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Lisbon To Goa Or Macau?  
User currently offlineOrion737 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (9 years 6 months 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 3017 times:

I know TAP pulled of the Lisbon-Macau route, have they ever serve the ex-Portugese colony of Goa?

Is there any charter flights from Portugal to either Goa or Macau. I would have thought Goa would have been a popular holiday destination for Prtugese holidaymakers, considering the colonial and cultural links.

Any chance of Air macau starting up a service to Lisboa?

26 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineDETA737 From Portugal, joined Oct 2000, 612 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (9 years 6 months 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 2954 times:

Lisbon-Goa was served by TAIP (Transportes Aéreos da Índia Portuguesa) an airline that started with 3 DC-6B, 2 Skymasters and 2 Vikings. The airline flew Goa-Damão-Dio-Karachi, Goa-Karachi-Beirut-Damascus-Lisbon and Goa-Beira-Lourenço Marques.

However, as of July 8, 1961 TAP took over the Lisbon-Damascus-Beirut-Karachi-Goa flights flying them with L-1049Gs and this lasted until the invasion in December of 1961. So TAP did serve Goa albeit very briefly. One interesting thing to note was the stop in Damascus, well apparently the Syrian and later United Arab Republic governments demanded a stop in Damascus for overflight rights.

I know Goa has become a major tourist destination in recent years with Europeans, however Portuguese tourism doesn't seem to be very significant as of yet. The Maldives have become much more popular a destination for Portuguese tourists though perhaps in the future the market could grow. So far as I know there haven't been any charter flights between Lisbon and Goa.


User currently offlineCedarjet From United Kingdom, joined May 1999, 8049 posts, RR: 54
Reply 2, posted (9 years 6 months 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 2944 times:

Interesting about the stop in Damascus: Qantas used to stop in Damascus. I have a timetable from 1982 which shows a Perth - Singapore - Bahrein - Damascus - London service with 747s. Imagine that: a Qantas 747 from Perth to Damascus.


fly Saha Air 707s daily from Tehran's downtown Mehrabad to Mashhad, Kish Island and Ahwaz
User currently offlineEta unknown From Comoros, joined Jun 2001, 2072 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (9 years 6 months 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 2903 times:

In 1976 there was even an ATH stop thrown in between DAM & LHR- all with a 747!

User currently offlineAirbazar From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 8197 posts, RR: 10
Reply 4, posted (9 years 6 months 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 2849 times:

Believe it or not there never was much demand for travel between Portugal and Macau, even when Macau was a Portuguese territory. I suspect there's even less today. Unlike the Brits/Dutch who loved to visit their colonies/overseas territories (and still do), the Portuguese just don't. TAP did fly to Macau via BKK, the main reason for the purchase of the A340, and there wasn't much demand then. So a really don't see Air Macau ever flying to Portugal if they ever decide to venture into Europe.

User currently offlineJoFMO From Germany, joined Jul 2004, 2211 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (9 years 6 months 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 2834 times:

Later under Qualifier alliance TAP served HKG vir BRU and SN codeshared with them.
Maybe HKG will come back as a codeshare destination for TAP once they have entered Star. They could easily serve it via FRA or MUC on LH's metal. Macao is just 50minutes by boat from HKG airport boat station.


User currently offlineVelasco From Portugal, joined Jan 2005, 101 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (9 years 6 months 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 2746 times:

Unlike the Brits/Dutch who loved to visit their colonies/overseas territories (and still do), the Portuguese just don't.

Airbazar, this statement isn't true. The portuguese only recently have reached the level of disposable income where they can afford to visit their old colonies on vacation and only recently have many old colonies found the peace and built the infra-structure needed to support a tourism industry. There has always been a regular flow of traffic between Portugal, Angola, Cabo Verde and Mozambique where a large portuguese community still lives. Cabo Verde is a popular low-budget destination, São Tomé and Mozambique have been developing as high-end destinations. In the last 10 years though, most portuguese tourism to portuguese-speaking countries has flowed to Brasil which has always been the country we love most. I'm not entirely sure about the figures but I think TAP's traffic to Brasil has reached about 600,000 this year and a growth rate of about 12-13% which is both a reflex of the growth of portuguese tourism and of the growth of the brazilian community living among us. Goa and Macau aren't really popular destinations though you'll find many portuguese who have been there. Most people travelling to Goa or Macau take flights via Frankfurt or London as the market doesnt support regular flights. Maybe as disposable income grows you'll see more portuguese travellers there but there is no great sentimental attachment to those places or to such other colonial outposts as Malacca (Malaysia) or Sri Lanka. I guess the Portuguese are too much in love with Brasil to look at other colonial beauties - which is fair enough!

