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How Much Flexibility On Non-rev Tickets?  
User currently offlineFlpuck6 From United States of America, joined Jun 1999, 2122 posts, RR: 30
Posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 7460 times:

Hello everyone,

I am an airline employee but still not that experienced in non-rev travel.

How flexible are airlines in allowing non-revs to fly on a route that is also flown by other airlines?

Let's take Boston - Chicago, flown by AA, UA and TZ (ATA).

If I have a ticket for open travel on American Airlines, would a company like ATA (or UAL for that matter) accept the ticket if I were to try to non-rev on them?


Bonjour Chef!
19 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineUAopsMGR From Croatia, joined Mar 2005, 144 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 7436 times:

Flpuck6,

Generally, travel is only valid on the carrier for which the ticket has been issued. You can always purchase Multiple ID90's for different carriers on that same route, after all, they are refundable.

Brian



Kids, you tried your best and you failed miserably. The lesson is, never try.- Homer Simpson
User currently offlineSabena332 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 7431 times:

They are as flexible (or even more flexible) as a regular full flexible ticket. Last year, fellow A.net member SQ325 and I were in DXB, we had really problems to get a seat on the LH return flight to FRA so we asked at LX if they accept us for their flight to ZRH, they flew us without any problems back to Europe (with the same ticket) but of course we had to buy another ZRH-FRA ticket at ZRH.

Patrick


User currently offlineJkudall From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 615 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 7393 times:

If you are looking for NRSA tickets that can technically be used on multiple carriers, ZED fares are the only thing I can think of that will work.

As part of the ZED agreement, airlines are supposed to accept the ticket even if it is written for a different airline as long as the city pairs are the same and the fare basis (i.e. Zed Low, Zed Med, Zed High) is the same, meaning the price would be the same if you were to get a new ticket. And of course, the airline will need to have an agreement with the airline you work for. Policies might differ from airline to airline.



[Edited 2005-03-02 01:51:49]

User currently offlineHALFA From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 1347 posts, RR: 15
Reply 4, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 7346 times:

Quoting Jkudall (reply 3):
Policies might differ from airline to airline.


I think this is key. In my past travels, I had a pass to fly on EK from Johannesburg to London via Dubai but my Air Namibia flight from Windhoek was delayed into JHB and I missed my EK flight. I then took my EK pass to BA and they graciously accommodated me on their nonstop JHB-LHR flight for witch I was immensely grateful.
Last year, I had an AC pass to fly from Sao Paulo to Los Angeles via Toronto. The flight was weight restricted and I couldn't get on so I took my AC pass to Varig and asked if I could use it on their non stop GRU-LAX flight but they would not let me do it without AC endorsing the ticket, and AC would not do that so I purchased an over the counter ID75 ticket on RG to LAX. (Don't ask how much that was!)



Don't mess with Texas....We just may do that!
User currently offlineCopter808 From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 1051 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 7277 times:

...as long as the city pairs are the same and the fare basis (i.e. Zed Low, Zed Med, Zed High) is the same...

City pairs do NOT need to be the same. The ticket ZONE (distance category) must be the same or higher than that required for the (new) trip. Higher zone difference will not be refunded.

If the carriers used use the ZED fares, it's the BEST thing going! I travel between Chicago and Asia (BKK) frequently and used to buy 4 or 5 extra tickets, in addition to what I planned to fly. Now with the ZED fares, I purchase the tickets I need, PLUS several zone-1s for local Thai travel and usually a zone-5 (will get me anywhere within Asia) and a Zone-7 (which will get me BKK-LAX or BKK to anywhere in Europe where my employer has an office.). Since the ZEDs are good for 6 months, I keep them in my briefcase until used or expired.

I have been told that it's a good idea to check with any carrier that your employer may NOT have an agreement with as some of them may accept the coupons anyway.


User currently offlineAa777jr From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 7267 times:

My last flight as a non-rev, SNA-DFW, there was a DL employee, that sat next to me in F class. Very friendly man, and AA gate agents seemed to give him a priority for F class seating. This was a AA flight.

Hope this helps.

Regards.


User currently offlineJGPH1A From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 7269 times:

Quoting UAopsMGR (reply 1):
Generally, travel is only valid on the carrier for which the ticket has been issued.


I would disagree - I personally have used ID tickets issued by one carrier on flights operated by others, it's never been a problem (except sometimes in the US on domestic flights, for some reason). Most carriers don't even require and endorsement - they'll take the ticket as is.


User currently offlineFlpuck6 From United States of America, joined Jun 1999, 2122 posts, RR: 30
Reply 8, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 7214 times:

Could anyone speculate as to whether, for example, American Trans Air would accept a non-revenue ticket ticketed for American Airlines on a route such as BOS-ORD? (ATA flies to MDW while AA flies to ORD.)

