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GOL Starting Services To Chile!  
User currently offlineAero From Germany, joined Oct 2004, 181 posts, RR: 3
Posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 2232 times:

GOL (Brazilian LCC) announced its arrival to Chile, starting on the second half of the year (2005). Also Uruguay and Venezuela will be new destinantions of GOL.

It looks as though GOL will make the most out of the aviation crisis in Brazil (with VASP and VARIG)

read this article in Spanish:

http://www.tercera.cl/articulo/0,6727,3255_5676_111454860,00.html

Good news for Latin America  Smile/happy/getting dizzy


Aero...


LAN...the star of the Latin American skies
32 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineLH526 From Germany, joined Aug 2000, 2352 posts, RR: 14
Reply 1, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 2218 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

Hola Pablo,

great news! However I hope that GOL with it's competitive prices will not hurt LAN on these routes.

Saludos

Mario
LH526



Trittst im Morgenrot daher, seh ich dich im Strahlenmeer ...
User currently offlineAero From Germany, joined Oct 2004, 181 posts, RR: 3
Reply 2, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 2210 times:

Hola Mario,

great to hear from you! - I guess LAN will re-act to that announcement somehow...with new prices and offers! Brazilian-Chilean air traffic has developed very well...

i can´t wait for my flight LAN 705 FRA-SCL in two weeks!  Wink/being sarcastic


Mario: Did you see last wednesday the report of LH 526 (346) from FRA to SCL on german television?..was very interesting.

Saludos, Pablo

ps: Cuando nos vemos en FRA?



LAN...the star of the Latin American skies
User currently offlineHardiwv From Brazil, joined Oct 2004, 8780 posts, RR: 50
Reply 3, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 2206 times:

I hope that GOL with it's competitive prices will not hurt LAN on these routes

It's reality check for LAN! First, TAM late in December/04 started flying to SCL, and now low-fare GOL with its aggressive marketing, and high corporate client portfolio.

As announced last week, GOL has increased its order of B737-800 from 43 to 63 airplanes (43 order + 20 options), to be delivered from 2006 to 2010. The airplanes will be financed by Eximbank.

With this order, GOL will become a major regional player. G3's CEO stated that he plans an expansion in South America, and in 2005-2006 GOL will be landing in VVI, SCL, MVD, ASU, CCS and MIA.

Currently GOL has the biggest fleet of 737NG in LatAm (second is COPA); GOL is also the most profitable airline of the region and one of the most profitable airlines in the world (Reuters News Agency). At the moment GOL has a fleet of 29 737NGs, serving 39 destinations. GOL's domestic market share in Brazil is 22%.

http://www.voegol.com.br/

For corportate information:

http://www.mz-ir.com/gol/eng/



User currently offlineAero From Germany, joined Oct 2004, 181 posts, RR: 3
Reply 4, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 2191 times:

Hardiwv:

Competition is great for Business! LAN perfomance has improved a lot on those routes with hard competition (USA, Europe).

Have you ever been on any GOL Flight? How is it like....
Is it like a Ryanair or Easyjet flight across Europe?


I guess TAM is still your favorite Airline?




LAN...the star of the Latin American skies
User currently offlineHardiwv From Brazil, joined Oct 2004, 8780 posts, RR: 50
Reply 5, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 2186 times:

Wie gehts, Aero?

Competition is great for Business!

Indeed, because of increasing regional competition even RG has (somehow) improved its services, e.g. B777 to SCL and EZE.

Apparently the Brazil-Chile market will become like the current Argentina-Brazil market, with plenty of options, in both quality level and price.

And dont forget that as of 18 Feb/05, LH will serve GRU-SCL daily nonstop with the A346, which offers its top business product. LA recently also annouced nonstop services SCL-SSA and SCL-GIG. This year looks very exciting for the Brazil-Chile market. Overall, great improvements for the passenger.

Have you ever been on any GOL Flight? How is it like....
Is it like a Ryanair or Easyjet flight across Europe?


I would consider G3's product better than Ryanair and Easyjet, e.g. you get meals onboard (rather simple like drinks and cereal bars), and you also have a better customer service. But otherwise, G3 is a lowfare airline with a very basic product. I think it would be more comparable to some LCCs in the US such as JetBlue, for example.

I guess TAM is still your favorite Airline?

In the Brazilian market, yes. RG performance has been (consistently) poor over the last few years. Let's see if we have a turn-around for RG this year, otherwise it may become too late - some years ago RG domestic market share was 70%, and now is a mere 33%.