DETA737, it was really curious to know those old routes! Amazing!



Lisboa-Rio on the A340... São Pedro e São Paulo down below...
User currently offlineAirbazar From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 8197 posts, RR: 10
Reply 7, posted (9 years 6 months 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 2635 times:

Velasco, I agree with you re. the disposable income but I also think a lot has to do with what you said about "lack of sentimental attachement". Even today most of the people who travel on TAP to places like Angola, Mozambique, Cabo Verde, etc, are not exactly Portuguese vacationers but rather expats/immigrants. I'm sure you've been to Portela when one of these flights is leaving  Smile The vacationers tend to go on charter flights. Brazil like you said is a different case, but then again, few go there to visit the country as much as the resort that they're staying in  Smile Just because they go there doesn't mean they have any interest in visiting the country, which was the main intent of my previous post.

User currently offlineHardiwv From Brazil, joined Oct 2004, 8780 posts, RR: 50
Reply 8, posted (9 years 6 months 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 2609 times:

Unlike the Brits/Dutch who loved to visit their colonies/overseas territories (and still do), the Portuguese just don't.

This is completely incorrect. As mentioned by Velasco, just look at the case of Brazil. The traffic Portugal-Brazil is enormous (for the tiny Portuguese population), and TAP keeps regular flights to GRU, GIG, REC, SSA, FOR and NAT. I wont even mention the amount of charter flights to many NE Brazilian destinations.

most portuguese tourism to portuguese-speaking countries has flowed to Brasil which has always been the country we love most

Totally correct. Brazil is just about 8h flight from Portugal, why go to far-away destinations? For years Brazil has been the major holiday destination for the Portuguese, which is also reflected in the amount of Portuguese investment in the tourism sector in Brazil, e.g. look at Grupo Pestana.

With Brazil to visit, why Goa or Macao???

Brazil like you said is a different case, but then again, few go there to visit the country as much as the resort that they're staying in Just because they go there doesn't mean they have any interest in visiting the country, which was the main intent of my previous post.

I have to disagree. In my opinion, Portuguese tourists do have a genuine interest in knowing Brazil. The all-inclusive resort package is a new concept in Brazil, which was actually brough by the new wave of Scandinavian tourists in NE Brazil. Most of Portuguese tourists don stay in resorts in Brazil.

You can notice that in Brazil the Portuguese, different from the Scandinavian tourist, often mingle with the population and go to off the beaten attractions. Even because the Portuguese language makes it easier for them to venture to other places and make contact with the locals.

Just my opinion.


User currently offlineKeno From Malaysia, joined Feb 2004, 1842 posts, RR: 28
Reply 9, posted (9 years 6 months 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 2482 times:

but there is no great sentimental attachment to those places or to such other colonial outposts as Malacca (Malaysia)

I don't think TAP is in any rush to fly to Malacca. The biggest scheduled aircraft we get in Malacca airport now is a Fokker 50  Big grin. There is still a large Luso-Malay community in Malacca but their attachment to the 'mother country' has long gone centuries ago.

I'm surprised nobody mentioned about Timor Leste (East Timor). I highly doubt it that it will ever get a longhaul service anytime soon. I believe the only international airports where you can connect to a flight to Dili (the capital) is either Bali or Darwin.


User currently offlineEta unknown From Comoros, joined Jun 2001, 2072 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (9 years 6 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 2442 times:

Maybe TP should fly Lisbon-Dili... afterall, East Timor was a colony!
Hang on- maybe they should add Belem or Manaos?
No- wait-I've got it- it seems to me TP should fly to every place on Earth that was at one point Portuguese!!!


