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Any Winglet Kits In The Works For DC-9 (MD-80/90)?  
User currently offlineMason From United States of America, joined Jun 1999, 748 posts, RR: 1
Posted (9 years 9 months 1 week 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 7301 times:

With the winglet craze, raked or otherwise, especially on a few 727s and 757s as of late, anyone know if any airlines are interested in kits for the DC-9 series (any variant)? Aesthetics aside, they do seem to be popular with the 737s. Also, anyone besides CO ordered them for their 757s? Thanks.

13 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineNewark777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 9348 posts, RR: 29
Reply 1, posted (9 years 9 months 1 week 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 7291 times:

I doubt the DC-9's fly long enough routes to warrant the development of winglets. Just wouldn't be economical. Plus, with the DC-9's aging and starting to be replaced, there is little point in developing winglets for a plane that is going to be gone in the near future.

Harry



Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26775 posts, RR: 75
Reply 2, posted (9 years 9 months 1 week 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 7289 times:

The wings are swept back too far to winglets to be all that successful. As far as the 757 goes, I believe FI has ordered them as well.


Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineNwafflyer From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 1050 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (9 years 9 months 1 week 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 7283 times:

what about dc-9's from FNT to Florida? that's a pretty long flight

User currently offlineLN-MOW From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 1909 posts, RR: 13
Reply 4, posted (9 years 9 months 1 week 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 7198 times:

There is a winglet project available for MD80. Not sure who is behind it, but I know SAS is looking long and hard at it as one option to extend the life of its MD80's.


- I am LN-MOW, and I approve this message.
User currently offlineMason From United States of America, joined Jun 1999, 748 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (9 years 9 months 1 week 22 hours ago) and read 7023 times:

I know some airlines (AS) had tanks for the -80s long flights to Russia. Not sure how much range this offered. Although no longer produced, the MD-80/90 will be flying for many years to come, for better or worse.

User currently offlineStarlionblue From Greenland, joined Feb 2004, 17164 posts, RR: 66
Reply 6, posted (9 years 9 months 1 week 22 hours ago) and read 7002 times:

Winglets on the 727 are primarily used to make them noise compliant (faster climb).

With all the MD-80s in service, I have no doubt someone is thinking about it. These planes are hardly going out of service and many carriers see long lives ahead for them.



"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots."
User currently offlineFlybyguy From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 1801 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (9 years 9 months 1 week 22 hours ago) and read 6980 times:

DC-9s are "gas guzzlers" that's a bigger problem than just a simple reduction in drag provided by winglets. It's synonymous with putting a lighter frame on an 1980 Cadillac. Sure you would save the weight and increase fuel economy, but you still have an inefficient engine on the car.


"Are you a pretender... or a thoroughbred?!" - Professor Matt Miller
User currently offlineStarlionblue From Greenland, joined Feb 2004, 17164 posts, RR: 66
Reply 8, posted (9 years 9 months 1 week 22 hours ago) and read 6956 times:

Quoting Flybyguy (Reply 7):
DC-9s are "gas guzzlers" that's a bigger problem than just a simple reduction in drag provided by winglets. It's synonymous with putting a lighter frame on an 1980 Cadillac. Sure you would save the weight and increase fuel economy, but you still have an inefficient engine on the car.

You're quite right, but since the airlines are going to keep them anyway, in particular AA...



"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots."
User currently offline7E72004 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 3587 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (9 years 9 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 6918 times:

Hey...is there anyone who can take a northwest DC-9 picture and put some winglets on it so we could all be amused??  drool 


The next generation of aircraft is just around the corner!
User currently offlineIanatstn From United Kingdom, joined exactly 11 years ago today! , 577 posts, RR: 4
Reply 10, posted (9 years 9 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 6902 times:

Quoting 7E72004 (Reply 9):
is there anyone who can take a northwest DC-9 picture and put some winglets on it

I agree, anyone with any skill in photoshop willing to give us an insight into what this bird could look like?

Cheers,
Ian.



Ian@STN ::
User currently offlineNWADC9 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4898 posts, RR: 9
Reply 11, posted (9 years 9 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 6895 times:


Looks stupid Silly

BTW, yes, it's supposed to be that size. It's not a computer problem or anything.



Flying an aeroplane with only a single propeller to keep you in the air. Can you imagine that? -Capt. Picard
User currently offlineAA737-823 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 5943 posts, RR: 11
Reply 12, posted (9 years 9 months 1 week 20 hours ago) and read 6844 times:

I take offense to the "DC-9s are gas guzzlers comment"!!!
If they were such gas guzzlers, why would NW be so content to keep them?
Granted, they burn more fuel than newer types, but they must not be THAT bad.
And, the MD-80 is said to burn less fuel that the 737-800, by merit of its lighter weight. It won't hold as many people, true.
So, I don't think that one can make a sweeping statement that "DC-9s are gas guzzlers."

As far as winglets, someone pointed out that most of them aren't flying long flights. Well, that's true for the most part. But, Northwest is bringing -9s in to Dallas from Detroit and Memphis, and maybe MSP too. AND American is flying their nearly 400-strong MD-80 fleet on long flights: Dallas to Seattle (about 4 hours), Dallas to DCA, Boston, et cetera. So I think the advantages of winglets would be realized in these applications.
Particularly when we consider the weaknesses of the MD-80 are its wings. The MD-80 is known for having to burn off fuel to before it can climb up to the mid 30s. On a recent flight from California to DFW (also over three hours), our MD-80 cruised at FL290 for an hour before climbing up to FL330, and the captain explained that we had to burn fuel before we could reach our final cruising altitude.
SO- I think winglets would help, and I think American would be a prime customer. Heck, they could be the only customer, and the project would still be worthwhile, with 360 of the of the bloomin' things.
And really, no matter how INefficient the plane may be, if you can save 5% on your fuel burn, that's 5%. Come to think of it, 5% translate to MORE fuel saved on an inefficient plane than on an efficient one:
Let's say the MD-80 burns 3000 pounds per hour.
3000 X .05 = 150 pounds SAVED.
Now let's say the 737-700 burns 2800 pounds per hour.
2800 X .05 = 140 pounds SAVED.

Thoughts? Comments?
Have a good Wednesday.
R


User currently offlineDrerx7 From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5209 posts, RR: 8
Reply 13, posted (9 years 9 months 1 week 19 hours ago) and read 6833 times:

Well, to answer the question as to why Northwest keeps them--because they are paid for. The DC9s are gasaholics-but at this point it is cheaper to keep paid for aircraft than pay lease/finance rates on top of gas; this is a huge part of the reason why NW has been able to stay out of financial trouble like US or UA.


Third Coast born, means I'm Texas raised
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