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CO To Cali  
User currently offlineCOfaninBOS From United States of America, joined May 2004, 287 posts, RR: 0
Posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2978 times:

Has a date been announced for service on CO from IAH to CLO?

I ask this because I was flying today from BOS to IAH and noticed that the new April magazine in the seat back pocket had that route in red (meaning it will start soon). I was unaware that a date had been announced. Anyone in the know?

50 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineRCS763AV From Colombia, joined Jun 2004, 4395 posts, RR: 12
Reply 1, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 2892 times:

Yes its pending approval from Aerocivil and FAA....


Les escribo desde el frío de mi verde altiplano.
User currently offline102IAHexpress From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 1156 posts, RR: 3
Reply 2, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 2663 times:

Seems like CO is going to delay their Cali service until August 15. CO states the reason for the delay, is due to the lack of a jet bridge for their B737.

http://dms.dot.gov/search/document.c...m?documentid=324422&docketid=20150


User currently offlineTACAA320 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 2654 times:

The previous link says "United States/Columbia". Do they really know the difference between Columbia and Colombia? And please don't tell it was an errata.

[Edited 2005-04-12 07:24:47]

User currently offlineDeltaMIA From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 1672 posts, RR: 17
Reply 4, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 2636 times:

Quoting 102IAHexpress (Reply 2):
CO states the reason for the delay, is due to the lack of a jet bridge for their B737

That is a poor excuse. How can they cite that when they already fly their 737's to international stations without jetbridges (i.e. GCM).



It's a big building with patients, but that's not important right now.
User currently offline102IAHexpress From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 1156 posts, RR: 3
Reply 5, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 2635 times:

Quoting TACAA320 (Reply 3):
The previous link says "United States/Columbia". Do they really know the difference between Columbia and Colombia? And please don't tell it was an errata.

Good observation. In the actual application written by CO “Colombia” is used, so I think CO knows the difference between Colombia and Columbia. But as far as the DOT that’s a different matter. You would think the DOT would know the difference because they are headquartered in the District of Columbia.


User currently offlineSumma767 From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2004, 2561 posts, RR: 6
Reply 6, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 2576 times:

At least we know that the permission has been granted. The excuse for the delayed start is certainly a lousy one.
Is the jetbridge required for a 737 different from the one for a 757? AA flies there daily without much problem. Or is different for one for an MD83. AV has these type there all the time without problem.
More to the point. Continental owned Copa flies its 737s to Cali daily, and does not seem to have a problem.


User currently offlineRCS763AV From Colombia, joined Jun 2004, 4395 posts, RR: 12
Reply 7, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 2559 times:

Actually, CLO has jetbridges hat can fit an Avianca 767, what a lame excuse.....


Les escribo desde el frío de mi verde altiplano.
User currently offlineSWACLE From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 376 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 2488 times:

Could they mean that they can't get gate space or ticketing space, not just a jet bridge, figuring that the average traveler may be able to understand the no jetrbridge arguement better?

DC



Aircraft Flown: SF3 DH8 DH4 328 ERJ CRJ CR7 CR9 E70 E75 D9S M80 712 72S 732 733 734 735 73G 738 739 739ER 752 318 319 32
User currently offlineSumma767 From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2004, 2561 posts, RR: 6
Reply 9, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 2432 times:

SWACLE, their reason for delayed the start of operation to Cali is given, not in a press release to customers, but in an application for deferral to the US Department of Transportation.
It is written by lawyers, and in my mind, they wanted to give an excuse that put the delayed start of operations as something not being their fault.
You can tell that CO is afraid that they will revoke the rights given to them, as DOT only guaranteed the route rights if CO starts it by June 23rd 2005. If another US airline applies for those frequencies (on any other route) they could risk losing them. I wonder if the reason might not be aircraft allocations?
I am sure that only 10 week deferral is not a problem though.


User currently offlineA300AA From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 394 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 2339 times:

Lack of space in CLO? No way, that's only an excuse.
Anticipating that AA will begin its second frequency to CLO 4 times a week on a 757, beginning June 9.
There are enough jetbridges to handle 4 Intl airlines out of CLO.
By the way does anybody knows why AV again is operating its flight from CLO to MIA with a stop in BAQ?
And why they downgrade its MDE flight to a MD83?
I thought it was for low season , but loads are growing from those two cities very fast, AA is always full.

Thanks in advance


User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32787 posts, RR: 72
Reply 11, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 2329 times:

Quoting A300AA (Reply 10):

By the way does anybody knows why AV again is operating its flight from CLO to MIA with a stop in BAQ?
And why they downgrade its MDE flight to a MD83?
I thought it was for low season , but loads are growing from those two cities very fast, AA is always full.

