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747-400 Question  
User currently offlineZRH From Switzerland, joined Nov 1999, 5569 posts, RR: 35
Posted (9 years 10 months 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 9280 times:

I read in a book (fiction by Tom Clancy): "He boarded the 747-400 and climbed the spiral staircase to the business class".
As I know, only the -100 and -200 had spiral staircases but the -300 and -400 with the longer upper-deck only have straight stairs. Is this again a mistake in a book or am I wrong?

21 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineBoeing Nut From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (9 years 10 months 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 9233 times:

It appears that he made a mistake.

User currently offlineCanadianNorth From Canada, joined Aug 2002, 3395 posts, RR: 9
Reply 2, posted (9 years 10 months 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 9220 times:

I've also heard that the -100 and -200s have had spiral stairs while the -300s and -400s have straight stairs. Supposedly it makes room for more seats on the main deck.


CanadianNorth



What could possibly go wrong?
User currently offlineKC135TopBoom From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12181 posts, RR: 51
Reply 3, posted (9 years 10 months 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 9216 times:

No you are not wrong, the -300s and -400s have a straight stair case

User currently offlineKtachiya From Japan, joined Sep 2004, 1811 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (9 years 10 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 9190 times:

You are right on the staircase

But even within the -200B, there are irregularities. For instance, NH used to have a fleet of 200B's that are all straight staircases. I think they wanted to seat more passengers. But an irregularity used to exist, there was on 200B that they bought second hand from British Airways and this had the unusual "SPIRAL STAIRCASE" as you say. The -SR type that NH also had straight staircases (more seats probably, article tells me that NH -100SR's were the first commercial ac to fly more than 500 people at one time.



Flown on: DC-10-30, B747-200B, B747-300, B747-300SR, B747-400, B747-400D, B767-300, B777-200, B777-200ER, B777-300
User currently offlineB-HOP From Hong Kong, joined Nov 2000, 659 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (9 years 10 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 9158 times:

VS RR powered 742 also refit with a straight staircase (2000-2001), but because of 11/9, they didn't stay for very long.

Kev



Live life to max!!!
User currently offlineZRH From Switzerland, joined Nov 1999, 5569 posts, RR: 35
Reply 6, posted (9 years 10 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 9136 times:

Thanks for the answers. I have flown on all types of the 747. In the Swissair's -200 there were spiral staircases, in all -300 (Swissair) and -400 (Singapore, Qantas) I have flown, there only were straight stairs. I posted this thread to hear if anyone knows a -300 or -400 with spiral cases. But apparently there aren't. I am always annoyed when I read such mistakes. He better did not have mentioned the type of the 747. BTW it is "The Teeth of the Tiger" by Tom Clancy.

User currently offlineKdeg00 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 145 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (9 years 10 months 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 8969 times:

It wouldn't be the first equip. error, nor the last. Stuck for some beach reading last weekend I struggled through one of the horrible Clancy spin-off Op Center books. It described the wheelchair-bound character sitting in a "room" in the middle of a TR-1, which, so far as I can tell searching through Anet and google, is a second generation U2. By the way, did anyone ever read Clancy's '94 Japan-bashing crap-novel that ended with a pre-Sep.11 747 inr=tentionally crashing into the Capitol Building?

User currently offlineAirgeek12 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (9 years 10 months 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 8957 times:

Yes, you are right. I remember seeing pics in the a.net DB of the straight and spiral staircases. Apparently he was wrong; or needed a(n) adjective to stick in there and decided spiral.  Smile It is fiction, you know! :p

User currently offlineCOAMiG29 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 515 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (9 years 10 months 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 8944 times:

is it possible for a 743 or 744 to refit with a spiral staricase? do they still have elevators?


If Continental had a hub at DFW with nonstop flights I would always fly them, unfortunantely good things take time.
User currently offlineAirgeek12 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (9 years 10 months 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 8915 times:

Quoting COAMiG29 (reply 9):
is it possible for a 743 or 744 to refit with a spiral staricase? do they still have elevators?


Not sure if it's an option or not. If the stairs are put in by the airline's interior dudes than I guess it could be possible.

No, they don't have elevators; and don't think they ever did. You must have seen "Executive Decision" haha. I saw that movie too and than started a thread about the 747's elevators. Turns out they don't have a lower galley, so nope; no elevators. I can't remember the exact a/c they said had elevators, but I know most are old airliners and aren't in service anymore. I think the LH's A380 has a service elevator, but not sure.


User currently offlineTexdravid From United States of America, joined May 2004, 1365 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (9 years 10 months 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 8896 times:

One airplane movie where they correctly showed an airplane elevator to the lower galley was "The Ghost of Flight 401" with Ernest Borgnine!!

The movie was cheesy, but being only eight at the time, I was scared witless when Borgnine's character, who was dead and coming back as a ghost, said "There will never be another crash of a L1011!!"

