Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
How Is This Legal?  
User currently offlineBoeingForEver From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 219 posts, RR: 0
Posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 18837 times:

Look at this picture and description of an iberia flight, being pilotted by a friend of the pilot. This is a commercial airline, on a commercial flight, and thres a civilian flying it!!



View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Ismael Jorda




Description:EC-FGV (cn 207) Pilot flying is my friend Rub�n Beter� turning on right base with a sharp turn of 30 degrees bank. Landing gear is in transit and flaps two are set. With landing gear down he will ask for flaps 3 and turning on final Rub�n will demand flaps full for a perfect visual approach and landing on runway 27. Congratulations Rub�n.

114 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineZonky From New Zealand, joined Nov 2004, 432 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 18795 times:

If we assume that the photographer is a iberian pilot;

why do assume that the person in the right seat is not?

Are you not 'friends' with some of your fellow workers

Why are you assuming he is a civillian?

[Edited 2005-03-29 17:32:25]

User currently offlineBoeingForEver From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 219 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 18767 times:

if thats the case, then its very unprofessional that he is in civilian clothes

User currently offlineA319114 From Netherlands, joined Aug 2004, 541 posts, RR: 3
Reply 3, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 18746 times:

It's probably a training flight, too. Secondly, mr Beteré (the 'civilian' flying) is probably a pilot (in training maybe)

And of course, there's still someone on the left seat.



Destruction leads to a very rough road but it also breeds creation
User currently offlineZonky From New Zealand, joined Nov 2004, 432 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 18716 times:

No it's not.

Try this pic.


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Ismael Jorda



Look at the description.

Eat humble pie.

Relax.


User currently offlineBoeingForEver From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 219 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 18512 times:

so why is he wearing civilian clothes

User currently offlineTACAA320 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 18471 times:

Quoting BoeingForEver (Thread starter):
Look at this picture and description of an iberia flight, being pilotted by a friend of the pilot. This is a commercial airline, on a commercial flight, and thres a civilian flying it!!

Why are you making conclusions based only in the clothes he was wearing?

IB is a very serious airline, and will not put in risk passengers life?


User currently offlineAirNZ From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 18395 times:

Boeing ForEver

What exactly are you getting so het up about, and what exactly do you mean by a 'civilian'?
Irrespective of whether a pilot is wearing his airline's uniform at any particular time he, or she, is still a commercial pilot.....and thus a civilian!
Furthermore, I see no description in any photo which indicates to me it is a 'scheduled' flight, so why are you assuming that something (in your opinion) is so-called badly wrong here? Personally speaking, as long as the guy is qualified to fly the plane, what difference does it actually make how he's dressed, remembering that 'professional' is an arbitary opinion.


User currently offlineSabenapilot From Belgium, joined Feb 2000, 2714 posts, RR: 46
Reply 8, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 18395 times:

Base training is the final stage of the type rating training and comprises some touch and go maneuvers... Just like all training, it is done in casual clothing at most airlines.... Although you always will have the odd company where pilots always have to show up in uniform, even for their simcheck!

User currently offlineBoeingForEver From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 219 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 18363 times:

very unprofessional..he shouldnt publish those pictures without a complete description..very misleading

User currently offlinePetertenthije From Netherlands, joined Jul 2001, 3363 posts, RR: 12
Reply 10, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 18295 times:

Where does it say that the person in control is NOT a pilot? He says that the pilot that is flying is his friend... that's all!


Attamottamotta!
User currently offlineTedTAce From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 18238 times:

Quoting Sabenapilot (Reply 8):

Good Analysis Sabenapilot

The Picture says "for a base training session". I'm sorry, but if there are no Pax involved you can wear whatever you want as far as I'm concerned.


User currently offlineShamrock_747 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 18202 times:

I think by reading the description it is quite obvious what the situation is.

User currently offlineMandala499 From Indonesia, joined Aug 2001, 6841 posts, RR: 75
Reply 13, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 18199 times:

Civilian = Non Diplomatic and non Military and in some countries non-law enforcement personnell... So, airline pilots "are" civilian...  Smile

"so why is he wearing civilian clothes"

Some (if not most) allow training flights to be conducted out of uniform though restrictions on what type of clothing apply.

