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Cubana Accident  
User currently offlineHelgali From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 1 posts, RR: 0
Posted (9 years 4 months 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 5468 times:

Anybody knows about the accident in Caracas Venezuela?? Ilyushin Il-18 de Cubana de Aviación ?

20 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineTedTAce From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (9 years 4 months 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 5410 times:

http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/N28635010.htm here you go!

User currently offlineLuisde8cd From Pitcairn Islands, joined Aug 2004, 2571 posts, RR: 31
Reply 2, posted (9 years 4 months 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 5077 times:

The aircraft involved was indeed an IL-18 (CUT-1539) but it wasn't Cubana's. That aircraft belongs to Aerocaribbean http://www.aero-caribbean.com/

The plane aborted its take off roll but was unable to stop before the end of the runway. 13 people were injured, including 6 people in serious condition.

It is suspected that the crew decided to abort take off due to a mechanical failure, but this has yet to be investigated.

Here are some pics cortesy of rescate.com




PS: Does anyone have some info regarding this airline?


User currently offlineMIAMIx707 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (9 years 4 months 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 4961 times:

That one has an unusual color scheme, very simple 1970's looking cheatline.. they usually have a blue belly imitating the sea and palm trees on the fuselage.

Anyways Luis, I believe these planes were used by the Cubana mainline a while ago and are now flying for AeroCaribbean which is basically another division of Cubana handling touristic flights around the Caribbean area with IL-18s, An-24s, ATR-42s and Yak-40s. However now looking at that fairing on top of the tail, perhaps this was an ex-military Russian machine? It could be, since that different cheatline might be from it's previous operator. Is that an antenna, a fuel tank or what?

What a coincidence there was another accident not too far from Venezuela just a few days ago, that one was sadly a fatal one, involving another turboprop, the Turbolet L-410.


User currently offlineLuisde8cd From Pitcairn Islands, joined Aug 2004, 2571 posts, RR: 31
Reply 4, posted (9 years 4 months 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 4734 times:

I'm not an expert on Soviet airliners, so maybe someone can help us here to figure out what is that thing on the tail of the IL-18.

Here are a couple of pics coutesy of rescate.com





After some research here are some facts regarding this specific a/c

-It was manufactured in 1983
-Was delivered as an IL-22 to the Soviet Air Force
-Adorned with additional sensors and antennae, Il-22 , an Il-18 derivate designed as electronic reconnaissance aircraft and flying command post.
- In 1998 it was converted to an IL-18 as flew in Aeroflot colors.
- In Nov 2003 it was sold to Cubana.


User currently offlineAirplane From Ecuador, joined Sep 2004, 256 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (9 years 4 months 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 4660 times:

They should follow a law suite against the passengers for irresponsibility on willing to fly on an airplane like that.  sarcastic 


The sky´s the limit
User currently offlineMIAMIx707 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (9 years 4 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 4483 times:

Actually while old, that plane is pretty sturdy even with the right wing broken there seems to have been no fire.

Quoting Airplane (Reply 5):
They should follow a law suite against the passengers for irresponsibility on willing to fly on an airplane like that.

Seeing that many of the passengers were cubans returning to cuba, they didn't have much of a choice I don't think.

However seeing the flag in your user name, is not like Ecuador's airlines' safety record, even with somewhat never and western planes is any better  sarcastic  At least Cuba can always resort to the "excuse" of the embargo for it's use of old soviet aircraft. No doubt though, for the number of flights they have, Cubana has a very poor safety record.


Luis, do you know how how high is that hill where the plane came to rest? I'm surprised it stopped right at the top. The passengers might have been quite lucky on that one..


User currently offlineHR001 From Honduras, joined Nov 2004, 303 posts, RR: 2
Reply 7, posted (9 years 4 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 4450 times:

Quoting Luisde8cd (Reply 4):
After some research here are some facts regarding this specific a/c

-It was manufactured in 1983

Newer than most of TAME's fleet


User currently offline757MDE From Colombia, joined Sep 2004, 1753 posts, RR: 6
Reply 8, posted (9 years 4 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 4226 times:

Quoting MIAMIx707 (Reply 3):
What a coincidence there was another accident not too far from Venezuela just a few days ago, that one was sadly a fatal one, involving another turboprop, the Turbolet L-410.