User currently offlineYyz717 From Canada, joined Sep 2001, 16245 posts, RR: 56
Reply 11, posted (9 years 6 months 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 2437 times:

The TAP 343 service to Macau stopped at BRU not BKK.

TAP's network has always been heavily driven by Portugal's colonial empire and more importantly by the location of large Portuguese communities. There was never many Portuguese in Goa or Macau hence that has minimized the need for TAP flights.

In the early 70's, TAP added 4 742's to its fleet mainly to serve the huge Portuguese communities in Mozambique and Angola. When these 2 countries became independent in 74/75, most of the Portuguese left. This rendered the 742 fleet surplus. 2 were sold to PIA. In due course, the remaining 2 were sold also. TAP's current network to Angola and Mozambique is a mere fraction of the capacity that existed 30 years ago into those markets.




Panam, TWA, Ansett, Eastern.......AC next? Might be good for Canada.
User currently offlineRafabozzolla From Brazil, joined Apr 2000, 1211 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (9 years 6 months 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 2386 times:

With all do respect Airbazar, but I have to join the group of people who disagree with you.

Goa and Macau are places where the Portuguese influence never really took off, and the Portuguese people don't feel emotionally attached to those places. Malaca and Timor are even more "exotic" as I put it.

The African ex-colonies are closer and more economically and culturally connected to Portugal, but tourism there has been hampered by war for many years.

Brazil is to Portugal a bit what the US (or India given the 3rd world status of my country) is to the UK. The old crown jewell, fully Portuguese speaking and, with all the differences between the two countries, still a western society with similar habits as those Portuguese would find at home.

Do I make my point?


User currently offlineTAP340 From Portugal, joined Oct 2004, 102 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (9 years 6 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 2365 times:

Yyz717

TP service stopped at both airports. First it was LIS-BRY-MFM, then LIS-BKK-MFM, or the other way round. If you go to BKK airport you will se that one of the local handling companies still states they serve TAP.

Well, if TP were to fly to every place were Portuguese people have been, we would have flights to every part of of the globe.

Angola, Mozambique, Cabo Verde, São Tomé e Principe, Guiné Bissau, Brazil, Macau, East Timor, Goa, etc. (Ex. Colonies)

Then to places like: Malacca, Yemen, Japan, Australia, etc. We were everywhere, but instead of conquering the place, we mingled...


User currently offlineHardiwv From Brazil, joined Oct 2004, 8780 posts, RR: 50
Reply 14, posted (9 years 6 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 2354 times:

Just to add another point, and I think Rafabozzolla was perfect in his explanation, the connection Brazil-Portugal is much more than tourism and colonial past.

Portugal could considered itself fortunate in having Brazil as a former colony. Brazil is one of the major emerging markets in the world with plenty of business opportunities. Also, because of its economic importance, Brazil now is driving the Portuguese language to a higher status.

Brazil's economy is number 9 in the world, and probably represents the only case in which the colony became economically stronger than the colonial power.

You cannot simply compare Brazil with any other former Portuguese colony, the differences are just too big. This is clearly singled out in TAP network: 39 weekly flights to Brazil. At the end, Brazil turned out to be again a major business window for Portugal.

Rgs,


User currently offlineJoFMO From Germany, joined Jul 2004, 2211 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (9 years 6 months 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 2314 times:

Well Hardi,

I would add that the former British colony America became a stronger economic power than the UK.
If India keeps it's growth rate it will overturn the UK too. India is 20times as big as UK.


User currently offlineVelasco From Portugal, joined Jan 2005, 101 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (9 years 6 months 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 2274 times:

I guess we all agree on the essentials here. TAP couldn't possibly handle flights to all former portuguese colonial posessions as there is no demand for it neither in Portugal nor in those countries. Though I'm no expert in the industry I believe the brazilian market will continue to grow over the next years. It's not just that more and more portuguese can afford and do spend their vacations in Brazil. It's that Brazil in now the major source of immigration to Portugal and the brazilian community has grown beyond all expectations, feeding a market that operates beyond the peak seasons. Also, many portuguese are now buying vacation houses in north-east Brazil and starting small businesses there and this also will also generate traffic in the future I guess. But the best part may come when brazilians reach the income level where tey can afford to spend their vacations in europe, which only a small minority now do: then, it will be brazilian vacationers feeding the market between the two countries and visiting Lisbon as a passing point to other european capitals.

