Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
CO Planning To Start Service To Accra, Ghana  
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32213 posts, RR: 72
Posted (9 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 10573 times:

Following CO's announcement of planed Lagos, Nigeria service, Continental today applied with the US DOT to offer daily non-stop service between Newark and Accra, Ghana. The application is very bare, and Continental has simply requested seven of the twenty-one available US-Ghana frequencies. These frequencies expire, however, on 31 March 2006, because after that, the US and Ghana will operate under Open Skies, so the fact that CO has applied for the slots hints that they may look at starting service this winter.

http://dms.dot.gov/search/document.c...m?documentid=318086&docketid=20523


a.
74 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineB4real From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 2613 posts, RR: 6
Reply 1, posted (9 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 10521 times:

WOW! CO is really building a strong network. I think soon, DL will loose the title "the leading carrier across the Atlantic" to CO, if you count these two African destinations as transatlantic destinations.


B4REAL, spelled like it sounds
User currently offlineFoxBravo From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 2950 posts, RR: 5
Reply 2, posted (9 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 10510 times:

Interesting. It's great to see CO becoming a sort of modern-day Pan Am, restoring U.S. carrier service to places that haven't had service for years, or never did in the first place. On a more practical level, it's a smart move--as the domestic market slowly gets carved up by the LCCs, many lucrative international routes remain ripe for the picking, and that's where the money is.


Common sense is not so common. -Voltaire
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32213 posts, RR: 72
Reply 3, posted (9 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 10423 times:

Quoting B4real (reply 1):
WOW! CO is really building a strong network. I think soon, DL will loose the title "the leading carrier across the Atlantic" to CO, if you count these two African destinations as transatlantic destinations.


CO still has to get ahead of American Airlines too.



a.
User currently offlineDelta4eva From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 344 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (9 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 10366 times:

Quoting B4real (reply 1):


I don't think Continental will surpass Delta anytime soon. Continental's not the only one adding service over the Atlantic. Delta starting ATL-SVO, JFK-TXL second ATL-FCO etc. With the new terminal in Boston, I'd expect even more trans-Atlantic flights from Delta in the next few years.



FLY DELTA JETS
User currently offlineDeltaMIA From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 1672 posts, RR: 17
Reply 5, posted (9 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 10341 times:

Quoting MAH4546 (reply 0):
and Continental has simply requested seven of the twenty-one available US-Ghana frequencies


How many total slots are there? And who currently uses them with Ghana Airways gone? To me 21 available slots means there was never really a need for an open skies agreement.



It's a big building with patients, but that's not important right now.
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32213 posts, RR: 72
Reply 6, posted (9 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 10265 times:

Quoting DeltaMIA (reply 5):
How many total slots are there? And who currently uses them with Ghana Airways gone?


Twenty-one to US carriers and Twenty-one to Ghana carriers, I believe.



a.
User currently offlineCadet93 From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 133 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (9 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 10200 times:

"Delta4eva"
"I don't think Continental will surpass Delta anytime soon. Continental's not the only one adding service over the Atlantic. Delta starting ATL-SVO, JFK-TXL second ATL-FCO etc. With the new terminal in Boston, I'd expect even more trans-Atlantic flights from Delta in the next few years."



CO has Berlin starting in just a few months, and already serves ROME......
I couldn't find a seat on the ROME flights this summer when I was looking to go...so the ROME flights are making them money....I booked a BF ticket to BERLIN already...I hope they make it in that market.....I have been waiting for the nonstop out of EWR for along time......


User currently offlineDeltaMIA From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 1672 posts, RR: 17
Reply 8, posted (9 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 10171 times:

Quoting Cadet93 (reply 7):
CO has Berlin starting in just a few months, and already serves ROME


He isn't stating that DL is starting FCO. DL already serves FCO as well. However this summer DL will serve FCO from ATL twice daily and once daily from CVG and JFK.