Yess, a West Caribbean Airways Let-410 Registered HK-4146 at Providencia Island (very close to San Andrés). Some 8 people died, including both Pilots.

Crashed plane:


MyAviation.net photo:
Click here for bigger photo!
Photo © CARLOS A. OSORIO ARANGO



[Edited 2005-03-29 22:47:03]


I gladly accept donations to pay for flight hours! This thing draws man...
User currently offlineViasaMSY From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 91 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (9 years 4 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 3651 times:

Luis:
Wondering why the Venezuelan online news services have not reported the accident. Is Maiquetia open?



Rebuild New Orleans!!!
User currently offlineAirliner777 From United States of America, joined May 2000, 493 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (9 years 4 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 2650 times:

Quoting MIAMIx707 (Reply 6):
Seeing that many of the passengers were cubans returning to cuba, they didn't have much of a choice I don't think.
No doubt though, for the number of flights they have, Cubana has a very poor safety record.

I agree. Unfortunately CUBANA has a bad safety record, but I would still love to fly in one of those old IL-62Ms.  Big grin

Too bad CUBANA will not go Boeing anytime soon!  Sad


User currently offlineStpeterc From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 38 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (9 years 4 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 2578 times:

One of the worst things was when I was waiting to board my flight back to the US from Cuba. I was waiting for the American Eagle flight from MUCU to MIA. I saw an Aerocaribbean IL-18 land and then turn around and watched it 'taxi' to the terminal building. Only the plane must have been doing 40-50kts on the ramp and it weaving between other aircraft and parked vehicles.

Shockingly unsafe operations.

Chris


User currently offlineLuisde8cd From Pitcairn Islands, joined Aug 2004, 2571 posts, RR: 31
Reply 12, posted (9 years 4 months 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 2473 times:

Quoting Airplane (Reply 5):
They should follow a law suite against the passengers for irresponsibility on willing to fly on an airplane like that.

That will be hard... those pax were all doctors part of a plan called "Barrio Adentro" (doctors inside the slums). Cuban doctors will be asigned a host family living in Venezuela's poorest slums to work in that area without the needed materials. Many of them live in inhumane conditions, and some of them have deserted and asked for political assylum in foreign embassies in Venezuela.

So they were basically forced to fly that plane.

Quoting MIAMIx707 (Reply 6):
Luis, do you know how how high is that hill where the plane came to rest? I'm surprised it stopped right at the top.



Quoting MIAMIx707 (Reply 6):


Luis, do you know how how high is that hill where the plane came to rest? I'm surprised it stopped right at the top.

I'm not sure... but SVMI chart's elevation is 242 ft, and that hill ends about 100 meters from the coastline. Maybe it's around 200ft high.

Quoting ViasaMSY (Reply 9):
Luis:
Wondering why the Venezuelan online news services have not reported the accident. Is Maiquetia open?

Here's El Universal:
http://www.eud.com/2005/03/29/ccs_art_29282D.shtml

And yes, Maiquetia is open. Domestic traffic was slightly affected for a couple of hours. International flights suffered no delays.


User currently offlineLuisde8cd From Pitcairn Islands, joined Aug 2004, 2571 posts, RR: 31
Reply 13, posted (9 years 4 months 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 2459 times:

Quoting Airplane (Reply 5):
They should follow a law suite against the passengers for irresponsibility on willing to fly on an airplane like that.

That will be hard... those pax were all doctors part of a plan called "Barrio Adentro" (doctors inside the slums). Cuban doctors will be asigned a host family living in Venezuela's poorest slums to work in that area without the needed materials. Many of them live in inhumane conditions, and some of them have deserted and asked for political assylum in foreign embassies in Venezuela.

So they were basically forced to fly that plane.

Quoting MIAMIx707 (Reply 6):


Luis, do you know how how high is that hill where the plane came to rest? I'm surprised it stopped right at the top.

I'm not sure... but SVMI chart's elevation is 242 ft, and that hill ends about 100 meters from the coastline. Maybe it's around 200ft high.

Quoting ViasaMSY (Reply 9):
Luis:
Wondering why the Venezuelan online news services have not reported the accident. Is Maiquetia open?

Here's El Universal:
http://www.eud.com/2005/03/29/ccs_art_29282D.shtml

And yes, Maiquetia is open. Domestic traffic was slightly affected for a couple of hours. International flights suffered no delays.


