Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Would Southwest Consider The 787  
User currently offlineSonic67 From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 292 posts, RR: 0
Posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 8914 times:

Is it a possibility that Southwest would expand its fleet and order the 787 because of its efficiency? I know that their business modal is based around the 737 AC but given their success would they maybe consider other AC such the 787?

Your thoughts  Big thumbs up

Sonic

[Edited 2005-02-01 07:38:41]

[Edited 2005-02-01 07:39:52]

28 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineThrust From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 2688 posts, RR: 10
Reply 1, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 8801 times:

Anybody who believes that WN is going to buy the 787 truly needs to stop and look at the big picture. WN WILL NOT ORDER ANYTHING EXCEPT The 737NGs!!! Their method of having one big 737 family for a fleet has served them well the whole time they have been alive. They are one of the most prominent airlines in the world healthwise and financially. Why on earth destroy a tradition that has served them so well? IMO, the 787 is FAR too big for any of WN's routes.


Fly one thing; Fly it well
User currently offlineSonic67 From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 292 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 8718 times:


Ok I get it!

Eventually they will have to change their AC when the 737NG is replaced by something more efficient.



User currently offlineSilver1SWA From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 4769 posts, RR: 26
Reply 3, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 8691 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Yes, that may be true. But the 737 and 787 markets are completely different. When the time comes, they will replace the 737 with the newest generation aircraft designed to serve that type or market.

[Edited 2005-02-01 08:06:35]


ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
User currently offlineThrust From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 2688 posts, RR: 10
Reply 4, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 8683 times:

Eventually, yes, I agree, Silver1SWA, WN will have to replace the 737NGs. But it is clear that an airplane like the 787 for WN is out of the question.


Fly one thing; Fly it well
User currently offlineBoeingFever777 From United States of America, joined Jul 2009, 409 posts, RR: 54
Reply 5, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 8672 times:

 Yeah sure.....right!

What would ever make you think/say something like that?

They got over (80) 737NG on order still, this clearly shows that this is there workhorse and what makes them profitable for 30+ yrs. The 787 is like a SEMI for WN, way to BIG & COSTLY of an a/c for there routes.

http://active.boeing.com/commercial/orders/displaystandardreport.cfm?optReportType=Customer&cboCustomer=SWA&cboCountry=&cboRegion=&ViewReportF=View+Report

I totally 100% agree with Thrust.



Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre.
User currently offlineSilver1SWA From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 4769 posts, RR: 26
Reply 6, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 8658 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Exactly. While a replacement may some day be necessary, we are talking about something that would happen a loooooooooong time from now. As mentioned, WN still has 737NGs on the way and if these things prove as reliable as the 737 classics, WN should see a good 20-30 years of enjoyment from these aircraft.




ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
User currently offlineAmerican 767 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 3735 posts, RR: 12
Reply 7, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 8530 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

No I don't think Southwest will ever order the 787, I don't see them buying a widebody aircraft. Yes, you are correct about them continuing with the 737-700 in the future. However, the only other aircraft they may order is the Embraer 190. Believe it or not, Southwest has been looking at it for future route expansion.

Ben Soriano
Brussels Belgium



Ben Soriano
User currently offlineLoveFieldFlyer From United States of America, joined Dec 2001, 80 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 8451 times:

They got over (80) 737NG on order still

The 4th quarter earnings report indicates that there are now 91 firm orders plus options for 259 extending through the year 2012.


User currently offlineContrails From United States of America, joined Oct 2000, 1832 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 8430 times:

I can't see WN ordering anything but 737s for the forseeable future. But, if they ever start flying from the west coast to HNL they just might get some 757s. But not widebodies, it's not in their character.

I know, the west coast-HNL service is just a dream. But it's a nice one.




Flying Colors Forever!
User currently offlineFlyGuyClt From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 537 posts, RR: 8
Reply 10, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 8387 times:

Why would they get the 757's? 737-700's and 800's can fly the route. Just look at Aloha's fleet and flights from the West Coast.

Safe Flying  Smile



Florida Express, Braniff II and ......
User currently offlineDrerx7 From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5158 posts, RR: 8
Reply 11, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 8326 times:

Probably not in our lifetimes. Besides all of the obvious reasons--the 787 will not be able to operate out of some of WN's key airports--MDW/HOU come to mind.


Third Coast born, means I'm Texas raised
User currently offlineDAYflyer From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 3807 posts, RR: 3
Reply 12, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 8288 times:

The 737 that they use has more than sufficient efficiencies and range to do what they want it to do. They will not order the 787 at all; too big for them.
They will order (eventually) the 737 replacement, which will undoubtedly be based on the 787 technology, perhaps even as much composites as the 787.