Quoting Delta4eva (reply 4):
I don't think Continental will surpass Delta anytime soon


The biggest difference is capacity. DL operates all of their transatlantic flights with 763's or larger. That is 204 seats per flight. CO utilizes a 752 and 762 along side their 777's and 764's. However DL only has a limited number of these planes so expansion will become stagnate shortly.



It's a big building with patients, but that's not important right now.
User currently offlineDelta4eva From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 344 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (9 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 10015 times:

Quoting DeltaMIA (reply 8):
He isn't stating that DL is starting FCO. DL already serves FCO as well. However this summer DL will serve FCO from ATL twice daily and once daily from CVG and JFK.



Thank you DeltaMIA, that is exactly what I was saying!



FLY DELTA JETS
User currently offlineAA787 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 610 posts, RR: 13
Reply 10, posted (9 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 9994 times:

How much market does each US airline have across the pond?

AA787



ET In NYC
User currently offlineRamerinianAir From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 1486 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (9 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 9974 times:

Cade,
When were you looking to go to FCO? There are many many seats available to FCO from EWR still left. I would estimate that this summer's bookings haven't even hit 25%.
SR



W N = my Worst Nightmare!!!!!
User currently offlineGoCOgo From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 701 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (9 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 9960 times:

Interesting, EWR-ACC. 4459nm. I imagine that would be 762 service. Surprised would go to Ghana before trying some larger African destinations like Johannesburg, Cape Town, or maybe even Nairobi.

As far as CO taking over DL as most across the Atlantic, they have a long ways to go before breaking DL's ASMs, but they probably will soon beat them as far as total destinations.



"Why you fly is your business, how you fly is ours"
User currently offlineFrostbite From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 395 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (9 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 9930 times:

Might CO be looking to combine ACC service with LOS, ie, EWR-ACC-LOS-EWR?

Routings like this are becoming rare among US airlines but it's just a thought. This way they could overnight eastbound crew in ACC instead of LOS.


User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32213 posts, RR: 72
Reply 14, posted (9 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 9924 times:

Quoting Frostbite (reply 13):
Might CO be looking to combine ACC service with LOS, ie, EWR-ACC-LOS-EWR?


Exactly. That is most likely what they are going to do, although I think EWR-LOS-ACC-LOS-EWR is more likely. Crew resting in Lagos isn't very safe.



a.
User currently offlineBehramjee From Canada, joined Aug 2003, 4716 posts, RR: 44
Reply 15, posted (9 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 9925 times:

JNB-NBO-CPT are too far for nonstop B 772ER flights with full payload capacity for CO from EWR to undertake. Plus CO dont have spare B 772ERs for those 3 mentioned African cities. Soon 3-4 CO B 777s will be devoted to daily EWR-PEK-EWR flights and others are used on EWR-HKG-EWR daily (3-4), EWR-LGW, IAH-LGW etc etc.

Both ACC and LOS will see B 762ER service on a daily basis and thats the best sized aircraft for such a route all year round.


User currently onlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16694 posts, RR: 51
Reply 16, posted (9 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 9862 times:

Quoting MAH4546 (reply 0):
These frequencies expire, however, on 31 March 2006, because after that, the US and Ghana will operate under Open Skies, so the fact that CO has applied for the slots hints that they may look at starting service this winter.


You guys called it, they are going to play it safe and overnight the crews and aircraft in Ghana. They want to serve Lagos but the safety issues have been holding them back, this is a good solution. Drop off passengers in Lagos and high tail it out of there to Ghana, pick up a new crew and trek back to Lagos staying only long enough to pick everyone up and head back home.

Quoting GoCOgo (reply 12):
but they probably will soon beat them as far as total destinations.


CO is already there, CO serves more European Cities than anyother US carrier.

.



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineEzra From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 470 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (9 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 9857 times:

I'm a bit surprised CO wants to serve Ghana as opposed to Senegal (DKR). Senegal has a much more robust economy, and there are a lot more Senegalese in the NY area than there are Ghana expats (not that expat travel makes or breaks a flight). Maybe the Ghana/Nigeria service has something to do with the fact that both those countries share an English-speaking legacy and Senegal does not?