Or does it just depend on who you meet that day?  Big grin



Bonjour Chef!
User currently offlineMalaysia From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 3329 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 7153 times:

not all honor ZED agreements, depends on what your airline has for ZED stuff


There Are Those Who Believe That There May Yet Be Other Airlines Who Even Now Fight To Survive Beyond The Heavens
User currently offlineJGPH1A From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (9 years 4 months 1 week 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 7081 times:

Quoting Flpuck6 (reply 8):
Could anyone speculate as to whether, for example, American Trans Air would accept a non-revenue ticket ticketed for American Airlines on a route such as BOS-ORD? (


Because ATA and AA have an interline agreement, and can therefore honour each others tickets. Most reasonable sized carriers have interline agreements with most others.


User currently offlineDABZF From Germany, joined Mar 2004, 1200 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (9 years 4 months 1 week 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 7041 times:

By the way, the best thing would be to ask from the person you get your tickets issued by - they should know all the rules and agreements!

Despite the ZED agreements, your airline must also hold a sort of "ID-interline agreement" (this is different to the rev-pax interline agreement) with the airline you would like to fly.

Normally airlines have a list published to with airlines you can fly with.



I like driving backwards in the fog cause it doesn't remind me of anything - Chris Cornell
User currently offlineUSflt1778 From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 268 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (9 years 4 months 1 week 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 6958 times:

For your example, Chris, I see a problem. AF's agreement is as follows (all the specifics are on the gp web site under "guide pratique"):

AA: ZED (medium level)
UA: ID90
TZ: no agreement

In theory any ZED carrier having an agreement with AF at low or medium level should accept your ticket as long as the zone you wish to fly is equal to or less than the one on your ticket. Within the USA, we ZED with AA, CO, US, YX, F9, HP, DL and NW (these are all ZM except NW which is ZL and DL which ZS/SkyTeam). A word of caution: some agents will insist you need to have the ticket reissued to reflect the correct carrier or city pair; just say "ok, thanks" and go find someone else. I had this happen at US while trying to use a ticket CLT-PHL to fly PIT-LGA 2 different agents in PIT were clueless and didn't want to take it.

UA will likely have no clue what a ZED fare is. Buy the ID90 for UA and refund it up to three months later if unused. The ticket can be refunded to your credit card right in station; tickets bought with cash have to be sent to FLL for refund processing.

TZ has no agreement with AF, and unless you find a clueless agent willing to take the ticket, you'll be out of luck. Plus, it could come back to you later. I know of someone in another station that was issuing ZED tickets to non-rev on AirTran (also no agreement). AirTran took the ticket and let the person fly, but it went thru all the accounting channels and they were charged for a full fare ticket many months later when it was discovered. Also their travel benefits were suspended for a year.

And a bit of advice with DL since they are SkyTeam and I fly them most often: We are ZED on them but they are ID96 on us. DL agents don't know what ZED is. More than one has said to me, in all seriousness, "I don't understand French" when I explain "it's a ZED fare." And good luck if you don't have the 2 slashes thru your ticket (as their own buddy passes are printed). AF doesn't do this but I've started putting the 2 lines thru my DL coupons since this seems to be the only way most agents can distinguish a space available ticket without actually taking the time to read it.

As mentioned earlier, I've found non-USA airlines much more accommodating with ticket acceptance.

[Edited 2005-03-04 07:00:15]

User currently offlineFlpuck6 From United States of America, joined Jun 1999, 2122 posts, RR: 30
Reply 13, posted (9 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 6912 times:

Hi Jeff!

Thanks SO MUCH for your help and actually everone else's help. Goes to show how much my own collegues are! LOL.

I am banking on taking American to ORD anyway ... I just was not sure how acceptance of tickets between airlines worked and how flexible it is (looks to me that it's not THAT flexible).



Bonjour Chef!
User currently offlineLeezyjet From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2001, 4041 posts, RR: 53
Reply 14, posted (9 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 6901 times:

The biggest problem with non-rev travel is that there are an awful lot of airline staff around the world who do not know how the system works and will tell you all sorts of rubbish.

When the tickets get issued, our ticket desk will always put and endorsement stamp on, but so many times when trying to use the ticket on another carrier than the one listed on the ticket, you get told that the ticket needs endorsing, even though it already is by the carrier who's paper the ticket is on. Alot of agents make you goto the carrier who the ticket is made out to, to get them to endorse it, which is not necessary as that carrier has nothing to do with that ticket except for having their 2 letter code in the airline box. 9-P

Then when you try and explain to them how it works, they get all shirty with you for implying that they don't know - when they don't !!

I have non reved from DXB-FRA on LH on a BD issued ticket made out to BA from DXB-LHR as I luckily got the LH station manager at DXB when I went to the desk and he knew the fare was still valid for that route.