So what's so unprofessional about it?
I don't see why this picture is misleading... afterall, the photographer is not obliged to put information in the description box. And he didn't lie either...

mandala499



When losing situational awareness, pray Cumulus Granitus isn't nearby !
User currently offlineHR001 From Honduras, joined Nov 2004, 303 posts, RR: 2
Reply 14, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 18191 times:

Does the uniform makes the pilot or the licence on his wallet?

User currently offlineAsstChiefMark From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 18168 times:

I thought I read somewhere that pilots can wear street clothes if they're assigned to a cargo flight.

Mark


User currently offlineSabenapilot From Belgium, joined Feb 2000, 2714 posts, RR: 46
Reply 16, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 18166 times:

Quoting BoeingForEver (Reply 9):
very unprofessional..he shouldn't publish those pictures without a complete description

There is a complete description actually, maybe not on EACH picture as such, but the full series was well commented... besides, even without a description it is perfectly simple to understand what is going on there, it's just that you didn't think of it. You just thought the pilots invited some guy up in front to actually fly a plane! very plausible indeed, certainly at a world class airline like Iberia!

Anyway, being a professional pilot is something different then walking around whole day long in a uniform.


User currently offlineBoeingForEver From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 219 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 18075 times:

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 11):
The Picture says "for a base training session". I'm sorry, but if there are no Pax involved you can wear whatever you want as far as I'm concerned.

where does it say that?? picture implies some guy just came up to fly the plane


User currently offlineLeskova From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 6075 posts, RR: 70
Reply 18, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 17986 times:

Quoting BoeingForEver (Reply 18):
where does it say that?? picture implies some guy just came up to fly the plane

No, it doesn't.

It just implies, and rightly so, that Rubén Beteré is a friend of Ismael Jorda - everything else is what you're reading into the description...

Regards,
Frank



Smile - it confuses people!
User currently offlineCitationJet From United States of America, joined Mar 2003, 2432 posts, RR: 3
Reply 19, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 17948 times:

Quoting BoeingForEver (Reply 5):
so why is he wearing civilian clothes

What's wrong with wearing civilian clothes on a training flight?
I have been on a 747 non-revenue ferry flight where the pilots wore civilian clothes in the cockpit. There were no flight attendants on board, and no one was in uniform. It was no big deal.
Are you OK with pilots not wearing their uniforms in the flight simulators?



Boeing Flown: 701,702,703;717;720;721,722;731,732,733,734,735,737,738,739;741,742,743,744,747SP;752,753;762,763;772,773.
User currently offlineOzGlobal From France, joined Nov 2004, 2716 posts, RR: 4
Reply 20, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 17882 times:

Quoting BoeingForEver (Reply 9):
very unprofessional..he shouldnt publish those pictures without a complete description..very misleading

If you haven't worked it out, here's what happened:

i) You saw a photo, read the discription and jumped to conclusions
ii) Your conclusions made you indignant
iii) They were demostrated to be mistaken and even ill-judged
iv) Now you're mad at the photographer because you jumped to conclusions

Let it go.



When all's said and done, there'll be more said than done.
User currently offlineJtamu97 From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 658 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 17803 times:

We are all missing the point..At Least he has CLOTHES on!!

[Edited 2005-03-29 21:08:31]


Propeller, we don't need no stinkin propeller
User currently offlineAT502B From South Africa, joined Dec 2004, 347 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 17764 times:

My father who is a Flight Standards Captain/Check Airman for UA 767/757 fleet, has flown revenue trips out of uniform, it's not uncommon.


I love the smell of jet fuel in the morning.
User currently offlineLimaFoxTango From Antigua and Barbuda, joined Jun 2004, 784 posts, RR: 1
Reply 23, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 17718 times:

BoeingForEver, I guess you really didn't read what the Photographer said in the description. It said, and I quote "Pilot flying is my friend Rubén Beteré turning on right base with a sharp turn of 30 degrees bank....". It does not say "Person flying is.....". So thence forth, it is clear to see the individual flying is NOT a "civilian". Whether or not it is a training flight is another story and I shall not get into that.


You are said to be a good pilot when your take-off's equal your landings.
User currently offlineBeeweel15 From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 1751 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 17067 times:

Wait a minute was it not here in the US, a few years ago, that two pilots flew a regualar schdueled flight naked. I cant remeber the airline but I do remember they got fired for doing it.

For many years I have seen many Pilots fly ferry and training flights in civilian clothing. I see no problem with it so why do you.