User currently offlineAirliner777 From United States of America, joined May 2000, 493 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (9 years 4 months 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 2369 times:

Quoting Stpeterc (Reply 11):

One of the worst things was when I was waiting to board my flight back to the US from Cuba. I was waiting for the American Eagle flight from MUCU to MIA. I saw an Aerocaribbean IL-18 land and then turn around and watched it 'taxi' to the terminal building. Only the plane must have been doing 40-50kts on the ramp and it weaving between other aircraft and parked vehicles.

Shockingly unsafe operations.

Chris

Hey Chris, that's because you have never seen Bahamian pilots doing their island hopping duties. HAHAHAHA  rotfl   Big grin

They even got tinted windows on their general aviation aircrafts! HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Quoting MIAMIx707 (Reply 14):

Nothing like the big round windows of the IL-18 to look out and see the emerald-green Caribbean! Just looking out the window and seeing those turboprops at work.. ahhh

Mario, stop dreaming bro! LOL


Airliner777


User currently offlineMIAMIx707 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (9 years 4 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 2159 times:

I'm not dreaming Adel, I was just reminiscing for a moment HAHHAHA

Yesturday I was watching the news and some Cubana mechanic that now lives in Canada was saying how when he worked in the island there was a shortage or spare parts and even lack of tools.. yikes!

A news crew was showing the interior of the hijacked AN-24 at Key West and commenting how it looked to have been poorly maintained.


User currently offlineMD11Engineer From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 13968 posts, RR: 63
Reply 16, posted (9 years 4 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 2134 times:

What does a f*cking news crew know about aircraft maintenance?  sarcastic 

These planes will keep on flying under conditions most modern western planes will pack up.

Jan


User currently offlineStpeterc From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 38 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (9 years 4 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 2104 times:

Quoting MIAMIx707 (Reply 14):
Just a wild guess, you are a bit on the geeky side aren't you? I would love to have seen such a thing. Your lucky to nowadays see an IL-18 in the first place... What is such a horrible and shocking thing for you, for others it would've been a much-loved sight

Actually MIAMIx707, it mostly has to do with the fact that I'm a pilot and an airport operations person so safe operations on the airport are always a concern to me. So, I found it pretty hard to enjoy what I saw. The only thing enjoyable about watching it was getting to watch it in Cuba.  Big grin

Chris


User currently offlineMIAMIx707 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (9 years 4 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 2085 times:

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 17):
What does a f*cking news crew know about aircraft maintenance?

Gee, I knew someone would say something similar hahah, how did I know..?

Maybe not really mechanically speaking, but you can tell from the interior, the seats on the cockpit etc.. that plane could be in better condition.

I agree soviet-built planes are strong, long-lasting machines. Just look at that IL-18 there, it's still in one piece. Even if the news exaggerate things, (this was the spanish news by the way, as the english news don't really care), as the mechanic was saying, it's a miracle those planes are kept flying. Cuban civil aviation has one of the worst safety records in the world. Numbers don't lie, if you have any doubts look up info on a site such as aviation-safety.


There are probably more incidents that never reach the press only when there is a fatal crash, especially involving tourists or in a foreign nation, such as this one, the DC-10 in Guatemala and the Quito crash. In fact, had this incident being inside Cuba we'd probably never see those images, perhaps not even hear about it.

Anyone has that Cubana IL-62 DVD? On the way back from BOG to HAV, the pilot seems to be drunk.. lol


Sorry to hear you didn't enjoy it Chris Big grin


User currently offlineAirliner777 From United States of America, joined May 2000, 493 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 1842 times:

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 16):
These planes will keep on flying under conditions most modern western planes will pack up.

Are you serious man? Give me a break!  no 


User currently offlineMD11Engineer From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 13968 posts, RR: 63
Reply 20, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 1804 times:

I´m damn serious. Russian planes from the 1950 to 1990s were built to act as military transports in case of war. They are all designed to be able to operate from dirt runways (In northern Siberia e.g. it is often not possible to build concrete runways due to the frost cycle. In winter they´ll land on frozen rivers and in summer on dirt). Technologically they are very straight forward and have lots of redundancies. Structurally they are built like tractors.
The only western planes I´ve seen, which were built to similar standards are the Douglas planes.
If you´ve got an opportunity, have a close look at Russian planes.

Jan


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