I hate that feeling though when you are trying to come home and you are standing at the airport waiting to be onloaded - hoping that you will get accepted. It's one of the worst feelings in the world !!.

 Smile



"She Rolls, 45 knots, 90, 135, nose comes up to 20 degrees, she's airborne - She flies, Concorde Flies"
User currently offlineQQflyboy From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 2257 posts, RR: 13
Reply 15, posted (9 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 6883 times:

ZED, or Zonal Employee Discount, is the best thing that ever happened to non-rev travel. It's a global effort to simplify non-rev travel, and eventually, will probably replace ID-90s and ID-75s all together. Also, ZEDs are set to go ticketless, making it even easier. I have not heard a time frame for that.

One of the best resources out there for all airline employees is GoZED, a website dedicated to ZED fares and agreements. Check it out http://www.gozed.com .



The views expressed are mine alone and do not necessarily reflect my employer’s views.
User currently offlineNWAFA From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1893 posts, RR: 16
Reply 16, posted (9 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 6880 times:

It depends, if you want to use a ticket issued on lets say United and you want to walk over to American, then no it won't happen. Southwest is good if you have a ticket issued on WN for lets say example, PHX-LAX and you now want to go OAK-PHX, they will let you use that coupon. Airline to another airline then it won't happen.


THANK YOU FOR FLYING NORTHWEST AIRLINES, WE TRULY APPRECIATE YOUR BUSINESS!
User currently offlineQQflyboy From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 2257 posts, RR: 13
Reply 17, posted (9 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 6842 times:

The only reason you couldn't take a UA ticket to AA is because UA and AA do not have a ZED agreement. But you could easily take a ticket issued for AA, say from LAS to ORD and use it on HP or WN, as long as it is in the same zone, which is based on mileage. One of the benefits of ZED is you can take any ticket to any airline in the ZED system and use it, provided your travel is in the same zone or less, and that fare paid is the same or less as the airline you are travelling on. As indicated above, there are three levels of ZED fares: low, medium and high. Say AA uses the medium fare, provided HP and/ord WN use medium or low, the ticket could be used.

The opposite is also true. You can take a ticket issued by WN and use it on AA, provided again the fare and the zone are the same or less. A word of caution: I spoke with an AA agent in STL about this when I was based there and they didn't believe me. I told them to check N*TVLZED in SABRE, and sure enough, the agent was corrected. So, if you ever have a problem with this on AA, tell the agent to check the "star record" for ZED and all the info needed is right there. This concept is fairly new to AA, but isn't among airlines like HP and WN. I used to interchange tickets on them all the time, before ZED, without any problem.



The views expressed are mine alone and do not necessarily reflect my employer’s views.
User currently offlineUSrampleadSTL From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 102 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (9 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 6735 times:

I live and die by ZED, and agree that it's the best thing to happen to employee travel.

The one BIG problem with trying to use tickets on city pairs different than what you purchased is that if it's an international flight, the taxes are often different. For example, I flew EDI-EWR on CO--the fare itself (medium zed) was $50 I believe, but the taxes on the segment drove the price up to $140. And get this--the fare from EWR-EDI that I used was the same $50, but with taxes it was only $66.

I've never had any difficulty using different tickets for different routes, even different carriers so long as the fare basis is the same or higher. I keep a supply of these magic tickets handy at all times, and the employee reservations numbers for CO and NW (and of course US) are in my phone.

If UA and DL would ink a ZED agreement with US, my life would be complete. I guess ID95 on UA is as good or better for a lot of travel, but ZED is so much simpler.

My other dream for ZED is a "premium" ZED rate for first class travel. I find that some airlines are happy to accomodate the employees of other companies up front and some will never even think about it. I've had good luck with NW and mixed luck with CO. LH never, and BD once, but only because Y was full and I was dressed appropriately (that's a big one, dressing above and beyond the required clean slacks, closed shoes and collared shirt always wins upgrade points).



02C14MARPHLFCOMM1 - FLY THE FLAG!
User currently offlinePlaneSmart From New Zealand, joined Dec 2004, 870 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (9 years 4 months 1 week 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 6678 times:

In 2003 we were hired to test the accuracy of a module for assessing & minimising the impact of non-rev passengers for two airlines, one in the USA and one in Europe, and while testing, a 3rd from Asia joined.

The beauty of ZED is it creates flexibility for the traveller, and in turn, the airlines. You can fly, in theory, with any ZED-signatory airline, so if you can't get a seat on airline X, or don't like the seat on airline Y, so can still try airline Z and others.

We also analysed customer complaints over a 90 day period. The highest ratio of complaints to enquiries / bookings / passenger flights were received from non-rev passengers.

Have you noticed any airlines that often have no space or always want to put you at the back?


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