikon



Nice location -- by the mountains



Airliners.net of the Future
User currently offlineWjcandee From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5251 posts, RR: 23
Reply 6, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 2454 times:

Nice photos. I love flying through this airport -- very easy, very friendly. And note the HUGE runways for a local airport. Apparently, they used to get DC10s in there.

All the best,

Bill


User currently offlineSeptember11 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 3623 posts, RR: 21
Reply 7, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 2439 times:

NW DC-10 jet was there recently for charter --


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Photo © Shawn Flinn




Airliners.net of the Future
User currently offlineRamprat74 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1541 posts, RR: 2
Reply 8, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 2311 times:

I started my career for UA in PSP. We had many flts back then. Now its all UAX.  Sad. American use to run the most flts out of PSP. They use to have 5-6 DFW's, and 4 ORD's in the winter. We use to have 2 ORD's, and 3 DEN's.

The approach to land on 31L can get tricky when the weather is bad. You have to make a hard right bank to line up with it.


User currently offlineIowaman From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4416 posts, RR: 6
Reply 9, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 2279 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

Why such a large displaced threshold??? Because of the mountains?

User currently offlineAs739x From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6161 posts, RR: 24
Reply 10, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 2256 times:

Iowa....yes!

Looks like it has not been as rough of a day, but still some canceled flights and some holds. All AS flights have gotten in, but QX canceled. Looks like most OO/AA/HP flights are getting in.

ASSFO



"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
User currently offlineQqflyboy From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 2292 posts, RR: 13
Reply 11, posted (9 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 2079 times:

I was working AA 499 from ORD to PSP on Friday. We first diverted to PHX, refueled and tried again but ended up at LAX the second time. The captain wanted to go to ONT, but apparently ONT was inundated with diversions and there were no gates available, for hours. AA bussed the pax from LAX to PSP, a tough haul on a Friday afternoon. But they made it, safely. We never shot an approach, the ceiling was just too low. When we were first in the PSP vicinity it was at 1500'. By the time our flight canceled at LAX, it was down to 900'. I flew with the same captain yesterday (Mon) to YYC and he pulled up the weather at PSP for kicks and giggles. Again, it was below minimums.


The views expressed are mine alone and do not necessarily reflect my employer’s views.
User currently offlineSeattle Ops From United States of America, joined Aug 1999, 202 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (9 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 2034 times:

I tried to shoot the VOR-B approach on Flight Sim 2004 with the downloadable current weather and crashed. You have to circle from a heading of 292 to 310 very low and its not easy. PSP has had a rough week.

User currently offlineAs739x From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6161 posts, RR: 24
Reply 13, posted (9 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 1956 times:

Sea Ops, who do you work for? Feel free to send of the forum!

ASSFO



"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
User currently offlineAs739x From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6161 posts, RR: 24
Reply 14, posted (9 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 1921 times:

Great news for PSP, as of 1230 local RNP approaches have been approved by the FAA. I have approach plates being sent and we may actually have a flight fly it within a few hours. So long delays for RNP able planes.

ASSFO



"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
User currently offlineClearedDirect From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 271 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (9 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 1891 times:

I watched a Skywest E-120 (UAX 6121) LAX-PSP on Flight Explorer last night. He circled at least twice at the TRM VOR, shot an approach, went missed and turned back to LAX. An AA MD80 circled for what I think was about an hour and eventually made it in. I also watched a CL-60 Challenger from Nashville circle once and landed ahead of everyone. I believe the METAR was showing broken at 1500', overcast 3000' with light rain and mist with 1.5 SM visibility. At night I am sure it was not fun with those mountains around.

CD


User currently offlineOPNLguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (9 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 1831 times:

>>>Why such a large displaced threshold??? Because of the mountains?

>>>Iowa....yes!

I don't think so... I think it's more likely related to pavement considerations in this case...

Look at:
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Photo © Matt Willmott-Sharp



Using the 10,001 foot runway 13R-31L as a rough 2-mile gauge, you'll notice that there are no big mountains 3-4 miles within either end of the runway. This is not like SAN where there's a displaced threshold landing on 27 due clear to terrain and obstructions immediately east of that airport. That's not evident in this photo of PSP.

Also, take a look at:
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Photo © Gabriel Savit



Note that -both- 13R and 31L have displaced thresholds for landing. PSP is listed in airnav.com as having an asphalt runway, and I suspect only the center portion of 13R-31L (roughly the same length as the 5,000 foot parallel 13L-31R) is actually concrete underneath the asphalt, and thus better able tolerate landing touchdowns in the desert heat. Landing rollouts, and takeoffs are much easier on the runways...

Maybe Tom in MSY or the Comm guy from RNO can chime in here...


User currently offlineJeffLAS From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 161 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (9 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 1808 times:


Back in the TWA good years, I personally witnessed a TWA 747 doing touch and go's at the PSP airport in the heat of the summer. Quite a sight.



" Jazz A-380, you have 2,100 feet from the intersection......Cleared for Take-off"
User currently offlineDHLSAN From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 136 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (9 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 1784 times:

Due to the weather, SAN had been using 9 instead of 27 the last couple days. You still have the hill of Point Loma, but don't have to navigate the houses, the freeway, and a parking structure 50 feet from the threshold.


Yellow?
User currently offlineAaway From United States of America, joined exactly 11 years ago today! , 1533 posts, RR: 14
Reply 19, posted (9 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 1740 times:

"PSP is listed in airnav.com as having an asphalt runway, and I suspect only the center portion of 13R-31L (roughly the same length as the 5,000 foot parallel 13L-31R) is actually concrete underneath the asphalt, and thus better able tolerate landing touchdowns in the desert heat. Landing rollouts, and takeoffs are much easier on the runways..."

From the AFD, PSP 13R-31L is listed as asphalt (asph-pfc). Weight bearing is as follows: DT (dual tandem) 330,00 lbs; DDT (double dual tandem) 800,000 lbs.
I think it may have to do with the fact that nosie "sensitive" areas surround the airport. Bring em' higher to reduce the noise footprint.



With a choice between changing one's mind & proving there's no need to do so, most everyone gets busy on the proof.
User currently offlineOPNLguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (9 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 1720 times:

!3R is displaced 3,144 feet for landing, and 31L is displaced 1,501 feet for landing. Given the vertical distances associated with those horizontal displacements, I think the effect on airport noise is minimal at best...

User currently offlineRamprat74 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1541 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (9 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 1685 times:

They built that threshold on 13R after I tranferred out of there in 94. I don't see a need for it. They should just extend 31L. Those planes need all the runway they can handle during the really hot summer's.

All the gray stuff in between the runways and taxiways is river rock. It was just dirt when I worked there. I wonder how many cubic yards it took to feel in all those area's.


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