JetBlast From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 1232 posts, RR: 10 Posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 15992 times:
I thought I would share this link with you. It is from James Howard Kunstler's "Eyesore of the Month" website- http://www.kunstler.com/eyesore.html
BTW, it's a pretty funny website, you might want to browse around it a bit.
I don't like how the A380 and the Airbus staff are portrayed in such a negative light here. It really is a putdown for the people who have worked so hard on the A380. What do you think? Please post your response.
NYCFlyer From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 1388 posts, RR: 9
Reply 3, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 15776 times:
I'm a big fan of James Howard Kunstler, but he tends to go off the deep end. He's an extremist. He's currently on a crusade against the culture of rampant, unsustainable oil consumption. He hates the A380 for its furthering of that culture.
While I wouldn't call the A380 an eyesore, he does have a point.
M404 From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 2240 posts, RR: 4
Reply 7, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 15544 times:
Just a point of reference. Not all the worlds Legacy carriers are or will be doing so great. You have to remember that LCCs became a large factor in the US first. At 25% of the seats now they are a large part of what ails the Legacy carriers. LCCs as completly independant carriers are still fairly new in the Asia Pacific region but already older carriers are feeling their effects. In Europe, LCC growth is rampant and cutting into yield substantially. In Latin America several names have already disappeared though LCCs were only an emerging part of their problems.
To be sure Americas older companies have many ills besides the explosive growth of the new guys on the block but we are certainly not alone. To think they are is a narrowed view approach.
Less sarcasm and more thought equal better understanding
AeroWesty From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 20822 posts, RR: 61
Reply 8, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 15519 times:
If Kunstler is "on a crusade against the culture of rampant, unsustainable oil consumption," then he should bypass putting misinformation on the internet, and should instead point out that logistical difficulties aside--that *could* be worked out if profitable, jet engines would just as love to drink hydrogen in lieu of kerosene, and problem solved. Hydrogen, we've plenty of sitting around washing up onto shores world over.
NoUFO From Germany, joined Apr 2001, 7987 posts, RR: 11
Reply 9, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 15367 times:
You know what a real eyesore is? Dig out your sunglasses and take a look at James Howard Kunstler's homepage by following the "home"-link.
Edit: Or just click here: http://www.kunstler.com/index.html but consider yourself warned!
At least eight different font colours, at least four different and arbitrarely used font sizes, different colours for links to other pages, no idea on layout and how to cluster information, a broken link to a picture (or maybe a counter) at the bottom of the page ...
Udo From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 15326 times:
Employees at the European Airbus factory celebrate while unveiling the new A380 super-jumbo jetliner. This illustrates how poorly our whole society understands the obvious trends staring them in the face -- from the lumpen-workers on the factory floor to the burnished CEOs in the executive suites.
If there are these trends, then they affect any business anywhere.
As the world descends down the flight path of oil depletion, aviation will become far less of a mass consumer activity than it has been in recent decades.
Bull. There will be ways to replace oil in some decades. Transportation of man will never stop.
Soon, in fact, flying will once again become the preserve of the ultra-wealthy elite. The 'legacy' airlines are within a few years of going out of business.
Strange, when legacy carriers are gone, will all the elite fly on Southwest and jetBlue? Bull.
The last thing the world needs now are mega-gigantic airplanes designed for a hyper-mass market.
Then any large plane would be affected…what a nonsense.
Springbok747 From Australia, joined Nov 2004, 4387 posts, RR: 10
Reply 11, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 15319 times:
I don't know anything about this Kunstler guy, but he does make a valid point if you have a look at his "Eyesores" in the various months. Not sure if the A380 is an eyesore, but it certainly isn't the most beautiful thing to grace the skies either.
Leskova From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 6075 posts, RR: 69
Reply 12, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 15267 times:
Ugh... NoUFO - even your modified warning isn't anywhere near enough... it's been a few minutes now, and my eyes still hurt!!!