As has been pointed out, Portugal and Brazil are very very close from a cultural point of view. When I'm in Brazil I feel truly at home and I know most brazilians feel that way too here in Portugal. Are we allowed to leave the European Union?  Big grin



Lisboa-Rio on the A340... São Pedro e São Paulo down below...
User currently offlineHardiwv From Brazil, joined Oct 2004, 8780 posts, RR: 50
Reply 17, posted (9 years 6 months 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 2269 times:

JoFMO:

You're completely right! I forgot the US as a former colony of the UK...and maybe India in the future...

Velasco:

Again, I agree with you. Cooperation Brazil-Portugal has reached a level at which even the coach of the Portuguese football team is Brazilian!  Big grin

I also think that the recent TP-RG partnership will further enhance Brazil-Portugal ties, as travel between both countries will become ever more efficient.

Rgs,




User currently offlineRafabozzolla From Brazil, joined Apr 2000, 1211 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (9 years 6 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 2189 times:

Jo,

Can I be picky? There is no such country called America. I am in Brazil and I am in America (South America), Canadians are also in America (North America).

It bothers me how people from the United States of America have appropriated the name of a full continent all to themselves. Just because their country does not have a proper name.


User currently offlineDirkou From United States of America, joined Jun 2003, 571 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (9 years 6 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 2173 times:

Hardiwv:

"Unlike the Brits/Dutch who loved to visit their colonies/overseas territories (and still do), the Portuguese just don't."

Ok with the Brits but don't compare portuguese colonies with Dutch colonies...portuguese empire was much larger than the dutch one...Africa, South America, India and Oceania...


User currently offlineBuyantUkhaa From Mongolia, joined May 2004, 2870 posts, RR: 3
Reply 20, posted (9 years 6 months 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 2121 times:

Well, don't forget the Dutch had Manhattan and sold it - and the Dutch had Indonesia, South Africa, Surinam, Sri Lanka and many other smaller sites. The Dutch had the monopoly on trade with Japan for 400 years in Nagasaki, after ties with the Portuguese were cut because the Portuguese were also trying to sell Catholicism. There are currently 5,5 islands left of the Dutch overseas territories, that's true.

Anyway back to topic, what I find strange is that LIS-MFM and LIS-East Timor never managed to generate enough VFR traffic. I live in Lisbon for the moment, and I know many people that used to live in Macau and came back after Macau's handover. East Timor might be a different case as it's even more remote, and lost Portuguese influence earlier, but look at the following: if the Azores can generate so much VFR traffic to the US and Canada, then how come that Asian states cannot? Strange comparison maybe, but has anyone seen a Macau or East Timor restaurant in Lisbon? There are tons of Brazilian/Cape Verdian/Angolan restaurants, but nothing Portuguese-Colony-Asian.

Only speculating here, but my impression is that Portuguese colonies in Asia were quickly swallowed by local cultures (Indian/Chinese/Indonesian/Malaysian) and then soon forgotten by Portugal. The African colonies never much developed economically and have sizeable immigrant communities in Portugal, generating steady VFR traffic - and Portuguese go to beach resorts in Mocambique - not Angola though.

Now, Brasil - that became a success story. True, there is still lots of poverty there, but the country has a decent industry of its own, just look at Embraer. The same, I'm afraid, cannot be said about Portugal. In the year that 10 new countries joined the European Union, ICEP, the main Portuguese government body of international trade, put its main focus on Africa and Brasil. To me, this is a surrender. While I wish Portugal all the best and a comfortable position within the EU25, it seems that they don't want to compete, and turn to their colonial past. Where will this lead? Brasil is already much more powerful than Portugal economically, and I think that within a decade or two Brasil with actually use Portugal as its bridgehead into Europe. Which will probably be a good deal for both Brasil and Europe (and Portugal not to forget).