User currently offlineAA787 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 610 posts, RR: 13
Reply 18, posted (9 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 9853 times:

Ezra-

Or its that DKR already has service to the NYC area with SA.

AA787



ET In NYC
User currently offlineEzra From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 470 posts, RR: 2
Reply 19, posted (9 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 9840 times:

Quoting AA787 (reply 18):
Or its that DKR already has service to the NYC area with SA.


I always forget about that flight. But still, DKR should be able to support two flights to NYC.


User currently onlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16694 posts, RR: 51
Reply 20, posted (9 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 9817 times:

Is there any oil in Ghana?..

Ghana Airways used to fly DC-10s into JFK, and there are plenty of immigrants from Ghana in the City.



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineDeltaMIA From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 1672 posts, RR: 17
Reply 21, posted (9 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 9782 times:

Quoting STT757 (reply 16):
CO is already there, CO serves more European Cities than anyother US carrier.


Well technically not. Although announced CO has yet to begin service to ARN, TXL, BRS, HAM, and BFS. So they are still behind DL in destinations. However in June/July they will overtake Delta with 24 cities served to Delta's 21.



It's a big building with patients, but that's not important right now.
User currently offlineGoCOgo From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 701 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (9 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 9749 times:

Quoting Behramjee (reply 15):
JNB-NBO-CPT are too far for nonstop B 772ER flights with full payload capacity for CO from EWR to undertake. Plus CO dont have spare B 772ERs for those 3 mentioned African cities. Soon 3-4 CO B 777s will be devoted to daily EWR-PEK-EWR flights and others are used on EWR-HKG-EWR daily (3-4), EWR-LGW, IAH-LGW etc etc.


NBO is less than 6500nm, so it would be fine. The other two clock in less than EWR-HKG, but would likely have some resrictions. But as you mention, the number of available 777s (and CO widebodies in general) is the problem, I imagine. Plus, I wasn't implying they should serve all of them right now, but that one of those would be better than ACC. But as has been brought up, they may be looking to have a place to park the plane and rest the crew.



"Why you fly is your business, how you fly is ours"
User currently offline777gk From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 1641 posts, RR: 18
Reply 23, posted (9 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 9722 times:

This does not surprise me. Management has spent a lot of time with representatives from the pilot and flight attendant groups, and a lot of consideration has been paid to the safety of crews on layover in LOS.

A proposal was to hire a private security firm to provide round-the-clock protection for the crews in LOS, much more than your usual escort service, but this might become cost-prohibitive in the long term, so we are exploring all of our options both to maximize profitability and ensure the complete safety of our crews on the ground. The schedule is such that an extra tag might be a viable option, but that would include securing additional freedom rights, which may further delay the launch date. I am told that if the tag to ACC comes to be, it will NOT be with local traffic rights, but will be very similar to our IAH-GRU-GIG route, with EWR-originating continuing pax only on the LOS-ACC segment.


User currently offlineCory6188 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 2686 posts, RR: 6
Reply 24, posted (9 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 9649 times:

So it's the security issues that are causing CO to drag their feet with this LOS service. I had been wondering what was taking so long...