One Nation Under God
User currently offlineTravellin'man From United States of America, joined May 2001, 530 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 8282 times:

In the few years that I have belonged to this forum, there has been the occasional interesting post from someone or other claiming (on the basis of some sort of insider knowledge) that Southwest has looked at other aircraft types, even the 777, if you can believe that!

What is worth saying here instead of just 'No', or even being censorious towards such an open question, is that SO FAR Southwest is saying no to other aircraft types. This is because their mission has not changed. They continue to stay focused on what they do so well: short to mid range point to point flying with quick turnaround times, for which the 737 is ideal. They see no reason to try to be all things to all people, to offer every kind of service available. Now, I do not have access to any sort of special information, nor am I in a position to verify what these posters were saying; however it seems perfectly plausible to me that the airline may someday expand their mission to include longer range international flying. A viable international LCC is one of the next great steps wiaiting to be made in the airline business, and an aircraft like the 787 would be a great way to do that.

Even if it remains pure speculation, considering the what if's is far more interesting than just reiterating the status quo.



It is not enough to be rude; one must also be incorrect.
User currently offline777STL From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 3552 posts, RR: 3
Reply 14, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 8192 times:

"I can't see WN ordering anything but 737s for the forseeable future. But, if they ever start flying from the west coast to HNL they just might get some 757s. But not widebodies, it's not in their character.

I know, the west coast-HNL service is just a dream. But it's a nice one."

Yep, if WN stays profitable indefinitely like they have for the past thirty years, they could single handedly keep the 737NG line open indefinitely. WN still has some older -300s and -500s that could eventually be replaced by NGs as well. I don't think there is any current design out there right now that WN would consider to replace the 737s.

-77



PHX based
User currently offlineBoeing7E7 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 8167 times:

Is it a possibility that Southwest would expand its fleet and order the 787 because of its efficiency?

Yes, with the 140 pax 3+3 variant.


User currently offlineDrerx7 From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5158 posts, RR: 8
Reply 16, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 8147 times:

Southwest wouldn't need 757s to fly to Hawaii--their 73Gs can make the hop now--the fleet isn't ETOPS certified though.


Third Coast born, means I'm Texas raised
User currently offlineTransPac From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 108 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 8000 times:

I also doubt we'll ever a WN 787. However, I am intrigued by the possibilities the 787-3 holds for US domestic carriers. Seems an airline like AS could put them to good use at some point.

User currently offlineAirgeek12 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 7989 times:

Is that a joke? :p.. but heck no! :p.. they're staying with (mainly) 737s; 737NGs I think.

geek


User currently offlineFlyGuyClt From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 537 posts, RR: 8
Reply 19, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 7772 times:

Reply #16.

It is a heck of alot cheaper to get ETOPS certified then it is to introduce an entirely new aircraft into the fleet. Ones on order could be converted before delivery.

Safe Flying  Smile



Florida Express, Braniff II and ......
User currently offlineA350 From Germany, joined Nov 2004, 1100 posts, RR: 22
Reply 20, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 7714 times:

Remember that one important reason for the success of the LCCs is that the 737NGs and A32xs are virtually as efficient on short hops as the widebodies, so it was easy to operate quite small planes and simplyfied fleets.

I can well imagine that the 783 (and maybe an A300 successor) will change the game and allow the legacies to match or overtake the LCCs efficiency and/or pressure the LCCs to give up the extreme fleet simplicity. Interesting times will come next decade!

A350



Photography - the art of observing, not the art of arranging
User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26361 posts, RR: 76
Reply 21, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 7155 times:

>IMO, the 787 is FAR too big for any of WN's routes.<

Well, no, not really. There are several routes that could take a 787 but they prefer frequency and commonality.

>I can well imagine that the 783 (and maybe an A300 successor) will change the game and allow the legacies to match or overtake the LCCs efficiency and/or pressure the LCCs to give up the extreme fleet simplicity.<

They can already obliterate the LCC's seat-mile with a 744 if they want. There is a question of being able to fill the plane for that to matter.

>the fleet isn't ETOPS certified though.<

They don't even have overwater gear



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineAussieItaliano From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2005, 442 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 7139 times:

WN still has many markets to fill with low-cost, high frequency service within the continental US. Because of this, I don't think that they'll even consider anything other than the 73G while there is still more of the US market for them to expand into.


LHR - The Capital of the World
User currently offlineDfwRevolution From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 960 posts, RR: 51
Reply 23, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 6779 times:

Anybody who believes that WN is going to buy the 787 truly needs to stop and look at the big picture

OK lookin at the big picture as you suggested... I see an airline who never confines themselves to a certain method and always looks for new markets and niches. WN is not the airline to pass absolute statements about...

heir method of having one big 737 family for a fleet has served them well the whole time they have been alive.

They don't have one big 737 family

IMO, the 787 is FAR too big for any of WN's routes.

