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SAS Desperatly Trying To Get 767's  
User currently offlineBusinessboy From Norway, joined Mar 2004, 211 posts, RR: 1
Posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 11113 times:

I just read this from a norwegian newspaper. It seems that SAS is desperatly trying to find suitable 767's to reopen the OSLO-NEW YORK route.

Here is the article: www.vg.no/pub/vgart.hbs?artid=269182 ( in norwegian )

It also states how Continental Airlines is having a great sucess on the route.
And if you guys ask me, i think just getting a 767's for one route, sounds kinda stupid, its gonna cost alot of money....... SAS even states that they regretted that they got rid of their 767's soo fast.


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LOVE CONTINENTAL AIRLINES & LOVE BRITISH AIRWAYS
71 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineStarlionblue From Greenland, joined Feb 2004, 16908 posts, RR: 67
Reply 1, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 11059 times:

SAS, the experts in confusing fleet decisions...


"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots."
User currently offlineAeroWesty From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 20322 posts, RR: 63
Reply 2, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 10996 times:

I'm still just as confused as I was on this issue when it first came up a couple of months ago. Unless this site in wrong, SAS still has one 767 stored that was returned by Avianca:

http://www.planemad.net/Production_List/Boeing/767/24357.html

How many 767s do they need to operate Oslo-New York services?



International Homo of Mystery
User currently offlineCX747 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 4445 posts, RR: 5
Reply 3, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 10955 times:

If this is true, then one really has to wonder if the actual CEO's are better at running the airlines or us. They just went through a massive long haul fleet renewal and practically dumped every Boeing widebody they had. Now they want the Boeings back!!!!! I have to say that I loved seeing 3 plu 767-300ERs at EWR on a daily basis back in the late 90s early 2000s.


"History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." D. Eisenhower
User currently offlineBusinessboy From Norway, joined Mar 2004, 211 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 10954 times:

Im Pretty Confused Myself........
To who did SAS sell its 767-300's to?
BbOy  Smile

[Edited 2005-03-06 16:41:55]


LOVE CONTINENTAL AIRLINES & LOVE BRITISH AIRWAYS
User currently offlineMauriceB From Netherlands, joined Aug 2004, 2487 posts, RR: 26
Reply 5, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 10933 times:

they might get the HollandExel 767's back wich are ex SAS

User currently offlineSolnabo From Sweden, joined Jan 2008, 847 posts, RR: 2
Reply 6, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 10923 times:

Puuuhleezee!!

Whats wrong w the A333? Arent they doing a good job, or is this another Airbus bash........againe?

B767: Thanks, but no thank you.

Micke/SE  vomit 



Airbus SAS - Love them both
User currently offlineAS739X From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 5997 posts, RR: 24
Reply 7, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 10882 times:

Solnabo...I am under the impression the A333 is just to big for Oslo. The 763 was a perfect for this SAS market. Maybe SAS should be the first airline run by A.netters.

ASSFO



"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
User currently offlineCX747 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 4445 posts, RR: 5
Reply 8, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 10855 times:

Very well stated AS739X. I don't think it would be difficulty for them to find suitable 767-300ERs to fly the routes. I assume that there are quite a few paked at Victorville in Cali!


"History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." D. Eisenhower
User currently offlineAeroWesty From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 20322 posts, RR: 63
Reply 9, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 10852 times:

Quoting Businessboy (reply 4):
To who did SAS sell its 767-300's to?


This link will take you to the history and current status of the 767-300's that have been in SAS' fleet:

http://www.planemad.net/Production_L...eg=1&field_fate=1&rpp=150&search=1



International Homo of Mystery
User currently offlineWedgetail737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5830 posts, RR: 5
Reply 10, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 10823 times:
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Not too terribly likely, but it would be cool to see SAS order more 767's to keep the line open. Couldn't they use 767-200ER's if there are some available in the desert?

User currently offlineWhiteHatter From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 10814 times:

Quoting Solnabo (reply 6):
Whats wrong w the A333?


Probably a bit too large for the route, plus there aren't exactly fields of parked A330 aircraft of any type available at the moment! A 767 would be easier and cheaper to source.

Especially if SK can offload one of its underused A330 aircraft to BD temporarily, and ship in a 767 to cover. SK has a stake in BD and the latter is desperately looking to lease in another aircraft. The proposed LH arrangement for an A340 might not be ideal for them.