Rgs,




User currently offlineEZEIZA From Argentina, joined Aug 2004, 4964 posts, RR: 25
Reply 6, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 2125 times:

Amigos de Chile,

expect some incredible promotional fares from GOL! They were offering EZE/GRU for 100 U$D, extremely cheap compared to other carriers. It's obvious now that GOL is expanding internationally, do you think that the next step will be Europe or the U.S. or will they stick to what they have and make the most of it? It will be interesting to see Gol's next moves.

regards



Carp aunque ganes o pierdas ...
User currently offlineArcano From Chile, joined Mar 2004, 2406 posts, RR: 24
Reply 7, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 2108 times:

Well, first Uair and now GOL, I think it's time for Arcano to look beyond his beloved Argentina for some weekend destinations  Big grin !

I hope they will have more frequencies than UAir, it would be great to have the chance to spend a weekend in Brazil, for instance departing friday night and returning late sunday...

Hardi: LAN has been flying to SSA and GIG for a while (at least during all 2004), it's not announced as a coming destination. I disagree with you, Mario, I hope LAN gets hurt with this new competitor, this is the best way for them to react. Hope they will play right and they won't start a promotional us$50 to Brazil and later discontinue it after Gol has gone.

A question for Gol consumers: how is the price proportion of discount that GOL offers related to RG/JJ? it's half, 3/4? I hope you are right, EZEIZA

Good news indeed... I think this will also hurt charter opps. in Chile to Brazil market.

Regards )( Arcano



in order: 721,146,732,763,722,343,733,320,772,319,752,321,88,83,744,332,100,738, 333, 318, 77W, 78, 773 and 380
User currently offlineAero From Germany, joined Oct 2004, 181 posts, RR: 3
Reply 8, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 2092 times:

Hardivw:

Ganz gut und Dir?

Indeed, i think is great news! Brazil is already a beloved destination for chileans...and with good fares, traffic will increase....

what i really miss is a regional development in LatinAmerica...
Always the countries capitals (SCL, EZE, LIM, etc) get the best fares...
I miss a Embraer aircraft from Córdoba to Bahia or from Concepción (Chile) to Sao Paulo....

Everything is so centralized!!!!

...soon we´ll see both airlines also in SCL

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Alejandro Ruiz Yañez






LAN...the star of the Latin American skies
User currently offlinePPVRA From Brazil, joined Nov 2004, 8942 posts, RR: 40
Reply 9, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 2078 times:

Hola Arcano!

I checked G3s prices between GRU-GIG for the next weekend (February 11-13) and there were not much difference at all:

G3: USD 141.41
RG/JJ: USD 165.17

USD 25 cheaper, but I have seen flights that were actually cheaper to fly RG/JJ instead. Most of the time though, they are significantly cheaper.

I suggest you check their website, the prices varies a lot:

http://www.voegol.com.br/espanhol/index_ie.asp

Saludos,

PPVRA



"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
User currently offlineArcano From Chile, joined Mar 2004, 2406 posts, RR: 24
Reply 10, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 2067 times:

That's weird. I can compare GIG-GRU with SCL-CCP (both several flights a day, 2 major cities in each country).

According to Great Circle Mapper, the distance GIG-GRU is 338 kms, while SCL-CCP is 429kms. But LAN with all the so called monopoly condition charges US$130 (prices start at US$80, although not availabñle now since there's less than 7 days for the posted date)... so let's see what happen after this new player. LAN sometimes has very competitive prices!

Thanks for the link, I'll take a look

Regards



in order: 721,146,732,763,722,343,733,320,772,319,752,321,88,83,744,332,100,738, 333, 318, 77W, 78, 773 and 380
User currently offlineHardiwv From Brazil, joined Oct 2004, 8780 posts, RR: 50
Reply 11, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 2040 times:

expect some incredible promotional fares from GOL! They were offering EZE/GRU for 100 U$D

Indeed, GOL has a very aggressive marketing campaign. Normal fares EZE-GRU with other carriers are at least double the price GOL is offering now.

Hope they will play right and they won't start a promotional us$50 to Brazil and later discontinue it after Gol has gone.

You can count that if there is an airline that would go first, this will be LAN and not GOL...though I hope both remain!