25 RyanAFAMSP : I think this is a great move by Continental - even if it is as a tag-on to the LOS trip. So many international markets are growing in saturation, and
26 OB1783P : It's only great if the route map is the result of good market research (as I'm sure it is). Pan Am's loopiest destinations in the 60s contributed to
27 Wdleiser : It almost seems like CO is over expanding right now. I hope they don't stretch their resources to thin, but hopefully what they are doing will wind up
28 MasseyBrown : Over-expanding? Not in terms of total flying. Most of what they're doing is transferring planes from no-yield domestic routes to profitable internatio
29 ClipperNo1 : I simply love that CO is thinking out of the box here. Instead of looking into expanding on existing (over crowded) routes or markets, they just look
30 Cornish : Ghana is a more lucrative business destination than Senegal, even if Senegal's economy is more robust. Also DKR may be seen as AF territory and so ma
31 FoxBravo : While the idea of having the crew overnight in ACC makes a lot of sense, it seems to me that a triangle routing (e.g., EWR-LOS-ACC-EWR), as Frostbite
32 Kkfla737 : Wow, Co is beginning to build a Pan Am like African network. As late as 1983 Pan Am served 7 sub-saharan African cities (Dakar, Lagos, Nairobi, Accra,
33 WesternA318 : What were some of Pan Am's craziest destinations?
34 Aa777jr : DL will loose the title "the leading carrier across the Atlantic" to CO AA still does more trans-atlantic flights than any US carrier. MAH4546, Do yo
35 MAH4546 : No, but I believe the order is like this: 1) AA 2) DL 3) UA 4) CO 5) NW 6) US And I think CO will pass UA pretty soon. And, yes, few people realize t
36 DeltaMIA : Are you sure about that. Care to back it up with fact. I think DL/AA are about the same, DL may actually lead by a couple flights. The big difference
37 MAH4546 : Sorry about that, I meant to say AA has the most RPMs across the Atlantic.
38 ETStar : Here we go again, yet another thread that has to bash the Nigerians and their perceived ways... I would be more worried to be in places like Harlem an
39 RDUCO : heard rumors that it may be with a 752 with winglets. still to be announce
40 Pbb152 : RDUCO, Someone already mentioned to you on another thread that the 757's even with the winglets won't have nearly enough range to do EWR-LOS nonstop.
41 Post contains links Travelin man : Ummm... I don't think it is "Nigerian bashing". From the State Department: http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/tw/tw_928.html The Department of
42 MAH4546 : No, it won't be. The 752, even with winglets, cannot make it. Bash the Nigerians? It is a simple fact that Lagos is not a safe place. That's not bash
43 TWA902fly : If i remember correctly, Air France has a corporate jet stationed in Accra or Abidjan, so after the crew flies to LOS, they get on the corporate jet a
44 MAH4546 : Yes, they do. I don't recall where the jet goes, it is certainly not Abidjan (which has sadly fallen onto unpeaceful times lately). I believe it is A
45 N1120A : None of the 3 are too far. With ETOPS 180, it is absolutely possible. So far, however, ETOPS 180 has not been granted on that route. The 787, if they
46 Klwright69 : Well, if there will be no local traffic between Accra and Lagos, won't that make the unprofitability of that extra tag kind of defeat the profit poten
47 CALMSP : well, we can always move GVA or BRU to twice daily 75Bs....to open another widebody.......otherwise I'm not sure what we would do if we were to go wit
48 Post contains images Falcon84 : Heard a rumor today that the LOS flight is history, and will never happen. Maybe the Accra service is a new venue in Africa to introduce the CO name.
49 CALMSP : i'm not so sure about that......our top execs and other directors that i have spoken to personally are really excited about this new venture...of cour
50 5NEOO : Nope. It's COO (Cotonou). Let me give you a rundown of what happens to the various airline crew members who have the "unfortunate" experience of flyi
51 Stirling : I am not sure about "Crazy" destinations, but here is what the African/Middle East Network looked like 30 years ago: JFK-London-Frankfurt-Tehran-Delh
52 MAH4546 : There is a sizeable market between the US and Ghana. The Ghanese are among the wealthiest people in Africa, and are more likely to travel trans-Atlan