Unfortunately, Borgnine's character was wrong...see DL L1011 crash at DFW 8/2/85.



Tort reform now. Throw lawyers in jail later.
User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26815 posts, RR: 75
Reply 12, posted (9 years 10 months 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 8869 times:

>is it possible for a 743 or 744 to refit with a spiral staricase?<

All 747s are certified for the spiral staircase. The problem is that even if the upper deck is all J class (as it usually is) there are too many seats up there for evacuation requirements. The certification for the spiral case limits the number of seats, while the straight case can take max pax on the upper deck



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineStevenUhl777 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (9 years 10 months 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 8822 times:

Re: Elevators:

I believe the 742 and DC-10 had a small elevator to access the lower galleys. I'm thinking of UA only, but please correct me if I'm wrong.


User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26815 posts, RR: 75
Reply 14, posted (9 years 10 months 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 8787 times:

>I believe the 742 and DC-10 had a small elevator to access the lower galleys. I'm thinking of UA only, but please correct me if I'm wrong.<

I know the L1011 had elevators, don't know about the 747 and DC-10



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineCOAMiG29 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 515 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (9 years 10 months 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 8535 times:

i thought the elevator went from x to y class


If Continental had a hub at DFW with nonstop flights I would always fly them, unfortunantely good things take time.
User currently offlineDL_Mech From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 1992 posts, RR: 9
Reply 16, posted (9 years 10 months 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 8452 times:

Quoting Airgeek12 (reply 10):
No, they don't have elevators; and don't think they ever did. You must have seen "Executive Decision" haha. I saw that movie too and than started a thread about the 747's elevators. Turns out they don't have a lower galley, so nope; no elevators.


American, United and Qantas had Lower Galleys in their 747 Classics. They were optional in both the forward and rear cargo holds.

Several airlines had lower Galleys on DC-10's.



This plane is built to withstand anything... except a bad pilot.
User currently offlineKtachiya From Japan, joined Sep 2004, 1811 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (9 years 10 months 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 7019 times:

I read stuff on that there are elevators too.

I read that the 747's starting from the 200B had at least elevators for sure. You don't see crew carrying food upstairs busily right? And not all of the food is on the 2nd floor in the beginning although they have a lot. But there can always be shortages. I have sat in the upper C class many times and at least for me, I have never seen an FA running up with food/drinks, etc.

At least what I read is that the -200B's with straight staircases had an elevator in the back galley of the 2nd floor.



Flown on: DC-10-30, B747-200B, B747-300, B747-300SR, B747-400, B747-400D, B767-300, B777-200, B777-200ER, B777-300
User currently offlineC172heavy From Canada, joined Aug 2004, 107 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (9 years 10 months 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 7009 times:

As long as we're on the subject of spiral stairs and elevators, let me ask about the "observation deck" on 747s. Is the upper deck set up for passengers to visit on some models, and if so, what can you actually observe from there? I've heard about them only a few times and wondered if they did exist as such.


"How's that working out for ya?....Bein' clever?"
User currently offlineJafa From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 782 posts, RR: 4
Reply 19, posted (9 years 10 months 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 6841 times:

NWA 747-200's have spiral and some have straight stair cases. I believe it was a customer option.
All 747-400's I have seen have straight stairs. There is not a elevator, but there is a cart lift in the door 2 galley. The cart lift takes one cart at a time to the upper deck. It is just wide and high enough to hold one full size cart. Persons may not ride in it. Although NWA planes (as far as I know) never had lower deck galley's, some other airlines had them on the L1011, DC10, and 747. These lifts/elevators allowed human cargo.


User currently offlineFriendlySkies From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 4120 posts, RR: 5
Reply 20, posted (9 years 10 months 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 6544 times:

If the spiral stairs are a problem for seating, why is Boeing bringing it back on the proposed 747Adv? There will be even more seats up top, so unless the staircase is much larger, I don't see how this is possible...

User currently offlineHnl8424 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 4 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (9 years 10 months 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 6462 times:
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Here is some info that I am familiar with about the stair cases and elevators on the 747 and DC-10. United had elevators and cart elevators in both the forward and aft galleys on the 747-100 as they had lower lobe galleys, and for the upper deck they had a dumbwaiter that would lift the food trays from the maindeck to the upperdeck. This dumbwaiter was stowed in the ceiling from the main deck when not in use. On their 747-200, 400 they had only cart elevators to the upperdeck as all galleys were main deck galleys. United other aircraft that had lower lobe galleys were their DC-10-30 they had both elevators and cart lifts. Now for the stairs case on the 747-100,200.400. The 100,200 had spiral stair cases and the 400 has straight stair cases. The only other airline that I have seen a straight stair case for the upperdeck was air new zealand they had them on their 200's. Hope this helps anyone

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