A question for Gol consumers: how is the price proportion of discount that GOL offers related to RG/JJ? it's half, 3/4? I hope you are right, EZEIZA

I can compare GIG-GRU with SCL-CCP

EZEIZA is right. As I mentioned above, in the EZE market GOL prices are much lower. For example, GOL is selling NVT-EZE for USD60, while JJ/RG sell it for USD215.

What about domestic prices? It varies a lot. GIG-GRU price is a bit higher than the CGH-SDU (both Sao Paulo-Rio de Janeiro). GIG-GRU is normally only for transit pax (international flights), so is a very peculiar market. You should look at the ponte-aerea CGH-SDU.

GOL now is solid in Brazil, and 70% of its traveller are business/corporate. So some routes GOL is even more than RG/JJ. The same you have in Europe: KLM/BA sometimes is cheaper than Easyjet/Ryaner.

"Low-cost" airlines simply mean that they are, in theory, more efficient than other airlines. They do not mean "low-fares" always. However, it is often easy to acquire low fares, hence the expectation and presumption. But it must never be assumed that low-cost airlines always offer the lowest prices.

It's great that customers have the choice of whether to have no-frills (and the chance to pay for them if they want them) and a more inclusive price, plus added convenience, extra comfort, etc.

GOL's fares change as well, depending on many variables. They market their prices different from mainstream airlines. For example, sometimes GOL has some flash promotions selling tickes to any destination for R$ 1, or USD 0.37!!

Rgs,


User currently offlineMarambio From Argentina, joined Oct 2004, 1160 posts, RR: 26
Reply 12, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 2033 times:

Hardi:

As expressed in a private, Portuguese-written e-mail I sent you this morning, it was a pleasure meeting you and the other guys.

I had a pleasant arrival home, thanks for asking!

"Low-cost" airlines simply mean that they are, in theory, more efficient than other airlines.

Indeed, and that's what I was wondering. GOL, as widely known, has a low-cost structure. Are these flights to SCL suitable for a low-cost airline?

EZE still is understandable since it is a 2 hour flight, a little bit less than their flights to Manaus or Rio Branco's lenghts; GRU-EZE is 1721 km. SCL almost doubles that distance, GRU-SCL being 2617 km.

One of the basis of the low-cost system is to have very short turn-arounds. Just wondering: can they still manage to have those, even though the distance between the two cities is quite important?

Saludos,
Marambio



Aerolíneas Argentinas - La Argentina que levanta vuelo.
User currently offlineArcano From Chile, joined Mar 2004, 2406 posts, RR: 24
Reply 13, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 1991 times:

You can count that if there is an airline that would go first, this will be LAN and not GOL...though I hope both remain!

I see your point, but not necessarily; you'll see, they won't be direct competitors. After all, LAN does not offer just transport to Brazil, but also service: PTVs, Widebodies, LanPass-One World, more freight capacity... And Even when I totally agree about efficency, LAN is one efficien airline!

If there's no market for another carrier (remember also LH and its 346) and one would have to leave, it will be JJ, no tradition, not brand recognition and no FF program wide as RG or LA...

Regards )(



in order: 721,146,732,763,722,343,733,320,772,319,752,321,88,83,744,332,100,738, 333, 318, 77W, 78, 773 and 380
User currently offlineMarambio From Argentina, joined Oct 2004, 1160 posts, RR: 26
Reply 14, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 1985 times:

no FF program wide as RG or LA

Objection, Your Honor!  Big grin

The Fidelidade frequent flier program has some 3.000.000 (yes, 3 million) members spread all over Brazil and Paraguay, as it is both JJ and PZ's FFP. I believe that they are even larger than RG or LA's, though I am not sure.

Anyway, 3 million people means Fidelidade is a WIDE FF program!

Saludos,
Marambio



Aerolíneas Argentinas - La Argentina que levanta vuelo.
User currently offlineArcano From Chile, joined Mar 2004, 2406 posts, RR: 24
Reply 15, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 1975 times:

Marambio

I meant Fidelidade, although huge for itself, does not have a world alliance behind, so its impact is not that big. Regardless the impact of RG and LA by themselves could be limited, One World and Star give them world conection.
Again, size is not all that matters  Big grin

Actually, now that you say it, in JJ poor marketing done in Chile, they promote they FFP, marking how many tkts they gave last year or so. But I do think LA and RG have an advantage here. This is absolutely true at least when talking about Chilean passengers (it would be interesting to know the share of the nationality in this market), among whom JJ is absolutely unknown yet.

This is why I dare to think that if G3 actually arrives offering the best deal, the the most hurt will be JJ and their only daily 320. What is the competitive advantage they will offer against the other three?