Regarding Portuguese tourism, it is still extremely traditional. I'd say that half of the Portuguese population hasn't left the country ever. This is partly due to economic circumstances, partly due to sheer lack of curiosity. If you look at a Portuguese tourist agency brochure, you'll see all the cliché destinations - Brasil, Tahiti, Acapulco and the Maldives. No adventurous holidays in Mongolia or Nepal - they're just not interested. So this may explain in part why there are no flights to Goa or Macau at the moment. I travelled Asia extensively, and of all tourist nationalities that I saw, there were (outside of Macau) no Portuguese at all.

I suppose I should start a non-av thread about the future of Portugal...



I scratch my head, therefore I am.
User currently offlineDirkou From United States of America, joined Jun 2003, 571 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (9 years 6 months 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 2107 times:

Hi BuyantUkhaa!

Really interesting your reply. I'm originally portuguese and I agree with most of what you said (anyway not too much about Portugal turning to Brazil and Africa instead of the new european states)...after all what is Holland or Denmark to Portugal? Nothing...a forced brother, maybe, because of money.

We cannot say the same about Angola, Mozambique, Brazil etc as they are almost like the same country. Any portuguese will look at an angolan, for example, as a friend/brother and to a swedish or norwegian as a stranger...

Anyway the most important thing you said, in my opinion, is when you mentioned "partly due to sheer lack of curiosity"...you are 100% right. What may kill Portugal is the narrow minded way 99% of the people think...what you think about that? Since you travel a lot I would be very interested in knowing what you think about the portuguese way of thinking comparing to other countries...

Also in what would you invest if you were a portuguese governant? What countries?

My opinion would be that Portugal should get the know how from European countries and apply it to its ex-african colonies and Brazil...


User currently offlineDETA737 From Portugal, joined Oct 2000, 612 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (9 years 6 months 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 2098 times:

The former Portuguese colonies in Asia have really been overshadowed since the 17th century in the Portuguese psyche. Places like Goa were really important to the Portuguese commercial empire until the 1600s when the Dutch and later English superceeded the Portuguese. The Indian enclaves, Macau and Timor were basically relics of more glorious time and Brazil and later Africa became the focus of the Portuguese government when it came to colonies.

By the 20th century these places were simply relics and more or less ignored by the Portuguese government. Even while they were still Portuguese, most of the foreign trade of these three "overseas provinces" was with non-Portuguese areas. So once they ceased to be Portuguese, what little links existed with Portugal simply dwindled away. The interesting thing about Goa was that Goans were kind of an elite of the colonial populations (along with Cape Verdeans). The Catholic Goans became quite prominent in Portugal and other colonies and were given Portuguese citizenship automatically (in Portuguese Guinea, Angola, Mozambique and Timor most natives were subjects and would have to become assimilated before 1961 when all were granted citizenship). In Goa there were only about 1,000 Europeans in 1961 and Goans filled practically all civil service positions except for Governor-General at the time. Until 1974 Portugal never recognised the 1961 annexation of the Indian enclaves and there were still members of parliament representing the "State of Portuguese India". Even after it was recognised anyone born under Portuguese rule was entitled to claim Portuguese citizenship for himself of his descendants. Lately this has caused some troubles with over a 100,000 having claimed passports often using false documents and being from other parts of India. In all other former colonies the citizens were given a short period after independence to choose to stay Portuguese.

Macau too has never had as strong ties with Portugal as there were never more than perhaps 5,000 European Portuguese living there at the peak and perhaps 20,000 Macanese of mixed Portuguese and Chinese blood who were culturally Portuguese. In fact Macau was the one colony that the Salazar dictatorship was actually willing to part with. It was never able to assimilate into the Portuguese nation and in 1966 there were Communist inspired riots as part of the cultural revolution and the Salazar government offered it back to China, but it was too important as a source of foreign exchange for Mao. In 1974 the government tried to hand it back again but were rejected, it was only in 1987 that the Chinese took it back.

Timor was interesting in that being the most remote Portuguese possession it was the most neglected. Though much of the population there has Portuguese names and are very Catholic and generally were a very "loyal" part of the empire. The colony was never profitable and in 1854 the governor sold a bunch of and Western Flores to the Dutch.