Nonetheless - what the ... (insert expletive of choice) does this guy think that companies like Airbus, Boeing, BBD, Embraer, RR, PW and GE do all day long? Sit in front of statistics showing how long oil will last to see how long they've got left before their game's up?
Does he really think that no-one out there has ever taken a look at alternative fuels, and that no-one is currently developing anything in that direction?
NoUFO From Germany, joined Apr 2001, 7987 posts, RR: 11
Reply 15, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 15111 times:
He has a point, because the A380 isn't exactly the most elegant plane around and the buildings he introduces are indeed quite ugly.
But I think he contradicts himself when he (rightfully) points to the fact that fuel will become rare over the next decades and at the same time pretends that smaller aircraft with a higher fuel consumption per seat are the solution.
With an internationalized economy and an increasing number of tourists even after 9/11 and SARS, we need both - higher frequencies and bigger planes.
Neither Airbus nor Boeing denies that. They only weight each of the aspects differently.
Bill142 From Australia, joined exactly 11 years ago today! , 8487 posts, RR: 8
Reply 16, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 15093 times:
Soon, in fact, flying will once again become the preserve of the ultra-wealthy elite. The 'legacy' airlines are within a few years of going out of business. The last thing the world needs now are mega-gigantic airplanes designed for a hyper-mass market.
Lehpron From United States of America, joined Jul 2001, 7028 posts, RR: 20
Reply 18, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 14441 times:
From article: >>"This illustrates how poorly our whole society understands the obvious trends staring them in the face -- "<<
There are many market trends even within commercial aviation, Business 101 in any damn college will tell you that.
>>"As the world descends down the flight path of oil depletion, aviation will become far less of a mass consumer activity than it has been in recent decades."<<
Slife stops when there is no oil? By the sound of it this guys expects that to happen quite soon.
>>"Soon, in fact, flying will once again become the preserve of the ultra-wealthy elite"<<
There are only two choices: beat the MF silly or ROTFLAMO!
>>"The 'legacy' airlines are within a few years of going out of business."<<
This statement and the one before it prove he's either never been on a plane or never been outside the USA.
>>"The last thing the world needs now are mega-gigantic airplanes designed for a hyper-mass market. "<<
I don't think this guys has a clue as to what the world really needs. I could claim, though incorrectly, that he has been all around the greater USA and by that perspective, maybe this country could not make better use of this plane, circa 2005**. It continues to facinate me as to how some of my fellow Americans seem to confuse the US and the world's needs. Psychologically, from a mental perspective, the US is their world. Regardless, A380 isn't that much bigger than 744, in fact i think it's impact will be negligible in the short term. It won't fly full in the first few years on certain routes, certain destinations, certain times, etc. I think however it' role will be more predominate in the future WHICH IS WHAT IT WAS DESIGNED FOR!
** Perhaps 20 years from now, the USA will require maybe a few A380's on some route to some destination at some time within it's borders.
The meaning of life is curiosity; we were put on this planet to explore opportunities.
MD-90 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 8515 posts, RR: 11
Reply 19, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 14137 times:
He's got architecture down pat, even if he's senselessly bashing the A380.
Behold the model for Frank Gehry's Museum of Tolerance now under construction in Jeruselum. Financed by Americans, the museum makes an interesting case in its sheer physical form: the Post-modern must not just be tolerated, it has to be suffered. The citizens of Jeruselum will now have to suffer a building that looks like a pile of floor sweepings from a machine shop.
Behold the new $30 million Ontario College of Art & Design classroom and studio building by British architect Will Alsop -- a totemized retro-futuroid coffee table joined umbilically to its Soviet-style predecessor below. The message, apparently: art and design are nothing but fun fun fun. Nothing to get serious about. A playful spirit of induced hazard will keep students wondering when the checkered box might wobble free of its cute swizzle-stick legs and come crashing down on their heads. This exercise in hyper-entropic avant garde faggotry is so cutting edge that it is already out of date. The only question: which of the two conjoined buildings is more cruelly ridiculous?