The clue to this puzzle is simple:
a) G3 creates demand (market expansion), everybody, specially passengers, is happy
b) It's a mature market already, vegetative growing. Any new player will succeed based on taking another's cake, so one will leave the place: LH; RG, LA or JJ (and even AR, PU and PZ, besides the charters).

I think it's too early for having a proper answer, just a bunch of theories.

Please, this intends to be a market-business analysis, and not an attack to anybody!

Regards )( Arcano



in order: 721,146,732,763,722,343,733,320,772,319,752,321,88,83,744,332,100,738, 333, 318, 77W, 78, 773 and 380
User currently offlineHardiwv From Brazil, joined Oct 2004, 8780 posts, RR: 50
Reply 16, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 1931 times:

Marambio:

It was great meeting you last Saturday in Amsterdam!

Arcano:

there's no market for another carrier (remember also LH and its 346) and one would have to leave, it will be JJ, no tradition, not brand recognition and no FF program wide as RG or LA...

JJ, no tradition?
JJ, no brand recognition?
JJ, no wide FF program?

I am speachless....the biggest airline in Brazil has no brand, no tradition, no FF porgram....

Fidelidade, although huge for itself, does not have a world alliance behind, so its impact is not that big.

Impact? So you mean that TAM Fidelidade program has no impact? 3 million member, no impact? Maybe you will also tell me that Emirates, JAL or Air China programs have no impact????

Please, this intends to be a market-business analysis, and not an attack to anybody!

I can see...

Rgs,


User currently offlineAero From Germany, joined Oct 2004, 181 posts, RR: 3
Reply 17, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 1910 times:

Guys...

this is not an "Airline or Opinion contest", so there is no need in feeling attacked or getting upset...it is just an opinion and knowledge exchange...

however i appreciate your estimations and opinions (Arcano, Hardiwv).

But...does ANYBODY here cares about the regional market (intra-southamerican destinations) with regional aircraft? - Not keen on that?

Rgs, Pablo

ps: Arcano: Did you get my email regarding the video of LAN?
ps2: Hardiwv & Marambio: Are you ever in Cologne?



LAN...the star of the Latin American skies
User currently offlineArcano From Chile, joined Mar 2004, 2406 posts, RR: 24
Reply 18, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 1898 times:

I am speachless....the biggest airline in Brazil has no brand, no tradition, no FF porgram....


Absolutely not in Chile, half of the Chile-Brazil Market.

And now JJ is at the level of Emirates, JAL or Air China? Good to know..., please, tell me who is member of Fidelidade outside brazil...



in order: 721,146,732,763,722,343,733,320,772,319,752,321,88,83,744,332,100,738, 333, 318, 77W, 78, 773 and 380
User currently offlineMIASkies From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 1347 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 1891 times:

GOL @ MIA? ...now that would be interesting. The Brazilian-MIA market is covered very well by AA, TAM & RG. AA using 772 & 763, TAM using A332 and RG using 772, 763 & MD-11. All obviously larger long haul aircraft, will GOL be looking to purchase a longer haul aircraft? offering more room?.

Although GOL is great airline and I would love to see them here in MIA; I would think passengers would pick flying to Brazil on a larger aircraft than a 738.



Nothing better than making love at 35K Feet!
User currently offlineHardiwv From Brazil, joined Oct 2004, 8780 posts, RR: 50
Reply 20, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 1889 times:

Hardiwv & Marambio: Are you ever in Cologne?

Sometimes I go to Koel, since it is a great city, I can practice my German and not very far from AMS (now ICE has a good train service AMS-Koel)! Do you live in Koel, and/or are you ever in AMS?

GOL @ MIA? I would think passengers would pick flying to Brazil on a larger aircraft than a 738

MIASkies: indeed, you have a point. However, when it comes to price, passengers may well think twice. I dont know what are GOL's plans for MIA. However, GOL's CEO stated that MIA is in GOL's "wish list". I also assume GOL would fly to MIA from MAO, and not from GRU.

I also think that in the future GOL will use MAO is a mini-hub for the Andean countries.

BTW, on your MIA-Brazil list, you forgot to add LAB which flies MAO-MIA 3 x week with the 767-300.

As pointed out above, usually no-frills airlines fly short-distances. GOL is innovating in flying to EZE, SCL, and maybe MIA. [but this also happening in Europe with LCC flying to Eastern Europe, and North Africa].