Aircraft shortage.



a.
User currently offlineTACAA320 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 2307 times:

Quoting A300AA (Reply 10):
Lack of space in CLO? No way, that's only an excuse.

Lack of space no. Lack of aircrafts.


User currently offlineRCS763AV From Colombia, joined Jun 2004, 4395 posts, RR: 12
Reply 13, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 2270 times:

Quoting A300AA (Reply 10):
Lack of space in CLO? No way, that's only an excuse.
Anticipating that AA will begin its second frequency to CLO 4 times a week on a 757, beginning June 9.
There are enough jetbridges to handle 4 Intl airlines out of CLO.
By the way does anybody knows why AV again is operating its flight from CLO to MIA with a stop in BAQ?
And why they downgrade its MDE flight to a MD83?
I thought it was for low season , but loads are growing from those two cities very fast, AA is always full.

There is a 757 in the paintshop and another 757 is doing operations from BOG in flights with loads bigger than what the MD-83 can carry, but AV will add 2 MDs and a 757 this year, so dont worry about aircraft shortages.



Les escribo desde el frío de mi verde altiplano.
User currently offlineSOUTHAMERICA From Colombia, joined Dec 2003, 2497 posts, RR: 10
Reply 14, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 5 days ago) and read 2255 times:

Quoting RCS763AV (Reply 7):
Actually, CLO has jetbridges hat can fit an Avianca 767, what a lame excuse.....

Exactly.

CLO and MDE had handled AV 767 for years, until very recently when all international operations from both cities got dowgraded to 757.

CLO will see a two-weekly 767 from June anyways...

Quoting A300AA (Reply 10):
By the way does anybody knows why AV again is operating its flight from CLO to MIA with a stop in BAQ?
And why they downgrade its MDE flight to a MD83?

Reminding old times... AV's CLO and MDE services to MIA where not usually nonstop; almost always via BAQ and CTG respectively.

The MDE-MIA route sees no change in schedules, only in equipment. CLO-MIA however, sees an unwanted one-hour stop in BAQ both ways, and a very late arrival to CLO.

Nevertheless, according to the airline's website, for the upcoming mid-year high-season the flights will go back to the normal schedule.



SOUTHAMERICA


User currently offline2travel2know From Panama, joined Apr 2005, 3580 posts, RR: 4
Reply 15, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 5 days ago) and read 2229 times:

Quoting Summa767 (Reply 6):
Continental owned Copa flies its 737s to Cali daily, and does not seem to have a problem

Continental only owns 49% of CM, does it mean CM is Continental owned? NO, I don't think so.
Why is this thing with CM? I'm sure if CO only owned 10% of CM people still will be reffering to CM as "Continental owned Copa".

Before CM decided to ally themseves with CO instead of AA, CO flew from IAH to both BAQ and CLO via SJO. The loadfactors for BAQ were horrendous and they quickly pulled-out of BAQ, it took them just a little bit longer to leave CLO.
Why CO to CLO and BAQ didn't worked out?
I guess because they were flying from IAH and not EWR, plus it seems they didn't have SJO > CLO, BAQ traffic rights.
I would think a EWR > CLO will do better than a IAH > CLO-



I don't work for COPA Airlines!
User currently offlineMGA From Nicaragua, joined Mar 2005, 726 posts, RR: 3
Reply 16, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 2170 times:

Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 15):
Continental only owns 49% of CM, does it mean CM is Continental owned? NO, I don't think so.
Why is this thing with CM? I'm sure if CO only owned 10% of CM people still will be reffering to CM as "Continental owned Copa".

I think CM still calls some of its own shots but lets be realistick here... the CopaNENTAL planes are almost Identical to the CO planes... Same solors, all boeing, almost same logo.... come on, we have to admit that CM is CO's puppet... And trust me, I dont mean it in a bad way... I think CM is an excellent airline an CO's purchase of 49% was for the best.

Anyways.... Does CO codeshare with CM on the PTY-CLO route? I think that jetway excuse is bull... Havent they ever heard of stairs!!??  Wink

MGA



Que viva el guaro, el dinero y los aviones!!!
User currently offlineA300AA From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 394 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 2148 times:

Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 15):
I would think a EWR > CLO will do better than a IAH > CLO-

I completly agree, most of the traffic goes to the east coast.


User currently offline2travel2know From Panama, joined Apr 2005, 3580 posts, RR: 4
Reply 18, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 2119 times:

Quoting MGA (Reply 16):
I think CM still calls some of its own shots but lets be realistick here... the CopaNENTAL planes are almost Identical to the CO planes... Same solors, all boeing, almost same logo.... come on, we have to admit that CM is CO's puppet... And trust me, I dont mean it in a bad way... I think CM is an excellent airline an CO's purchase of 49% was for the best.