25 Starlionblue : Southwest IIRC.
26 ZOTAN : It was two WN pilots. Im not sure of the specifics, all I know is that it was two WN pilots naked in the cockpit.
27 QuestAir : I friend of mine went into the cockpit (invited, of course) of a Tristar a couple years ago inflight. The captain let him move the thrust handles forw
28 Post contains links Jtamu97 : Here is a link that kind of talks about the Southwest Incident: http://www.usatoday.com/travel/news/...003/2003-04-25-sw-naked-pilots.htm
29 FlyMeToTheMoon : BoeingForEver... it is not legal! Let's call the lawyers, sue them, transfer some wealth! Why in the world do we have to start by assuming the worst?
30 Iberia340600 : BoeingForEver: Have you ever heard the saying..."when you assume..." Geez....are you kidding me? You really think some guy just came up to the cockpit
31 Garnetpalmetto : FlyMe...the McDonald's hot coffee case isn't the best example of a frivolous lawsuit. Trust me, you don't want to go there - it's more legit than you
32 FSPilot747 : And land it, too, smoothly.....
33 Jafa39 : "With landing gear down he will ask for flaps 3 and turning on final Rub�n will demand flaps full for a perfect visual approach and landing on ru
34 CcrlR : There are a lot of reasons why they are dressed like that but the reasons from me are they are testing the aircraft out, learning to fly the aircraft,
35 Post contains links and images 65captin : The point is... someone new to an aircraft, or in training will not have to wear their uniform. If they are in "Civilian" clothes then I can assure yo
36 AirRuss : It's obvious from a minimal amount of investigatory work that the photographer is an IB A320 First Officer. He is a frequent poster (669 photos) and h
37 Iberia340600 : CCrl: The answer is quite simple. They were doing a training/rating flight. There are no passengers on that plane and they are allowed to wear causal
38 Post contains images Milan320 : Someone is really uptight here. It happens once in a while that pilots wear casual clothes. I think it's cool. I was on an AC flight, and the pilot wo
39 Boeing727flyer : I would say that they are training flights.
40 Post contains images FlyMIA : BoeingForEver: All it says is his friend is flying the plane. A friend can be a pilot too. Pilots have friends too. [Edited 2005-03-30 05:13:43]
41 Post contains images BaylorAirBear : You had the nerve to ask that around here? BaylorAirBear
42 David T : Do you want to be Ruben's friend? I want to be Rubens friend! Looks like a sharp dressed man as well! (Now if there was a fuzzy guitar in the cockpit?
43 Post contains images Newark777 : I would! Harry
44 Post contains images Zippyjet : Imitation is the best form of flattery! That feisty white palimono did it first and in his skivies! Back in the early 60's, that talking horse, the fa
45 65captin : lol...I guess I forgot who would be reading this.
46 CaptainT38 : This is my first post to Airliners.....glad to be aboard. I work for a scheduled airline and there are times when it comes to having a crewmember fly
47 Oly720man : As a "civilian", though aeronautical engineer, I have sat in the captain's seat in a BA L1011 and in the copilot's seat of a BA B767, both en route MA
48 IL76TD : Who says crews have to be in uniform in the cockpit, would you want to wear a tie and dress slacks for 9 hours while you are working in a private plac
49 Howard500 : BoeingFor Ever, seriously, relax.... its ok..... we all make mistakes. Yours is a pretty big assumption and a ridiculous conclusion so let it go.....
50 Post contains images HAWK21M : Arn't commercial pilots Civilians.Unless its the Air Force. The report does not elaborate. regds MEL
51 Post contains images Mig21UMD : Is the guy in the first pic really a pilot??? I mean look at his hair!
52 Post contains images Bearcuban12 : I think what has happened here is that Mr BoeingForEver has realised that it is an Airbus, and he has jumped at the chance to have a dig at it...... H
53 Post contains images ACDC8 : Pilots aren't making as much money as they used to so they can only afford 3 haircuts a year now.
54 B752fanatic : Hey, let him be worried, in the past we have seen a lot of accidents ocurring because civilians are flying the airplane, one great example was the Aer
55 BoeingForEver : What major international airline would allow their pilots to have long hair like that..how can you take the pilot seriously with that hairdo..i would
56 Post contains images Airplanepics : They allow you to fly?
57 BoeingForEver : yes, i have a nice clean haircut.