SK took a BD A332 for a while before their aircraft were delivered. The SK A333 could operate MAN-ORD, releasing an A332 for LHR-BOM. Just some rumours I heard about fleet possibilities.


User currently offlineFlying-b773 From Singapore, joined Apr 2001, 390 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 10800 times:

The A330s that they have have around 250 seats, which seems slightly too big for the sector. Also, if there isnt much cargo on the route itself than it would be cheaper to operate the 767 for more cost savings. Guess the size of the 767 is really good at starting routes.... Way to go 767!! i love them...

regards,


User currently offlineAeroWesty From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 20322 posts, RR: 63
Reply 13, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 10802 times:

Quoting MauriceB (reply 5):
they might get the HollandExel 767's back wich are ex SAS


In the last thread on SAS' 767's I asked about this, but no one was able to answer what the status of the Exel group was after their collapse. The websites for BelgiumExel and HollandExel both appear to be active, but all the content is in either French, Flemish or Dutch, and I'm unable to read it.

Anyone have any idea whether those planes are parked, or still running as charters for the tour operators listed on the Exel websites?

Thanks.  Smile



International Homo of Mystery
User currently offlineMauriceB From Netherlands, joined Aug 2004, 2487 posts, RR: 26
Reply 14, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 10710 times:

well the sold BonairExel, CuracaoExel, ArubaExel, and axed BelgiumExel. But TUI is about to take over the airline and i dont know if they wan't to hold the SAS crafts or take other 767's....

User currently offlineDeltaWings From Switzerland, joined Aug 2004, 1294 posts, RR: 17
Reply 15, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 10672 times:

This is another reason, why Airbus should replace the A300 line. The A330 is just to big for certain routes, whereas the A300 size (763) would be perfect. SAS would mostlikely be a customer for it.


~DeltaWings



Homer: Marge, it takes two to lie. One to lie and one to listen.
User currently offlineEmirates Skies From Australia, joined Nov 2001, 171 posts, RR: 3
Reply 16, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 10506 times:

Can't SAS get an A330-200 for the Oslo-Newark route? If an A330-200 is too big, can't they get an A310 or an A300 from somewhere? And shouldn't they consider getting an A350 or two for future longhaul ops (inc. EWR) out of Oslo for which the A330-200 might be too big? What on Earth is going on at SAS?

Vad hander SAS?!!! I really think this airline should get their act together. It's been confusing me lately  Smile



Take nothing but photos, leave nothing but footprints
User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26196 posts, RR: 76
Reply 17, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 10479 times:

Quoting AeroWesty (reply 2):
How many 767s do they need to operate Oslo-New York services?


Theoretically, just 1, but it is always good to have a spare.

Quoting Solnabo (reply 6):
Whats wrong w the A333?


Well, it is bigger, heavier and uses much more fuel than the 763. OSL-EWR is not the most heavily traveled route and CO is using a 752 on the route. An A333, or even A332 would be an absolute waste of capacity.



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineSk945 From Sweden, joined May 2002, 432 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 10453 times:

There are a lot of rurmors (as usal). SAS have talked to Icelandair about leasing one or more B757 from them, to use on USA routes during the winter season. Also, there are a lot of rumors saying that SAS would bring back a couple of B763 to be used to open new routes. Ex ARN to Asia but also other new routes.

The A333/A343 could be to large and SAS have no money, but there are no used Airbuses around for SAS to buy. I thought that SAS stil own a couple of the stored B767. If so, its much cheaper to put them in traffic again.


User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26196 posts, RR: 76
Reply 19, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 10409 times:

Quoting DeltaWings (reply 15):
This is another reason, why Airbus should replace the A300 line. The A330 is just to big for certain routes, whereas the A300 size (763) would be perfect.


The A300 is also heavier than the 763 and does not have the same kind of range to allow for flexibility.



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineHeisan67 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 10289 times:

SAS is looking for about 5 aircrafts B757/767 in order to expand their route network. 10 months after closing their OSL-EWR they suddenly find it interesting again.... Note that CO opened a daily nonstop service just days after SAS pulled out. During winter they have operated 3 weekly flights. According to CO the service is doing very well. SAS didn't do a very good job...since they 10 months afterwards finds it possible to restart the service again.
SAS is desperate to get a longhaul route out of Oslo after CO started their service.