I'm a strong beliver that when COPA sold 49% of their shares to CO they wanted so bad to change that COmpañia Panameña de Aviación regional-airline image that they've had for decades to a new "continental-airline" - and I mean continental for the American Continent (The Americas) as oposite to regional (Centralamerica + Caribbean). But they just went too far with that logo! Sometimes you just can't tell the difference between a CO and a CM plane.
As how much of a CO puppet they're I really can't say, they refused to fly to EWR and choose JFK with lovely - being cynical here - daily 0100 arrivals and 0500 departures (one hour later summertime). If they were to fly to Houston they would then choose HOU if that airport had a US Federal Inspection Facility.



I don't work for COPA Airlines!
User currently offlineMGA From Nicaragua, joined Mar 2005, 726 posts, RR: 3
Reply 19, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 2103 times:

Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 18):
I'm a strong beliver that when COPA sold 49% of their shares to CO they wanted so bad to change that COmpañia Panameña de Aviación regional-airline image that they've had for decades to a new "continental-airline" - and I mean continental for the American Continent (The Americas) as oposite to regional (Centralamerica + Caribbean). But they just went too far with that logo! Sometimes you just can't tell the difference between a CO and a CM plane.

I agree. CM is Very strong now and has changed its image to a high class international airline.

Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 18):
As how much of a CO puppet they're I really can't say, they refused to fly to EWR and choose JFK with lovely - being cynical here - daily 0100 arrivals and 0500 departures (one hour later summertime). If they were to fly to Houston they would then choose HOU if that airport had a US Federal Inspection Facility.

That did show balls... They chose JFK because of the latino population in Queens, harlem, brooklyn etc (at least I think) Maybe even CO knew that there was no O&D to EWR. About that Hobby comment, thats funny stuff!

MGA



Que viva el guaro, el dinero y los aviones!!!
User currently offline2travel2know From Panama, joined Apr 2005, 3580 posts, RR: 4
Reply 20, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 2091 times:

Quoting MGA (Reply 19):
That did show balls... They chose JFK because of the latino population in Queens, harlem, brooklyn etc (at least I think) Maybe even CO knew that there was no O&D to EWR.

The largest panamanian community in the USA is in Brooklyn (be advised - most of them shouldn't be called latino but caribbean), add to that the colombians in Queens and ecuadorians in that area that preffer to depart before-the-crack-of-dawn to be able to travel daytime from GYE to Cuenca by road.



I don't work for COPA Airlines!
User currently offline102IAHexpress From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 1156 posts, RR: 3
Reply 21, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 2054 times:

COs delay into Cali is suspect. I hope it’s just a delay, and won’t go on hiatus like EWR-LOS. Personally I have always looked forward to a possible Houston to Cali non-stop flight. Cali is the city of my birth and Houston is my home.

Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 15):
I would think a EWR > CLO will do better than a IAH > CLO-

As far as EWR to CLO doing better than IAH to CLO, I’m not sure that’s the case. IAH has done a good job of positioning itself as a Latin American gateway. It’s definitely an attractive alternative to MIA. With CLO to IAH service, customers have better access to the East and West Coast. Los Angeles in particular has a large Colombian population. Houston also has a Colombian presence.
In the short term, COs aircraft fleet is stretched pretty thin, so I doubt a EWR to CLO plan will happen anytime soon. In the long term, CO will have allocated more aircraft, so I don’t see why they wouldn’t add a EWR to CLO flight. But this is all speculation on my part.


User currently offline2travel2know From Panama, joined Apr 2005, 3580 posts, RR: 4
Reply 22, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 2044 times:

Quoting 102IAHexpress (Reply 21):
COs delay into Cali is suspect. I hope it’s just a delay, and won’t go on hiatus like EWR-LOS. Personally I have always looked forward to a possible Houston to Cali non-stop flight. Cali is the city of my birth and Houston is my home.

10 years ago when CO 1st flew to CLO sure there weren't that many colombians in IAH. They started the service and failed. Maybe the colombian demographics in the states have changed and now it's very attractive to fly between western/mid USA and Cali.



I don't work for COPA Airlines!
User currently offlineSOUTHAMERICA From Colombia, joined Dec 2003, 2497 posts, RR: 10
Reply 23, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 2039 times:

Quoting MGA (Reply 16):
Does CO codeshare with CM on the PTY-CLO route?

No.




Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 15):
I would think a EWR > CLO will do better than a IAH > CLO-

EWR-CLO would be an interesting option, though I believe O&D would tend to use JFK instead, as CM's case in the New York area.

It is fair to remember that AV has been operating the CLO-JFK route [1-stop service] for a while now; case that would be worth considering if a second player in the same market wishes to enter.




SOUTHAMERICA


User currently offlineTACAA320 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 1988 times:

Quoting MGA (Reply 16):
I think CM still calls some of its own shots but lets be realistick here... the CopaNENTAL planes are almost Identical to the CO planes... Same solors, all boeing, almost same logo.... come on, we have to admit that CM is CO's puppet... And trust me, I dont mean it in a bad way...

Absolutely true.

49% of the shareholders, with the other 51% disseminated in others hands, allows CO to do everything they want over CM. Even in the most basic Commerce Law class you learn that.

You can't hide the sun with one finger.


25 2travel2know : If you knew more about Panamanians and COPA, you would know that the 51% which you think is disseminated among other hands DO follow whatever is the
26 COfaninBOS : I don't think you can compare a planned non-stop service on CO today with a one-stop via a Central American city several years ago. For one thing, the
27 Post contains images MGA : Why dont you just say it!! You cant hide the CO logo on the CM planes with one finger!!! MGA
28 TACAA320 : I did it. And then, what? Just if you want it, lets us know those figures when you know them. And I still believe that CO is the major single CM's st
29 MAH4546 : It is still nothing significant. More cities, but at about half the frequency of AA. This past winter timetable, AA had almost as many daily flights
30 COfaninBOS : Viasa used to fly IAH-Maracaibo twice a week. First with AB3s and then 727s I believe. While the Venezuelan and Colombian communities can't hold a can
31 MAH4546 : I'm not debating the growth, it is definitley there. Though outside of Mexico, it is limited in the future. Continental's attempted forrays into non-
32 2travel2know : Yes, that's a true. Still CO doesn't know the territory as well as the panamanian owners. An interesting question, Why wasn't TA worth having its sto
33 TACAA320 : Dude, your're confusing oranges and apples. As long as I know, Taca is not selling shares to AA nor AA is buying some percentage of them at this time
34 RCS763AV : All I say is that its gonna be a tough job. AV and AA already offer flights to MIA and JFK, with a lot of capacity plus connecting opportunities in MD
35 2travel2know : Sorry things about CM ownership had to be discussed here. DO people in CLO and surrounding cities like to connect in MDE, BOG or PTY? I don't think so
36 MAH4546 : Taca and American are not allowed to codeshare on flights from Miami. They fly DFW-BZE, DFW-CCS, and JFK-SJO. The rest of your suggestions are, for t
37 SOUTHAMERICA : MDE could be a connecting point for CLO-inbound passengers, but only for some domestic flights; and they might as well connect in BOG where more flig
38 RCS763AV : BOG is not that bad, the media have been doing bad advertisement so the project goes faster. BOG has improved a lot. I frequent flyer from BOG who ha
39 2travel2know : I would actually agree that many of my suggestions are ridiculous now. About SJC: given the amount of salvadoreans in the bay area a SJC > SAL may no
40 RCS763AV : Why do you keep contradicting yourself???? Anyway, MAH4546, in what stage are the new DFW routes in?????
41 MGA : Would have to be SFO-SAL, Most Salvadorians in the bay area live in the mission/19-24th st area of San Francisco... Thar route is already served by T
42 2travel2know : I get my info from colombians that don't live in Bogotá, colombians that don't live in Bogotá who don't like to fly domestic to BOG to board intern
43 MAH4546 : DFW-PTY did terribly. The loads were weak and yields were not strong. DFW-BOG has been looked at. The biggest problem is that the Colombian governmen
44 Summa767 : MAH4546, The Colombian authorities have in the past been very protective, and inded restrictive of new route and frequencies. But things have moved on
45 Post contains images MGA : I'm gonna start a new thread about this.... really interesting. I dont want the columbians pissed off again about writing in their thread... MGA
46 Flyinfroggie : If only the crew at Newark knew the difference. I was horrified when I saw that flight 880 to Bogota Columbia was listed!
47 RCS763AV : Yes, Colombia is not only BOG, as Panama is not only PTY, and as Ecuador is not only GYE and UIO, but flights go to the big cities, where people take
48 TACAA320 : It's Colombians not ColUmbians. Just for the records.
49 SOUTHAMERICA : Having to go through customs in BOG is insignificant anyways after the horrendous experience of connecting through the airport itself. Having to walk
50 2travel2know : No doubt about it! But wait, what if that airline has the equipment to provide a reliable service aslo to the other 0.9million city togehter with its
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