As Marambio stated, for example, GRU-MAO is 1671 mi, GRU-SCL 1626 m; but MAO-MIA is 2402 mi!

Rgs,


User currently offlineMIASkies From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 1347 posts, RR: 1
Reply 21, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 1881 times:

Good point, I could definetly see them flying MIA-MAO w/ a 738 to compete w/ LAB's 763 service. For a time, TAM flew their A320 on the MIA-MAO route, is that flight still being flown or did they chose to switch over to the MIA-SSA route?

Here is the pic of the TAM A320 @ MIA...


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © David Wong




Nothing better than making love at 35K Feet!
User currently offlineHardiwv From Brazil, joined Oct 2004, 8780 posts, RR: 50
Reply 22, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 1874 times:

I could definetly see them flying MIA-MAO w/ a 738 to compete w/ LAB's 763 service

Indeed, and GOL has more chances to do well on this route, as it would offer daily flights, and lower fares [since MAO does not have the same business-demand as GRU]. LAB is doing well on MAO-MIA particularly with US tourists to the Amazon and, above all, cargo.

Honestly, I think GOL would fit well for the MAO-MIA service.

For a time, TAM flew their A320 on the MIA-MAO route, is that flight still being flown or did they chose to switch over to the MIA-SSA route?

Correct, TAM operated BSB-MAO-MIA, but performance was low, and they opted for a second daily flight GRU-MIA [1 x week MIA-SSA-GRU flight]. There are rumours that TAM will also start flights MIA-FOR-GRU.

Tks for the pic!


User currently offlineAR1300 From Argentina, joined Feb 2005, 1740 posts, RR: 3
Reply 23, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 1873 times:

They are growing up fast.I can bet that we will see them in europe next year or so.Don't forget that Europe is the main destination from S.America.With those fares they will probably hurt a lot of big fishes like they allready did overhere.In a vey short period of time they got a good piece of the brazilian market(From EZE).My uncle is fliyng to Natal next week and he paid just 150 u$s.And they were offering fares to the south for as low as 69 u$s.They are the bomb!!Hope our good ol' Varig manages to handle this!!!

saludos, Mike.



They don't call us Continental for nothing.
User currently offlineMarambio From Argentina, joined Oct 2004, 1160 posts, RR: 26
Reply 24, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 1859 times:

Hardiwv & Marambio: Are you ever in Cologne?

Sometimes I go to Koel, since it is a great city, I can practice my German and not very far from AMS (now ICE has a good train service AMS-Koel)! Do you live in Koel, and/or are you ever in AMS?


Actually I will be in Köln next Saturday but changing trains only, as I'll be coming back to The Hague from Mannheim.

Hardi, I didn't know you spoke German. As you do, you may be interested in reading an extensive article about TAM published in February's Aero International Magazine, the same number where they mention A.net!

Personally I bought it at Schiphol's aviation shop, but I bet you can get it somewhere in Amsterdam. If not, just drop me an e-mail and I'll give it to you next time we meet.

Saludos,
Marambio



Aerolíneas Argentinas - La Argentina que levanta vuelo.
25 Aero : I live and work right now in Stuttgart (same federal state as Mannheim) and i´m going to move soon to Cologne... I visit AMS at least once a year....
26 Hardiwv : I visit AMS at least once a year....so i thought it´d be great to meet! Just let me know your next time in AMS, and we could arrange a get together,
27 Marambio : Hardi, Marcos: interesting that you are getting back to FRA by train. Until some weeks ago there was a DB-ICE train running direct from AMS to FRA Flu
28 Hardiwv : Marcos: tks for the info on LH's AIRrail. It seems KL has a similar agreement for destinations in Belgium. Rgs,
29 Luisde8cd : Excellent news!!!! I really hope to see GOL landing here in CCS. I want my next vacation to be in South America. Maybe going to GRU-GIG-EZE. I wont he
30 Lima : Marcos, Hardi, I was last September in Cologne Hbf and saw that Lufthansa has there a check-in centre. They even have a conveyor belt where passengers
31 Post contains images Aero : hi guys.. Hardiwv: Thank you! I´ll let you know!..and maybe we could organize once a meeting in beautiful Cologne (a.net-meeting!) Aero is the spanis
32 Post contains links Marambio : Attached find the Lufthansa.com information regarding the AIRail system, a cooperation of Lufthansa, Deutsche Bahn and Fraport AG. http://cms.lufthans
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