User currently offlineGodBless From Sweden, joined Apr 2000, 2752 posts, RR: 16
Reply 21, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks ago) and read 10221 times:

SAS wouldn't be the first airline to retire a type from the fleet and then reintroduce it again... Air Canada and the L1011, Lufthansa and the 747-200,... But in SAS's case it would have really been better if they had kept them. What I really don't get is why they did not want to use the 767 for expansion after they got the A330/A340 fleet, after all the order was placed when things still looked really good in the Aviation scene.

But then again, wouldn't it be boring if there weren't any airlines that brighten up the scene with their fleet? After all it was very boring in Scandinavia for many years when basically every airline just used the MD-80...

Max


User currently offlineHeisan67 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks ago) and read 10150 times:

And now most of the airlines use B737.....boring!
SAS Braathens
Norwegian
Sterling
FlyMe


User currently offlineJc2354 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 564 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks ago) and read 10117 times:

Didn't the Mexicana 767s come from SAS? Are they leased, or did MX purchase them?


If not now, then when?
User currently offlineGigneil From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 16345 posts, RR: 86
Reply 24, posted (9 years 1 month 2 weeks ago) and read 10096 times:

Quoting WhiteHatter (reply 11):
The SK A333 could operate MAN-ORD, releasing an A332 for LHR-BOM.


I'd think they'd want to operate the 332 on MAN-ORD, and send the leased 333 to BOM. They could really use the lift on that route.


Quoting N1120A (reply 19):
The A300 is also heavier than the 763 and does not have the same kind of range to allow for flexibility.


Clearly, he was talking about a future A300 not the current one.

That being said, the OEW of an A300 is precisely the same as a 767-300ER, almost to the tonne, and the MTOW of the 767-300ER is higher by some 15 tonnes.

The A300 carries significantly more passengers and cargo, but yes it does not feature the same range.