What makes you think WN would fly it? Is a wholly or partially owned partner flying international routes with the 787 absurd, of course not. Heck, the TZ codeshare could evolve into this as TZ was hoping to begin international routes pre-Ch.11 filing. WN has one of the largest domestic networks to funnel passengers into as well...

However, the only other aircraft they may order is the Embraer 190.

WN will probably add larger aircraft before they add smaller aircraft. The most likely canidate being the 738, which any 73G order can be converted to without difficulty

WN should see a good 20-30 years of enjoyment from these aircraft.

Probably not... WN flies the hell out of their airplanes, the first 733 are fully depricated and have retirement in sight. WN flies a demanding schedule that wears an airframe down more rapidly than say... AA.

IMO, the 787 is FAR too big for any of WN's routes.

I agree and I doubt that WN would order the 787 anytime soon, but I will most definitly not rule out the possibility completly. 787 probably won't fly in WN colors, but carrying WN passengers is very possible...


User currently offlineElwood64151 From United States of America, joined Feb 2002, 2477 posts, RR: 6
Reply 24, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 6575 times:

Travellin'man:

You beat me to it!

WN will probably add larger aircraft before they add smaller aircraft. The most likely canidate being the 738, which any 73G order can be converted to without difficulty

You're assuming that they'll go international before they fill in the US. If they decide to operate to say ICT, BMI, MLI, COS, or other mid-size cities with comparatively low O&D, a smaller aircraft such as the E-190 or whatever Bombardier has up its sleeve could be just as likely as any larger aircraft.

Probably not... WN flies the hell out of their airplanes, the first 733 are fully depricated and have retirement in sight. WN flies a demanding schedule that wears an airframe down more rapidly than say... AA.

Let's see... The 733s were introduced in... When? The early 1980s?! You must be kidding!

I don't think WN operates the only the 737 just to keep their fleet simple. As long as they add enough aircraft, another fleet type wouldn't be that bad. After all, the 733 and 73G aren't entirely the same aircraft, and do require additional maintenance logistics. So adding a 787 for intercontinental travel (if they chose to do it) wouldn't be too out-of-line for WN, so long as they ordered enough of them to justify the additional MX expense.

FL recently did this by adding the 73G to its fleet, since it needed a longer-range aircraft compared to its 717s. It could have kept the 717s and expanded a midwestern hub to do the same thing. FL chose the additional fleet type. WN so far has chosen decentralized operations.

Just my thoughts.



Those who fail to learn history are doomed to repeat it in summer school.
25 N1120A : >Probably not... WN flies the hell out of their airplanes, the first 733 are fully depricated and have retirement in sight. WN flies a demanding sched
26 DfwRevolution : Let's see... The 733s were introduced in... When? The early 1980s?! You must be kidding! Not at all... before 2010 (maybe even 2008) the first 733 wil
27 Cloudy : 7e7 for Southwest itself is not likely. The ATA codeshare experiment is interesting , however. In the long term, Southwest may look to ATA to do the k
28 Tcfc424 : As I mentioned earlier on the new "startup Int'l LCC" this may be an area where WN is looking. I don't believe we will see it any time soon, but WN is
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Would Boeing Consider A Shorter 787? posted Fri May 20 2005 12:23:57 by DeltaWings
SkyValue Takes On Southwest In The Chicago Area posted Mon Nov 27 2006 09:19:02 by QXatFAT
First 10 Airlines To Receive The 787? posted Tue Nov 14 2006 19:56:02 by FCAFLYBOY
SIA Says Airbus To Build The 787-9 For Them posted Wed Nov 8 2006 03:10:54 by Jimyvr
Virtual Construction Of The 787 posted Tue Nov 7 2006 20:15:06 by NYC777
Is Southwest Ordering The 737-700ER? posted Sat Nov 4 2006 04:08:45 by SWABFA
Where Is The 787-10? posted Wed Nov 1 2006 17:11:18 by AA1818
Why Did NWA Choose RR For The 787? posted Wed Nov 1 2006 05:45:22 by Scouse
When Will The 787 Be Rolled Out? posted Mon Oct 30 2006 23:27:41 by NYC777
Some Questions Regarding The 787.... posted Mon Oct 23 2006 14:49:56 by Beaucaire
Is American Still Thinking Of Buying The 787? posted Wed Mar 21 2012 07:48:59 by American 767
Onboard The 787 Dream Tour BOS-EWR posted Thu Mar 8 2012 14:56:49 by gothamspotter
SAN will see the 787 on Mar 12 and 13 posted Mon Mar 5 2012 11:33:10 by SANFan
How Many Shifts Build The 787? posted Wed Feb 15 2012 18:25:34 by EASTERN747
Airbus Challenges The 787-10X With A330-300S posted Mon Jan 30 2012 02:51:25 by ferpe