About air service though, I was reading a "debate" (if one could call them that in a dictatorship) in the Portuguese parliament from 1974 talking about the need to establish air links with Timor. One of the problems was that Portugal had no diplomatic links with the USSR, many African, Arab and Asian countries at the time and therefore this posed a problem. One option proposed was extending the LIS-GIG-GRU-EZE route via Chile across the Pacific, another was to fly via Mozambique and Australia and another was through North America across the Pacific. The problem with this was that Baucau airport at the time would have to be expanded and TAP seemed unwilling to undertake the route. At the time some Australian Airline flew a biweekly service there though and the Portuguese were trying to entice Garuda to fly there.

The former African colonies especially Angola and Mozambique will continue to be important for the Portuguese. There are over 100,000 Cape Verdians in Portugal and there are many Guinea-Bissau(ans?), São Tomenses, Angolans and Mozambicans in Portugal. In 1974 there were close to 1 million European Portuguese in Angola and Mozambique (including many of my relatives in the latter) and most left though now some are returning as investors. Portugal remains a major investor in most of these countries and a major trading partner for all 5. Mozambique is growing as a tourist destination and the Grupo Pestana has been building new resorts including the Bazaruto lodge. Perhaps over time Mozambique tourism will be as major as it was pre-1974. Air Luxor recently decided to start flying a weekly flight to Maputo later in the year according to Diário Económico.


User currently offlineVelasco From Portugal, joined Jan 2005, 101 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (9 years 6 months 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 2073 times:

DETA737, that was a fine post. I am putting you on my respected list. After reading BuyantUkhaa and Dirkou's posts I was wondering whether it was worth the time explaining history on a civil aviation forum. But history is important in this case as it does indeed help explain the different cultural attachment the portuguese have to their old colonial posessions and the economics of the travel industry in modern-day Portugal. I guess the same could be said of many other colonial nations: after all there must be a reason other than "sheer lack of curiosity" why I never tripped on a british tourist in Swaziland or on a spanish tourist in Honduras.

Despite our many lackings, the history of Portugal in the last 20 years has been one of immense achievement. As someone who remembers what the country was like back in the seventies, I can't help being both amazed and happy that a significant share of the population is now able to study, work and enjoy their vacations abroad, not only in portuguese-speaking countries but in many other places as well, european countries at the forefront. Charter companies have popped-up, travel magazines enjoy wide circulation, investment in the portuguese market by foreign travel agencies keeps growing, adventure travel has become popular among younger travellers and an ever larger number of back-packers start circling the globe. Portugal being a country with a population of 10 million and an income per head of about 18,000 USD, one shouldn't be much surprised not to step into portuguese crowds in far away Thailand - but the fact that you may now step into them in Brazil, Morocco, Spain, Cabo Verde, Cuba or the Dominican Republic is what really deserves to be pointed out.

As to portuguese foreign investment policy and the analysis of the national psyche, I'll leave that to the "broad-minded" mongolians and americans to sort out...

[Edited 2005-01-23 06:40:47]


Lisboa-Rio on the A340... São Pedro e São Paulo down below...
User currently offlineGamps From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 469 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (9 years 6 months 4 days ago) and read 2050 times:

DETA737,

Great post. Very insightful indeed.

Even after it was recognised anyone born under Portuguese rule was entitled to claim Portuguese citizenship for himself of his descendants. Lately this has caused some troubles with over a 100,000 having claimed passports often using false documents and being from other parts of India.

Right on! But can you explain why does Portugal still maintain an office in Goa and still issue passports to these cheats? This has become a major scandal and there are dozens of agents promising Portugal/EU passport for anyone who can pay less than $5000. Forget Indians from other state, people travel from Sri Lanka, Bangladesh, Nepal and heck even from Pakistan to Goa to get false document - popular one being using identity of someone who is dead and bribing the officials responsible for record keeping. This racket existed all along but never in the scale being witnessed now - especially after the EU. An Indian mafia don responsible for serial bomb blasts in Mumbai was also caught in Portugal with a valid Portugese passport, but still Portugal government seems to be blind to all this and infact encourage the cheats.









25 Hardiwv : Brasil is already much more powerful than Portugal economically, and I think that within a decade or two Brasil with actually use Portugal as its brid
26 AM744 : Brazil's economy is number 9 in the world, and probably represents the only case in which the colony became economically stronger than the colonial po
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