N


25 FlyTheFlag : Yesterday at Washington/Dulles, saw a SAS flight to Copenhagen using a United B767-300. Is it some sort of lease arrangement? There were SAS employees
26 Heisan67 : Since SAS do not have enough aircrafts United aircraft is used on this servive...I belive untill March.
27 N1120A : It is a wet lease that has been discussed a bunch on A.net. SAS (again, because of the short-sighted retirement of the 767s) is short aircraft due to
28 EddieDude : One SK 763ER has been leased to MX. It is a 2 year lease I believe. I don't recall how long ago the lease started.
29 Boac707 : 767's seem popular these days. Air canada scambling to find some and now SAS...without bashing airbus...is there some value to 767's that all the airb
30 MauriceB : Add Martinair to youre list, they are also searching desperetly for another 767, but can't find one that fast. and nope, the KL's one's are already re
31 Peppes1980 : This wet lease will end in march, and from 27 of march the route will be flown by SK and Airbus 330 once again.
32 A340600 : Are SAS the dumbest fleet planners on this Earth or what! I don't get their fleet at all! Sam
33 N1120A : Well, they are the lightest, lowest trip cost widebodies that fly. It means expansion with lower risk. They are also cheaper to aquire. There really
34 Post contains images Lockheed1011 : SAS can easily lease a couple of 767's for now and order the 787. Also, that EWR route was dominated by SAS until CO came along. SK made three big mis
35 B707Stu : I sitting here shaking my head wondering a) how could SK put themselves in this position? and 2) there are so many desert 767's out there I don't see
36 N1120A : That is what this whole thread is wondering The problem is most of those are 762/762ERs and are not what SK needs SK needs the 763/763ER, which are i
37 Post contains images Flybynight : Sam Man, am I tired of hearing how dumb SK is with their fleet. It has become a cliche answer around here. Let's look at the fleet, which was in the
38 Post contains links and images Boeing73G : It makes a lot of sense, Flybynight. In fact, Boeing Capital has a 762ER (serial #23624) and if you look on http://www.boeing.com/commercial/airtrade
39 Galapagapop : Most people forget that Airbus is partially owned by the SAS group, so the A321, A332/3 and A343 should have been expected but then again they had 737
40 Klm : I'm confused about SAS and the 767's but it sure is better for them to use a 767 than a A330, the market is simply not big enough. A little of the top
41 N1120A : No it isn't. It is 80% owned by EADS, which is a combination of Aerospatiale, DaimlerChrysler Aerospace and a Spanish concern. The other 20% is BAe S
42 Sv11 : Are most of SAS routes just too big for the A330/A340? Or is it just a few that need a smaller aircraft. sv11
43 Gigneil : S.A.S is a type of corporation in France. It doesn't mean that SAS owns part of Airbus. N
44 N1120A : Part of it is a need for smaller aircraft, especially out of OSL. Also, they just don't have enough planes to keep all their routes going. As it is,
45 Flybynight : SK's A343 flight between SEA and CPH are usually very full. I believe most of the flights to the USA are pretty full. I don't know about the long dis
46 Copenhagenboy : Flybynight I stand with you. When SAS needed to replace the longhaul fleet, the 767 were to small. SAS had to say no to a lot of passengers, bacause t
47 GodBless : Not that it is that important, but SK serves Berlin mainly with the DH4 from CPH and the MD80 from ARN. From what I heard the 737-900 was too small f
48 Airborn86 : Well no offence to SAS, but I think their decisions are very stupid. First they get rid of their 767s which were all in perfect shape. Now they want t
49 Post contains images 777ER : SAS says: A333 for the OSLO-NYC: thanks, but no thanks, prefer the B763 thank you
50 Danny : I fly at least twice a year on US routes with SAS and I haven't been on a single flight that would not be 100% full. The KIAD flights on a wet leased
51 Sk945 : Just to clarify something. SAS would like to get some more planes for thinner routes. Not replace the A333/A343. They need to expand - thats the probl
52 Eric : The original article also states that SAS had the options on more A330/340 but had to cancell due to 9/11, SARS etc... When SAS tried to introduce an
53 Orion737 : I hope they can find one. Serves SAS right that CO is doing well on the route. SK abandoned long-haul from Oslo as soon as they could. 9/11 was the pe
54 CEO@AFG : When you look at SAS' history, it's not a big surprise why they are in this mess fleetwise. Since SAS inception in 1946 they were a loyal Douglas cust
55 Orion737 : They have made mistakes with fleet planning for years. I remember them buying A300s for European routes only for them to find they were too big and th
56 Post contains images Businessboy : I have to laugh, SAS really has to figure this one out, before they really get stuck.... BBoy
57 Post contains links Danny : "They need to expand - thats the problem " I think they should shrink rather than expand. With 57% load factor every flight widens the loss. http://ne
58 CEO@AFG : Would the deferred US Airways A330 order enable SAS or any other airline to take up early delivery spots for the A330? Wasn't deliveries supposed to s
59 Persotvik : Hi There! The money is in longhaul business, not on short European, Scandinavian and domestic sectors where the competition is stiff and yields low! S
60 Doug_Or : I beleive they operated the BAC-1-11, Caravelle, and A300 as well. As far as basic aircraft families (IE 767/757, A310/A300), the only basic jet types
61 KaiGywer : With unbacked rumors I have from my uncle, who is a mech with SK, the A300 was bought configured as a short haul trunk route plane, to be used on lon
62 Flybynight : I agree that SK's profits are best served by long haul flights. I believe the SEA - CPH is one SK's best flights. It is a very popular flight here in
63 BOAC911 : I'm glad someone remembered the Caravelles.. Also, at one point SAS leased Vickers Viscounts as an interim measure to relieve capacity shortages in th
64 Matt27 : There were plans to set-up a CPH-SFO route, but after 9/11 the plans were cancelled.
65 GodBless : You can add the 777 to the list. Max
66 Post contains links Bennett123 : http://www.speednews.com/listings/jetindex.html Speednews shows 23 assorted B767 available, what does SK need, (varients, engines etc).
67 Cornish : It's just another example of why SK is in such a mess right now - heavy financial losses, confused fleet strategy, confused product strategy (Snowflak
68 AKelley728 : I assume they would want similar aircraft to those that they got rid off, -300ERs with PW4060 engines. Of the 23 listed on Speednews only two -300ER/
69 Bennett123 : If they are that desparate, then I suggest take the 2 and negotiate on some/all of the other 5.
70 Heisan67 : And not to forget SAS Braathens route between Oslo and Berlin -TXL is operated by B737-600. So SAS operates 3 different aircraft types from Berlin to
71 Caravelle : Main point in this thread has already been made: Leave OSL - EWR to CO. SK always competes with one goal in mind: Get rid of competition. Once they've
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