Bernsa From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 93 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 14065 times:
From what I gather this guy knows architecture but also has deep resentment of American iconology (to which cars can be considered a large component if you look at his examples of parking lots). To be clear - he has cited several examples for nothing other than the giant US flag hanging over them - the Denny's entry comes to mind. Most importantly he's anti-technology and certainly anti mass-consumerism. Actually, he should live in an magnificent Ivory tower in the middle of a green pasture - he might seem happier there, so long as there's no power or cars or people nearby. Would a concept of an aircraft carrying 500-800 pleabs not be feared if you shared those sentiments?
Problem is, his expertise is architecture. He probably doesn't know anything more about the A380 and its realities than whatever he assumes from the media (Don't know why someone that paranoid would trust the media, but moving on - Bigger must mean more fuel consumption, e.g. Hummer and Ford Expedition). Certainly he doesn't live and brief the technical jargon a.netters do. Dude needs to stick with architecture which I admittedly haven't got a clue about other than knowing that horrid cow-like block with the umbilical cord is frighteningly ugly. Of course on that note, maybe he sees *the A380* for what it's worth, architecturally that is.
Zippyjet From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 5601 posts, RR: 12
Reply 23, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 13533 times:
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I must admit, the 787 has it in the looks department hands down. But calling the skywhale an eyesore is a little severe. You want FUGLY? follow these links regarding my ideas of eyesores.
POR2GAL From Canada, joined Feb 2005, 62 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (10 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 13470 times:
I love the A380 (I'm neutral by the way...there are planes by both A & B that I love and hate), but I agree with the editorial on this website to some degree.
#1) The A380 and Airbus will not deplete the world of oil..Boeing has a part in that too, along with every other industry in the world. I bet Kunstler drives an awfully nice and expensive car, probably with a V8 or high output V6 under the hood.
#2) Yes. The world's oil supply is being depleted. I guess he should do his part and park that fancy car of his! However, Boeing and Airbus are in fact looking at ways of making their aircraft more fuel efficient (market demand), along with the engine manufacturers.
#3) Legacy Airlines will be here for a long time to come (at least most of them), as air travel becomes less expensive (at least in our lifetime) the greater the markets for air travel will grow.
Hey, how come I've never seen Kunstler's mother on that website!!!
: Well. Once you start looking back at the previous months' pictures, it won't take you long to realize that the person who maintains this eyesore of th
: Ok, I read just one of his articles (all the negativity I need today) and decided that this guy has serious issues, he's mad at everything! He needs t
: Since we all have opinions.... mine is, the A380 is not an eyesore... but isn't the most stylish looking jet around. It's big.. but adjectives like 's
: BN747, Beauty is in the beholder. The current 747 can be said to look like a tanker also, my friend. All depends on your perspective. Besides, everyon
: The more I look at the A380 the more I like it. I'm an avid Boeing lover but the idea of seeing an A380 heavily laden taking off right over you will b
: I'm with ya, Dc863!! Wouldn't mind to experience the jetblast from an A380 at SXM on the beach either!!! Xiao!
: Dc863 - that one's easy: Singapore Airlines will fly it first - and regarding tickets... try either their website, their callcenter, any web-based tra
: POR2GAL Very true in what you say.... Some carriers thought the DeHavilland Comet was beautiful... but the 707/DC-8 ate it alive. Some carriers though
: Anyway, I'm glad most of the A.net community agrees with me! Regards JetBlast @ BWI
: Gotta admit it is still one ugly airplane, even with all the paint.
: He obviously doesn't know anything about the aircraft itself. He mentions oil depletion and hasn't realized that the A380 is extremely fuel efficient,
: James Howard Kunstler is a genius with architecture and urban planning. I read his book "The Geography of Nowhere," and he hooked me into urban planni
: He does not get that a fully loaded 767-300 only uses an average of 60 gallons of fuel per passenger to cross the Atlantic from the US to London. You
: Here is a copy of the email I sent him. It is long winded but I think I stated the case for the A380 in a well thought out answer. No I'm not a blind
: If you get a response from him, I'd like to see it. -Joe