58 LimaFoxTango : It's not what's on top a person's head that makes them a good pilot, it's what's in it. Plus BoeingForEver, will you ever come to the conclusion that
59 Leskova : You know, you really should have quit while you were behind... now you're really seriously making a fool of yourself. Everyone makes mistakes once in
60 Dreamer : I think that comment was uncalled for, there are many both knowledgeable and well mannered people who enjoy FS(all versions).
61 Komododx : As we were discussing in our forum, just let them be. I'd rather be an FS freak than an armchair CEO as many in this forum are. That's the reason I b
62 LPLAspotter : BoingForEver: Since my original post was justifiably deleted by the moderators (and I do apologize for my ignorant and asinine comments - no excuse),
63 Wukka : Are you for real? Seriously?! If anything I would persecute him for having the 'Miami Vice' turned-up-collar. I'm sure that the Airbus was blasting J
64 Post contains images ACDC8 : Heh, heh, heh! "Ladies and Gentlemen on behalf of your flight crew today Cpt. Sonny Crockett and F/O Ricardo Tubbs, we would like to thank you for fl
65 Post contains images Wukka : Hehe! I can just imagine Crockett and Tubbs with an A-3Ferrari with modified gull-wings. The flight crew uniform is white linen pants, cuffed, and de
66 Post contains images Javibi : Then you'd rather check in advance if I am part of the crew scheduled for your flight, so you do not waste your time going to the airport. Unbelievab
67 Mandala499 : If a pilot for my flight has that attitude I'd probably walk off the aircraft. J/K He can have hair longer than his body for all I care, but if he's
68 Post contains images Aloges : Here's one for all who have a problem with pilots in casual clothing:
69 TedTAce : Beautiful!!! I only wish it could have been a pretty topples GIRL instead!!!
70 Gigneil : Then there's no way you're the VP of anything, anywhere. N
71 FlyPrivate : Instead of everyone criticizing BoeingForever I Understand His Point of View The Pilot in the Right seat is flying a Commercial Plane He could be the
72 Pelican : I suggest you to read the whole thread. It's not unusal by any means to wear casual clothing on a training flight. Have you ever considered the possi
73 Post contains images ACDC8 : Now the jumpseater is standing? This is getting better and better.
74 MD11Engineer : Have you ever been on the flight deck of a A320? Sit in the jump seat, fully strapped in and take the picture with a digital camera lifted above you h
75 Jeb94 : Pilots fly in street clothes all the time, either in recurrent training flights, ferrying an aircraft for maintenance or reposition, dead heading out
76 Iberia340600 : Boeingforever: You know...when you started this thread, I thought you MAYBE truly did not know that he was on a training flight, but seeing this comm
77 Sabenapilot : Relax dude.... There's nothing illegal here! First of all, it might come as a shock to a seemingly extremely law obeying person like you, but contrar
78 Wukka : So the undercover on duty shouldn't be able to arrest the drug dealer on the corner of the street that you live on before they break into your house
79 Post contains links and images StealthZ : I guess our ever so professional .. Mr Boeingforever would not fly with one of North Americas most respected carriers either.. View Large View MediumP
80 BoeingForEver : this guy is doign the nazi salute...how could i ever fly american again
81 Post contains images Bully707 : Sorry...but that way out of line...even if meant sarcastic!!!! Bully
82 Mandala499 : This thread and the thread originator's comments are beginning to sound like a very bad april fool's joke! Someone please lock or delete this thread..
83 Leskova : You know, reading - and knowing - something about history would be a very good idea before making truly idiotic remarks such as that one... Somehow I
84 MD11Engineer : Somebody better lock and delete the originator of the thread. Jan
85 Bearcuban12 : This is without doubt the funniest thread I have ever read on any forum. I work with a bunch of people just the same as BoeingForEver. They make a sma
86 Post contains images XFSUgimpLB41X : There was a pilot at my airline that scheduling was begging to take a flight... there was no way he could change into his uniform and he was going hom
87 252MKR : OK--SO we are not allowed to have "April Fools" threads--but we can have inane threads like this?!!! 1) Airline Pilots are civilians 2) Every pilot ha
88 Bearcuban12 : THE 2005 "BoeingForEver" AWARDS. I propose a competition for all you Pilots out there... Please paste photos on this thread of people flying in funny