53 JoFMO : Why not make the flight [IAH-]EWR-ACC-LOS? The Atlantic crew could overnight in ACC while a seperate crew flies ACC-LOS-ACC. This kind of operation is
54 Kkfla737 : PA's late 80s service to Krakow, Dubrovnik and Bucharest can also be considered a bit crazy, and I don't believe we'll ever see any US flag carrier a
55 MAH4546 : Nothing that crazy about that one. There is a large Guayanese population in South Florida, and Universal Airlines still flies FLL-GEO. Manaus is a ke
56 Kkfla737 : MAH, where is AA on this route? I remember a few months back you posted it was a possibility-I'd love to see a US flag carrier back on the route. For
57 MAH4546 : AA has applied twice with DOT to fly Miami-Manaus, and both times they were rejected. Both times, they proposed daily 757-200 service. The main reaso
58 Klwright69 : It is funny how I read a thread starter and scroll down to the last few postings, and they have nothing to do with the thread starter. Anyway.... This
59 STT757 : CO is only interested in the West African Oil Countries, BA has been making a fortune for years with their Houston flights because of their catering
60 Soups : This is a good move from CO and was expecting it hightly. some airlines increased their service to accra more than lagos for few reasons (incl gvt iss
61 Soups : currently people who book with continental to accra and routed via their parteners KLM so i believe they already know the high factors
62 Klwright69 : I wonder if CO might eventually be interested in serving Angola. Isn't it Luanda? There is substantial oil industry there is there not? Is there any m
63 Bobnwa : Most current market share numbers for US carriers trans-atlantic are... 1. AA-21.4% 2. DL-21.1% 3. UA-17.3% 4. CO-15.75 5. NW-12.0% 6. US-9.2% Others
64 FoxBravo : Indeed there is...it's a very high-yield oil market, but there are also serious safety considerations. I believe I once read on these boards that BA,
65 Lt-AWACS : KLwright-World air flies from Houston to Luanda weekly (and Malabo). Ciao, and Hook 'em Horns, Capt-AWACS, Seven Continents Down, None to Go
66 Soups : Accra flight will NOT be linked with then lagos flight according to the Ghana Civil Aviation. they plan to serve it on a daily NON-STOP service
67 B707Stu : PA1 and PA2 originated in JFK. They were the round the world service, using B707's during the 60's! Of course...
68 Usagypsy : Have you ever been to Lagos? Its INCREDIBLY unsafe and you feel it when you are there... don't make such silly comments, I can't believe more people
69 CALMSP : i dont think we should count out LOS....if you look on p.20 of March's Continental Inflight magazine, it says, "this year we are going to fly to Afric
70 Post contains links Captaink : HMM just a thought... http://www.aneki.com/dangerous.html Here is a list of the most dangerous countries in the world. Notably Nigeria is on the list.
71 MAH4546 : It lists countries, not particular areas. Lagos is particually dangerous. Abuja isn't, neither is Port Harcourts. In Colombia, the danger isn't in th
72 Soups : a lot of people with 'fake passports' travel by land to accra and to catch flights to europe. i have encountered on a KL flight a nigerian passport ho
73 Gigneil : The winds make CPT and JNB impossible for the 777 to operate EWR nonstop with any appreciable load. N
74 N1120A : Was talking about the other way. Sorry for the lack of clarity
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
CO To Start Service To HAM From EWR posted Sun Sep 12 2004 06:04:59 by Cory6188
CO To Start Service To TLH posted Mon Feb 16 2004 18:18:01 by Cory6188
Airtran To Start Service To Phoenix posted Tue Nov 28 2006 05:28:07 by Ballsdeep
Sky Value USA To Start Service To IWA posted Wed Nov 1 2006 05:25:58 by Phxplanes
Delta To Start Service To CWL And NCL? posted Thu Aug 31 2006 03:37:13 by Evan767
CO/3M To Start MTH Service posted Sat Jul 15 2006 11:15:16 by MAH4546
CO/Gulfstream To Start PBI-TLH posted Sun Nov 6 2005 01:48:18 by MAH4546
CO, NW, DL To Start US-India Flights posted Tue Jun 21 2005 18:41:04 by Squirrel83
Astraeus Increases Flights To Accra, Ghana posted Sun Apr 24 2005 18:54:54 by Soups
CO ExpressJet To Start ERJ 190's!? posted Tue Apr 19 2005 00:54:04 by IAHTowTeam