89 Mig21UMD : This has been very enertaining. The suggestions by some Germans and the Indonesian that this should be deleted is just cruel! By the way I believe I w
90 Post contains links and images Mandala499 : Well, if do want to go down the silly way... here goes *for Mig21UMD's entertainment* Nominations for the 2005 "BoeingForEver" AWARDS... From www.smar
91 Bennett123 : Were the WN sacked for being naked or were there other issues, such as drugs or drink?. I am not making allegations, just asking.
92 Zvezda : UA's test pilots never fly in uniform. I don't think they even have uniforms. Having flown with some of them, I have no doubts about their professiona
93 Amy : Top post Mandala! That had me laughing for a good while!
94 Zvezda : When I've been in the cockpit doing touch-and-goes during test flights, the test pilot in command always asked me to be buckled into the jumpseat whe
95 Post contains images MD11Engineer : What about this story about this BA F/A in Rome a few years ago? She made a bet with the cockpit crew that they wouldn´t arrive in FCO on time. The c
96 TedTAce : The thing I remember about emergency training procedures was that the cardinal rule was "keep flying the plane" (reminds me of Douglas Addam's "Don't
97 Bearcuban12 : Well Mandela is currently in the lead - I rate 1st and last photos as the best
98 Post contains images Zvezda : Until MD11Engineer posts photos of the BA FA at Rome.
99 Post contains links FlyPrivate : The Steward Is Flying The Plane... (by Bofredrik Mar 30 2005 in Civil Aviation) Please read the attatched thread 3 or 4 post listed stories of Pilots
100 Post contains images Bearcuban12 : Apologise to BoeingFor Ever???? Fly Private - have you not even read this thread????
101 BoeingForEver : All this thread was meant to say, was that the photographer should have been more clear with his photo description. It shows his friend in civilian cl
102 Wukka : Based on your comments above, I can well see how you could be a VP of a very large company, since you: a) failed to admit your mistake b) blame it on
103 Post contains images ACDC8 : That was probably the smartest post I've read in a long time!
104 AirNZ : Actually no, BoeingForEver, all this thread said was that you read something you didn't understand, then stupidly jumped to an asinine conclusion. It
105 NZ1 : God help us all. I hope you perform better for your airline than you have shown in this thread. Well said AirNZ NZ1
106 Post contains images Bully707 : Well...maybe you should have said so...still very sad to see a "VP" of anything act so insensible!!!! Godspeed Bully
107 StealthZ : Since Mr ForEver started this thread by defaming and casting doubts on the professional integrity of a very highly regarded major airline. He might d
108 Post contains images ACDC8 : That shouldn't be too hard to figure out. We just gotta hang out at an airport and look for the pilots who are always in uniform and with the shortes
109 Post contains images Bully707 : US Virtual Airways??? Pan Am??? Just a thought.... Bully
110 Post contains images Wukka : Mandala499: Beautiful pics! I'm with you on the "Rasta Rocket" being my favorite of the bunch. Do you happen to know what type of a/c that pic was ta
111 BoeingForEver : John Carpenter- VP- corporate affairs AMR corp American Airlines
112 Wukka : Yet you still can't admit that you might be a little off on your judgement? I admire that you take the time to play here with the armchair CEOs as we
113 StealthZ : And you accused one of your captains of performing a Nazi salute and told the world(well this little A.netter part of it) that you would never fly wi
114 Post contains images Future757 : A VP has time to waste on this forum. Oh and by the way, I would pay money for a seat on a touch and go. When I first saw this thread I couldn't figur
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
How Is This Legal? posted Sat Nov 30 2002 17:45:16 by Lekky-Man
Is This Legal? posted Sun Jan 1 2006 00:16:56 by AC345YYZ
Delta: How Is This A Sale? posted Thu Nov 3 2005 05:11:53 by TWA902fly
How Is This Possible.. posted Sat Mar 12 2005 04:53:40 by Jfkaua
HOw Is This Travel Deal Possible? posted Tue Aug 6 2002 18:58:21 by Mirrodie
How Is This Possible posted Tue Dec 4 2001 20:33:21 by Tg 747-300
How Is This Possible..... posted Fri Nov 16 2001 18:30:15 by N2805WWest
HOW Is This Possible!? posted Thu Nov 1 2001 02:31:18 by Erela
How Is This Possible? posted Sun Oct 14 2001 23:28:42 by Aeromexico495
How Is This Possible?! posted Tue Oct 3 2000 00:20:26 by Mason